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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: game tactics
Thread: game tactics This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
Conan
Conan


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted October 25, 2004 08:51 PM

game tactics

I have a few questions regarding the tactics of the game, a question of the tactic of purchasing creature dwellings at the begginning of the game and a Capitol later. As a side note, I only play on Impossible (200%).

1) When I decide to purchase creature dwellings at the beginning of the game, in the middle of week 2 I find that I am short on cash and having a hard time buying all my creatures in my town. What should I do to solve this?

2) I have played many times and I find that I sit in my castle alot because I'm scared that the computer will take over my capitol if my big hero leaves the town. I find I should leave my town and go conquer other towns faster. And when I do, I sit there with my big hero afraid to loose it again. What do you guys think about this? should the big hero go out and conquer as many castles as possible, taking a chance to loose our Capitol or our new-conquered towns?
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LordLazy
LordLazy


Promising
Famous Hero
Wood cleaner
posted October 26, 2004 09:22 AM

this is how it works: you fight some, get some dwellings, recruit only the creatures you need to take the map, fight more, do crypts, treasuries etc. the more you fight, the more resources you get, the more you can fight, the more army you have.. now, after buildup of all dwellings you should be close to capitol as well
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marien
marien

Tavern Dweller
posted October 27, 2004 06:03 PM

that's always what newbes do (and so do I...) in a game, and that's always what must never be done: staying in your base, no matter what game you're playing.

you must think that the ennemy is at the same point than you, he's not waiting in the shadow just behind your castle, ready to take it as soon as you leave, or has already legions and legions of archangels...

personnally, i take the time to make a good army (let's say creatures of 3 weeks, more or less), and then go invading all i can. during the time your best hero is away, train another (a second best), by defeating monsters here and there, or those who appear during special weeks...

but the more important is not to be afraid to loose your creatures at the VERY BEGINNING : recruit 2/3/4 heroes, some will stay near watermills and things like that, some will uncover the map and maybe some will follow the fighter, who will take ALL fights and ALL creatures the others have when they're recruited (is that clear ? ). Make him battle ASAP the fiends that protect the mines; if needed, make an advanced level dwelling (rocs in stronghold, or wyverns in fortress, for example), recruit 2/3 of them and go on. don't worry, in a few days, all dwellings will welcome new creatures...
Ressources are the base of every building, have at least one mine of every sort quickly.
water exploration is not to be forgotten too, and can give plenty of gold, wood and some artefacts (survivors (not long ago, one gave me a Lion's shield of courage... +4 in every carac... and this before the second week.)).

keep in mind that, on the contrary, when you're in your castle, the ennemy is conquering mines and towns and then one day he will destroy you, cause he's take too much advance.

be faster and more powerful than him...
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LordLazy
LordLazy


Promising
Famous Hero
Wood cleaner
posted October 27, 2004 11:14 PM

Quote:
personnally, i take the time to make a good army (let's say creatures of 3 weeks, more or less), and then go invading all i can. during the time your best hero is away, train another (a second best), by defeating monsters here and there, or those who appear during special weeks...
bah, Bull shiat , you will expand expand, chain chain chain chain expand fight fight fight fight chainchainchain expand more and more and more see other topics on chaining around on the forum (I'm to lazy or busy or what you would like to call it to find links for ya atm )

Quote:
but the more important is not to be afraid to loose your creatures at the VERY BEGINNING : recruit 2/3/4 heroes, some will stay near watermills and things like that, some will uncover the map and maybe some will follow the fighter, who will take ALL fights and ALL creatures the others have when they're recruited (is that clear ? ).


still, this is wrong too, number two hero, number three hero and number four hero in first week have several important tasks, they should chain army from hero to hero, fighting enemies around the main hero, which is to expensive to waste movement points on for main hero, also, and extremely important task for them is to make sure that on end of every day, your main have only THE FASTEST unit equipped, for longer movement next day, this is defined in Angelitos thread on log and pathfinding I think.

Else, important thing to note, I am not the right man to ask on tactics, because there is loooots of better players than me online, but remember that until you have tried this out online, and got some multiplayer experience, you still have lots to learn, only a very small amount of the players jumping from single player to online, have trained on the correct things, and therefore, most of them ends up with losing a quite large amount of the games online.


So, my advise is, play online register for a tournament, and learn new stuff you will soon realise theres lots of things to learn, and that you will learn every game in the beginning

THats all for now, hope I havent repeated myself here lol, Written in a hurry :/ good luck

Regards
LL
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lord_crusader
lord_crusader


Promising
Supreme Hero
UHU!! supreme!
posted October 28, 2004 12:37 AM

Don't be afraid of lose your towns just fight... and fight and fight, have towns, and towns and towns...
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Jebus
Jebus


Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
posted November 02, 2004 05:03 PM

I'm still having issues "chainning" productively...
I find that at 200%, you tend to not have enough money to buy the heroes you need to chain successfully...

question: when you play on line, what percentage is it usually???  (i'm sure this was asked in the past by Conan i think)
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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted November 02, 2004 05:29 PM

The most of my games have been played on 130%.
Sometimes i can see games played on 200%, to keep the first turns a bit short, coz one hero canīt chain his army that much...
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Jebus
Jebus


Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
posted November 02, 2004 05:42 PM

Quote:
The most of my games have been played on 130%.
Sometimes i can see games played on 200%, to keep the first turns a bit short, coz one hero canīt chain his army that much...


That would definitely explain the high production people refer to.  I couldn't understand how members were getting level 7's so early...  I know I'm a noob but holly s***, I thought I was doing something completely wrong.  Knowing that, I think it'll be alot less intimidating playing on line!!  

thanks again.
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kwahraps
kwahraps


Adventuring Hero
posted November 02, 2004 05:46 PM

>>>I'm still having issues "chainning" productively...

Chaining is not mandatory.  It is however, the most effective method to clearing your area, flagging mines, and crashing banks.  If you had 5 heroes and 1 weeks worth of troops, you might not be able to split up all your troops so that all your heroes can start clearing the board independently.  However, if you space your heroes out, 1 hero can take the entire army, free up a mine, then pass the army on to the next hero, who does the same.  Wash, rinse, spin, repeat.  Instead of taking 5 turns to clear an area with 1 hero and 1 weeks army, you can clear the area in 1 day with x number of heroes, using the same army.  This is also why you take gold from chests, so that you will have the money to purchase the troops and heroes.

>>>I find that at 200%, you tend to not have enough money to buy the heroes you need to chain successfully...

If you're playing 200%, I'm guessing you're playing against the computer.  You'll find that most online games are played at 130% or less, so that players can build up quickly and employ numerous heroes.  

If you could, please clarify if you are playing against the CPU, what maps (random? size?), and what exactly are you looking to get out of your game . . . that is, are you looking for long drawn out games with huge endfights or quick strategical games on small maps?

Myself, I don't have time to play online.  I opt for medium-sized random maps at 160% using Midnight's template.  Playing at 200% is fun and challenging, but too many times you may find yourself blocked, or lacking in resource piles to get a good start.  The computer needs all the help it can get, so I do not chain.  I limit myself to 2 heroes at the start, and 1 extra hero for every castle captured.  

Good luck.
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Jebus
Jebus


Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
posted November 02, 2004 06:01 PM

Kwahraps...
Thanks for your reply... It has been the most refressing and reassuring reply I've received.  (not knocking anyone else here..let me explain)

When members talk about their level of exp., I often assumed that they are playing at impossible and managing all these crazy accomplishments...  The way you express the strategie of "chaining" doesn't seem too different from what I've been doing (except passing the army from one hero to the next).  I think thanks to this type of reply I don't feel as inexperienced and seem to be on the right page.  The type of game you play sounds similar to mine....  I'm starting to look forward to paying online...

Thanks ....


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kwahraps
kwahraps


Adventuring Hero
posted November 02, 2004 06:19 PM

>>>The way you express the strategie of "chaining" doesn't seem too different from what I've been doing (except passing the army from one hero to the next).

I'm not sure I follow you here.  Chaining is all about passing an army to another hero.  When you get new troops, it's very nice to chain them to your main hero.  But, ask yourself, would you rather have one strong hero and your area cleared at the end of week 2 or would you rather have 5 medium-strength heroes and your area cleared at the end of week 1?

Again, it all comes back to speed.  When you play online, speed is of the essence.  Chaining is a tactic which allows you to get resources faster, to build up faster, to conquer faster.  

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Jebus
Jebus


Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
posted November 02, 2004 06:34 PM

Quote:
>>>I'm not sure I follow you here.  Chaining is all about passing an army to another .

Sorry for the lack of clarity in my last post...

I meant I tend to chain armies to my strongest hero (or second strongest depending) to build him up in order to fight larger stacks, take over towns and fight other heroes.  What I meant that I'm not doing is using that big hero, fighting, and then after he is out of movement chainning the army to another hero near by to fight another stack (on the same turn).  I tend to do it with the one guy to make sure he builds up in exp.

(does that explain what I said previously??  I know what I mean, I just want to make sure it's expressed clearly)


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Sir_Stiven
Sir_Stiven


Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
posted November 02, 2004 06:39 PM
Edited By: Sir_Stiven on 2 Nov 2004

since marien refers to himself as a n00b i will do the same, do not follow his advice.

200% is tricky, usually i never play that difficulty since it makes you very depending on the starting area you got, or starting areas if smaller blocks. If big starting area and rich you will be able to expand the same, if very rich lvl 7 units first days will be no problems with some castles while your opponent could get crap and basically be stuck for starters of the game.

Another bad thing about 200% is as kewapsi says that you get very dependant on resources, chaining gets to be more and more important. Kehapsi is wrong about one thing though, if you are to play random maps online (which most players do nowadays) the set difficulty is usually 130% or 160%.. 100% i would never concider even to play myself as it makes fighting units on map way to easy and is a tool to use boring tactics such as attacking topes with just a few hydras and fodder.

If you want chaining to be more explained there has been many written examples of it earlier. go check the history.

back to conans questions:

remember that even if youre not able to buy your units out at that time they are always availible later, usually when i play a random map i never buy out until end fight is getting near, as long as i can cope with the creatures on map i buy out enough creatures to kill em without any bigger losses.

the key to save money is to avoid any losses at all in beginning when you fight for resources, if you can deal with that you will need to spend no money on extra creatures.

the other question, having main hero in main castle is just stupid. Wait long enough and the opponent hero will be many levels above yours and you will die, and add to that that castle sitting is chicken style

Get your main out to raise stats and level up his 2ndary skills.. thats they key for a killing machine, nr of units doesnt matter alot if one hero has twice the others stats.

Off course getting a townportal spell is always nice, another way to protect your town is to scout the area around it so you will know with a few days notice when opponent is coming. Then keep a chain of units from maintown to main hero, and if opponent approaches...

give the units to the hero next to main, then let that hero transport the units to next hero with units and so on until you have reached your main castle.. then attack a stack on map with mainhero which you have a faster unit then unless you got tactics... that way you will get first move and you can retreat, buy your hero back and voila his back in main town with all his units... just make sure you got 2500 gold to rehire hero and make sure that you dont mess up so next week and new heroes arrives in tavern, because then your screwed

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Jebus
Jebus


Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
posted November 02, 2004 06:51 PM

Quote:
Off course getting a townportal spell is always nice, another way to protect your town is to scout the area around it so you will know with a few days notice when opponent is coming. Then keep a chain of units from maintown to main hero, and if opponent approaches...

give the units to the hero next to main, then let that hero transport the units to next hero with units and so on until you have reached your main castle.. then attack a stack on map with mainhero which you have a faster unit then unless you got tactics... that way you will get first move and you can retreat, buy your hero back and voila his back in main town with all his units... just make sure you got 2500 gold to rehire hero and make sure that you dont mess up so next week and new heroes arrives in tavern, because then your screwed


Nothing better than TP imo.....

2 questions though:
1)you mention that tactics allow you to go first??  Did I read that wrong??  Because if that's the case I need to rethink my opinion on tactics...
2) you say you don't buy out until endfight is near...  do you really save most armies in the town during this time???  And only buy them when the end is near??  I would've thought it better to have them on the big hero so you can catch him by surprise..  am I wrong?

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Sir_Stiven
Sir_Stiven


Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
posted November 02, 2004 07:10 PM

1) tactics allows you to move up in battle position and retreat.

2) yes, its very seldom you get taken by suprise at a map since you know the approx. size of the blocks.. and if you scout your way around you should be able to learn where your opponent possibly will come from, and that will give you a setup for a strategy what to do when he appears. Buying out all units you can makes no sense if you come across something that will cost you money. Because then youre all out cause you wasted it on some slow units that you never get to use in combat anyway so far... when clearing the big block to attack or when i get attacked i buy out.. but id rather have much extra gold to spend on whatever comes up than have a bigger army that does me no good.

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kwahraps
kwahraps


Adventuring Hero
posted November 02, 2004 07:25 PM

Stevie is mostly right.

Tactics will not let you move first, but it will allow you to position units to ensure you get a turn to move.  Worst case scenario, let's say you can only reach a pack of Archangels, in which you hope to retreat.  With 4 level 1 units and tactics, you box them in the corner and let the computer go.  The archangels wipe out the three surrounding units, and no other stack may reach your last remaining unit.  You retreat on your turn.

This become really tough if you are up against Titans.
Or dragons, with their 2-hex breath attack.

Best case scenario would probably be zounds of zombies.
Because they cannot get morale or cross the board in a single turn, a single unit is all you need in order to retreat.  

Good luck.


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Sir_Stiven
Sir_Stiven


Honorable
Legendary Hero
banned
posted November 02, 2004 07:56 PM

Quote:
Stevie is mostly right.

Tactics will not let you move first, but it will allow you to position units to ensure you get a turn to move.  Worst case scenario, let's say you can only reach a pack of Archangels, in which you hope to retreat.  With 4 level 1 units and tactics, you box them in the corner and let the computer go.  The archangels wipe out the three surrounding units, and no other stack may reach your last remaining unit.  You retreat on your turn.

This become really tough if you are up against Titans.
Or dragons, with their 2-hex breath attack.

Best case scenario would probably be zounds of zombies.
Because they cannot get morale or cross the board in a single turn, a single unit is all you need in order to retreat.  

Good luck.




Actually "Stevie" is 100% right and your a n00b.

If you got tactics skill you can retreat before tactics mode is over. No matter opponent units nor speed on them, if you got tactics just retreat during tactics set up.

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Conan
Conan


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted November 02, 2004 08:03 PM

Quote:
then attack a stack on map with mainhero which you have a faster unit then unless you got tactics... that way you will get first move and you can retreat, buy your hero back and voila his back in main town with all his units...


Jebus,
What he meant here was that if you have tactics, you can simply retreat (during the tactics phase) to buy back in Castle.
The way to read it would be:
"then attack a stack on map with mainhero which you have a faster unit that way you will get first move and you can retreat. Unless you got tactics, because then the speed of you unit is not an issue, you can just retreat on your tactics phase."
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Jebus
Jebus


Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
posted November 02, 2004 08:04 PM

Sir_Stiven and kwahraps
thanks for the info....

it's always appreciated.




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Conan
Conan


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted November 02, 2004 08:05 PM

Stiven, you beat me to it!!!
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