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| Thread: Dragon Utopian Alignment |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 · NEXT» |
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 06, 2004 02:10 AM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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Dragon Utopian Alignment
This thread shall be the place to post any dragon picture you can find that you think ought to be in Heroes5 or any other Heroes game. This may not be a forum for Dungeons and Dragons but seriously, who here doesn't like dragons? I looked at the "dragon town" thread and the "neutral monsters" thread and I feel very strongly that dragons don't fit into either of those categories.
First of all, dragons are their own unique selves with an appearance and personality that set them apart from any other creature in the game. A dragon should be thought of in two ways:
A. Fear them
B. Love them
There is no other approach that could reasonably and respectfully show dragons for what they truly are, unique. Dragons don't belong in a dragon town town because they do their own thing. Seriously, who is going try taming a dragon and then put a saddle on it? Anne Mcaffrey? Dragons do whatever they want.
I imagine that, since they are so powerful, they might be thought of as gods in some places. There, you could clearly see their arrogance surfacing while delighting in demanding hommage as a deity. I think it should be a utopian society where they "think" they are god's greatest gift to the earth and in some cases they most likely believe they are god themselves.
So how do I think dragons should be portrayed in Heroes5? I think they should be categorized as a pseudo-utopian race of arrogance and eloquence; beautiful, yet deadly; magnificent, yet terrible; unique and most certainly rude with a personality all their own. In light of this I believe that dragons should be found wherever their fancy takes them according to each their own personality. For example: if an evil red dragon, that has a dominating personality, wants to go somewhere that it can rule in terror then perhaps it might be found somewhere that is most suited for that goal.
I think dragons in Heroes5 should have a native terrain, however, I believe their native terrain should be associated with the precious resource that is required to generate them. For example: in the volcanic wasteland, native to Inferno towns, I think it should be rich in mercury. I think, on that terrain, any dragon that requires mercury for its generation should have the terrain bonus there.
I think we need more dragons than the few we have currently. Here's some dragon pics to give food for thought in thinking of new possible dragon additions for Heroes5:
How's about I start off the thread with some non-traditional dragon types for discussion? Perhaps the idea of adding some new precious resources to Heroes5 is attractive to some new dragons?
An Emerald dragon:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_38.jpg
An Amethyst dragon
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_36.jpg
A fiery-type dragon:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_69.jpg
Maybe a dragon suited for a lake of fire? Perhaps this dragon would seek mercury to fuel its flames.
A Topaz dragon:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_40.jpg
A Saphire dragon:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_39.jpg
And last but not least run if you see this dragon. I think it's called a Fang dragon but your guess is as good as mine as to what precious resource it might need for production. Maybe human sacrifice?
http://www.wizards.com/leaving.asp?url=dnd/images/mof_gallery/monfaepg42.jpg&origi=dnd_ag_200
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Roses Are Red And So Am I
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Styq
Known Hero
Grandmaster Leadership
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posted February 06, 2004 01:18 PM |
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Edited By: Styq on 7 Feb 2004
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I'm too lazy to go and find Dragon pics.
But here's a list of Dragons I'd like to see in H5:
Red Dragon - Evil and savage. Popular to be slayn.
Demon Dragon - Evil and diabolic. Dragon of the Devil.
Fire Dragon (Phoenix-like) - Born and gives birth out-of and to fire. Neutral.
Black Dragon - Evil and huge. May oftenly ally with other creatures to do wicked stuff.
Azure Dragon - Neutral and rare. Lives in very high places, and is second in strength to the Dragon Queen.
Bronze Dragon - Good, lives in valleys
Silver Dragon - Good, lives in valleys
Gold Dragon - Good, lives in valleys
Saphire Dragon - Good, commonly an enemy of the Earth Dragon.
Crystal Dragon - Neutral walker, found in caves and tunnels.
Diamond Dragon - Neutral walker, has no fire breathe.
Swamp Dragon - Neutral. Spits acid, poisonous attck.
Rust Dragon - Neutral, has poisonous attck. Found in abandoned humand structures.
Shadow Dragon - Evil, shadowy and destructive.
Faerie Dragon - Good-Neutral, casts spells.
Thunder Dragon - Has lightning attacks. Born and healed at storms.
Aqua-Atlantian Dragon - No wings. Has flippers. Good.
Golem Dragon - Good humand machine. Weak.
Dragon-Man - Evil human-dragon. Lives in colonies.
Earth-Cave Dragon - Neutral cave dweller. Enemy of the Saphire Dragon.
Horned Dragon - Neutral predetorious dragon. Lives on raiding human farms and villages.
Four-Headed Dragon - Being one beast, this is the rarest of all Dragons.
Armored Dragon - It is unknown how this dragon gets it's steel armor, but it is very hard to slay.
Dragon Queen - The strongest of all Dragons. Second in rareness to the Four-Headed dragon.
Dragon Rider - Poor dragon. Freakin' Lizzardfolk ride em'.
Tusked Dragon - Weakest of all dragons. Effective against low lvl monster.
Skeletal Dragon - The undead dragon.
Ghost Dragon - The undeader dragon.
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Leadership is nothing but being a good actor,
just like bravery is nothing but being a fool
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Svarog
Honorable
Supreme Hero
statue-loving necrophiliac
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posted February 06, 2004 03:59 PM |
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Oh, great idea, Styg.
Listen what I was thinking. There are 110 chemical elements, right. We'll have one dragon for each of these elements. But then, what about water dragon?
Correction: Let's have a dragon for each element and for each of the basic compounds.
There are still few dragons missing. E.g. Dragon houswife, dragon baby, dragon President, Dragon VicePresident, what else... Ah, yes. Osama Dragon, Dragon Tank, and certainly Bazooka Dragon.
If anyone remembers any more dragons feel free to add.
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The meek shall inherit the earth, but NOT its mineral rights.
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 07, 2004 01:24 AM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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This Should Help With Visualizing
Styg,
I think I understand what Svarog is trying to say. By posting the names, only, of your dragons then it leaves the reader with no description or idea, if you will, of what your kinds of dragons look like or how they behave. If you look around you'll notice that dragons are thought of in many different ways to many different people. Your idea of a red dragon might be completely different from someone else's idea of a red dragon.
If I may be so bold as to offer a suggestion to you Styg:
Edit your post that you made with the list of those names. It's ok if you don't want to post any pictures. Try writing down a description(can be long or short) of what you think the name of each dragon means to you personally. That would not only help the rest of us understand your vision but it would also contribute greatly to the well-seasoned dragon fans that might read your post. In a word, it would be inspiring to us(myself in particular) to hear your particular views on how dragons should be portrayed in the world of Heroes of Might and Magic. Because this subject has such a high possibility for variation I feel that the more opinions we have coming from different sources then the more enjoyable it can become. Perhaps a collage is the best analogy.
Alternative Water Dragons
As for myself I would like to continue my headstrong opinion towards dragons that make their own rules. I say again, with such beauty, power, and personality how can we even begin to think they belong in a town of ordered, tamed, docile, and muzzled existence?
Here is a water dragon:
http://www.wizards.com/leaving.asp?url=/dnd/images/draco_gallery/75554.jpg&origin=dnd_ag_200311
And here is another:
http://www.wizards.com/leaving.asp?url=/dnd/images/draco_gallery/75604.jpg&origin=dnd_ag_200311
And finally the last water dragon I could find:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mm2_gallery/88268_620_154.jpg
Once again by looking at these pictures I feel very strongly that the dragons of Heroes and Might Magic should occupy their own special alignment. I feel their alignment should not be neutral or good or evil unless the dragon itself has chosen this by way of its own personality.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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Dingo
Responsible
Legendary Hero
God of Dark SPAM
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posted February 07, 2004 01:28 AM |
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Nice Pics Consis.
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The Above Post/Thread/Idea Is CopyRighted by, The Dingo Corp.
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Svarog
Honorable
Supreme Hero
statue-loving necrophiliac
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posted February 07, 2004 01:46 AM |
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Yes, very nice pics, Consis.
I don't think that there should be a Dragon Town, though I do agree it's sad to see dragons tamed in an army. 
The homm3 number of dragons (without the expansions) was just enough, I think.
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The meek shall inherit the earth, but NOT its mineral rights.
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 07, 2004 03:15 AM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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Xenophanes
Promising
Famous Hero
Chief Consul to Queen Mutare
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posted February 07, 2004 05:30 PM |
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Quote:
The homm3 number of dragons (without the expansions) was just enough, I think.
I read this meaning in your earlier post, whether or not that was its true intention. Much as I love Dragons (and, of course, any of the older members can testify to that), I disagree terribly with the D&D style of as many Dragons as you can think up "domains" for.
Too many Dragons simply leads to redundancy. The final Dragon count after the AB expansion, not counting un-upgraded versions, is pretty much the workable limit that I see for Heroes V.
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<Dragons rule, Titans drool!>
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 07, 2004 07:50 PM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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Dingo
Responsible
Legendary Hero
God of Dark SPAM
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posted February 07, 2004 08:24 PM |
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I hope I don't see any Spider Dragons in any games. Those guys look wierd.
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The Above Post/Thread/Idea Is CopyRighted by, The Dingo Corp.
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 07, 2004 09:04 PM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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gerdash
Responsible
Famous Hero
from the Animated Peace
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posted February 08, 2004 05:07 AM |
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i think consis has a point.
if you cannot breed dragons in a town anymore, then you can put some dragon somewhere on the adventure map. there aren't all types of dragons on one map. which type of dragon(s) you get or if you get any dragons at all depends on luck, at least if you use a random map generator.
e.g. you find out that you have one dragon cave on your map, guarded by some frost dragons. you find no other types of dragons on the map. some troops might be better than others against frost dragons, if you wanted to bring some minor strategy into it.
all the dragons might be somewhat difficult to draw and animate well, though. it probably doesn't pay off to do so many types of them unless dragon personalization becomes a high priority.
and how many reasonable dragons could you think of? i must say i don't like those zombie, mummy, litch, emerald, amethyst, chromatic, etc.
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but then again, why should angels, titans, devils, phoenixes, etc let themselves be ordered around by humans. maybe the humans should use prayer, worship and sacrifice type of things to get aid from those creatures?
i guess now we get back to where it started. the dragons are offered some treasure in exchange for having some fun on the battlefield.
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 08, 2004 07:17 AM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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Styq
Known Hero
Grandmaster Leadership
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posted February 08, 2004 03:06 PM |
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That's the D&D White Dragon!
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Leadership is nothing but being a good actor,
just like bravery is nothing but being a fool
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 08, 2004 08:08 PM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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The Difference Between D&D and Heroes Dragons
You have a keen eye Styg. The White Dragons are pics from Dungeons and Dragons. I would like to point out that there are many other pics from there that I chose not to display. I not only feel that Heroes fans are loyal but I also feel that the fans of Heroes don't want too much role-playing in their game. I also feel that some D&D creatures conflict with some Heroes creatures. For example here is the most notable dragon confliction:
http://www.wizards.com/leaving.asp?url=/dnd/images/mhbk_gallery/76936_cn.jpg&origin=dnd_ag_2003
And another of the same monster they call Tiamat:
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/dd_gallery/dd1/tiamat_p93.jpg
After looking at these pictures you can clearly see that the concept of a many headed dragon conflicts with the Heroes idea of a Hydra. It would seem to me that Heroes is already striving to create it's own niche in the fantasy world, and I don't think it needs the added confusion of a multi-headed dragon. By adding a concept like this I believe it would only cause people to say, "That's from D&D, they stole the idea". They might also say, "What is this junk? What happened to the hydra? I liked the Hydra!" I'm not going to link or post any pics that I feel are in clear contradiction or of a conflicting nature to the Heroes-type creatures. Most of these pics are from the D&D gallery but I also feel they could inspire some much needed changes in Heroes games that would only improve our gaming experience.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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Styq
Known Hero
Grandmaster Leadership
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posted February 08, 2004 08:41 PM |
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I like multi-headed dragons, like in WoG
It doesn't bother the Hydra if Ubisoft won't make the Hydra suck. In H3-4 the only thing that made the Hydra special and "good" was it's attack. It should have high HP regeneration, it should be fast, and it should have endless retaliations. Then the multi-headed dragon would be fine.
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Leadership is nothing but being a good actor,
just like bravery is nothing but being a fool
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 09, 2004 08:09 PM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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regnus_khan
Responsible
Supreme Hero
[ Peacekeeper of Equilibris ]
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posted February 09, 2004 08:19 PM |
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Consis,
you're the man! You post awesome posts and pics, but I think that there is lil' prob here:
My (and some of the other's) CPU can't download many pics so fast. I suggest that maybe you could write the website or smth else just to show where to find them. Cheers 
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted February 10, 2004 04:13 AM |
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Edited By: Consis on 20 Mar 2005
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Elemental Dragons?
Quote:
My (and some of the other's) CPU can't download many pics so fast. I suggest that maybe you could write the website or smth else just to show where to find them.
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Regnus_Khan,
I'm sorry if this thread might be a real drag on your computer and possibly others. If you want to know where I get these pics such as a link the answer is very simple. Use your mouse and "right-click" any picture that you like. When you do it will tell you where the picture is linked from  But if you want me to tell you then place to go is called: www.wizards.com
I must warn you though, they have WAAAAAY more pictures than this thread does. it might be even longer of a wait if your computer has a problem with this thread alone.
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I would like to pitch an idea to Heroes fans. What would you guys think about elemental dragons? Here are some pics to stimulate your imaginations:
Here's an interesting take on some Elemental Earthen Dragons:
http://www.wizards.com/leaving.asp?url=/dnd/images/draco_gallery/75636.jpg&origin=dnd_ag_200311
Here's an interesting Elemental Air Dragon:
http://www.wizards.com/leaving.asp?url=/dnd/images/draco_gallery/75649.jpg&origin=dnd_ag_200311
This could possibly be an Elemental Wind Dragon(Falco eat your heart):
http://www.wizards.com/leaving.asp?url=/dnd/images/mhbk_gallery/76928_cn.jpg&origin=dnd_ag_2003
And last but not least I saw a thread somewhere in this forum asking that some troops(other than the Heroe) should be allowed to summon their own lesser creatures. I read something about Magi but it sounded like a pretty weak argument. Tell me what you guys think about a dragon being allowed to summon elementals. Let's see if this pic inspires your imaginations:
http://www.wizards.com/leaving.asp?url=/dnd/images/draco_gallery/75591.jpg&origin=dnd_ag_200311
In closing I just want to say that these are simply ideas and nobody has made any suggestions on how these pics might be applied in any way.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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Styq
Known Hero
Grandmaster Leadership
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posted February 10, 2004 05:51 AM |
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Consis, I think you should just post all your D&D dragons (which look good) once and for-all.
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Leadership is nothing but being a good actor,
just like bravery is nothing but being a fool
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