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Heroes Community > Heroes 7+ Altar of Wishes > Thread: Arm Your battle Stations!
Thread: Arm Your battle Stations! This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 17, 2001 08:48 AM

Arm Your battle Stations!

I would like to be able to place the shooters of my choice in the Battle Towers to protect my town.

Lets say-
300 Master Gremlins in the top tower
100 Evil Eyes in the middle tower
200 Marksmen in the bottom tower

And the next time I pass through town I take the 300 Master Gremlins with me and replace them with 15 Titans.

The towers would absorb the first 20 points of damage against the Shooters. The tower starts with its own hit point value of 500, but it can be upgraded in town.
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Gravdragon
Gravdragon


Known Hero
Barbarian
posted July 17, 2001 07:33 PM

So when a tower is blown away, the 15 titans joins it?
It isnt a good idea I think. If a hero has expert ballistics and shoots at a tower with 100 marksmen in it, he kills them in one blow. Even if the towers where able to be upgraded it wouldnt weigh up to the fact that you can loose 15 or more titans just because they are sitting in the tower.
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angelspit
angelspit


Famous Hero
Warrior of the Heavens
posted July 17, 2001 08:23 PM

Good point. That wish needs some more work. What if only a given amount of lower-level shooters (i.e. archers or gogs) could be assigned to tower duty? If the tower is destroyed, so are the lower-level troops. But that does not add much to the game that way either...
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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 17, 2001 10:04 PM

I do believe the idea need some work.

The tower absorbs the first 20 points of damage, before the shooters take on any damage, but the tower does not take on damage until the shooters are knocked out.

One of the upgrades could be a Healing Canopy (tent) on top of the tower.  
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Still
Still


Famous Hero
Your Ultimate Slayer
posted July 18, 2001 12:44 AM

Who knows!

Maybe sooner or later versions of HOMM will have it!

That would rock for the Wizards coz they have the best shooters around!
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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 18, 2001 02:09 AM

I do believe the idea need some work.

One of the upgrades to the tower could be a Metal Skirt that goes around the tower. This could defect 10 more points from the Shooters and add 300 more points to the Towers hit points.
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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 19, 2001 05:27 AM

More ideas

Another Tower upgrade can be Hot Oil Cauldrons. They can be trigger by the enemy troops advancing to the castle wall. The Hot Oil would cause damage as a fire attack.
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Death
Death


Known Hero
LEGEND OF HELL
posted July 20, 2001 01:59 PM

cool

Or another tower upgrate can be mines!!!
Thay would be under the earth and when a bad creature comes on it it explodes and do 300 damage!!!
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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 21, 2001 12:23 AM

Quote:
Or another tower upgrate can be mines!!!
Thay would be under the earth and when a bad creature comes on it it explodes and do 300 damage!!!


Being able to research different defense systems from the other Castle themes, like the mines outside the Academe castle walls or others like moats ( plus crocodiles for the moats ), barriers, pit traps, .... etc. Would be really cool.

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LordPaul
LordPaul


Promising
Famous Hero
Crazy Bat Guy.
posted July 21, 2001 12:24 AM

Uh...... don't the Towers already have mines?  Nevermind.

This idea is flawed because you can already do this.  Just simply leaving 20 Titans in the town is the same thing.  The opponents take a while to get to them, so they are basically protected.  Having them in the tower where no one can touch them would make siege attacks way to hard.  If the enemy can hurt them in the tower, then it is no different then simply having them behind your walls.  The parapets are fine the way they are.

Still, this is a much better thread than most of the ones I have seen recently.


I would like to see sappers in the game that dig underneath the walls.  Maybe the Troglodytes can have that as there special.

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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 21, 2001 03:01 AM

Quote:
Uh...... don't the Towers already have mines?  Nevermind.


The Academe Castle is referred to as the Towers, but other castle battle towers should not be denied the land mines if they can be researched in the blacksmiths shop.


Quote:
This idea is flawed because you can already do this.  Just simply leaving 20 Titans in the town is the same thing.  ......


Not exactly the same:

* If you have your Shooters in the tower they are not wither Hero. deciding whether or not to build your defenses in the castle is on your head. I would rather take my Titan with me and not use them to defend the tower. If my opponent(s) should decide to go all out and defend a castle with his best Shooters then I am in for a battle. I like to have a challenge.

* Have the extra protection of the tower absorbing some of the blow make it more secure than the open courtyard of the castle.


Quote:
Still, this is a much better thread than most of the ones I have seen recently.


Thanks :-)


Quote:
I would like to see sappers in the game that dig underneath the walls.  Maybe the Troglodytes can have that as there special.


How about an upgrade to the castle walls that extend down to stop the Troglodytes.
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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 23, 2001 04:28 PM

How about being able to build two or four more towers? They could take a week to build and if you where attacked wail they where being built you would have to start all over.
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Zune
Zune


Adventuring Hero
of Tatalia
posted July 23, 2001 05:24 PM

Tower upgrades seems cool! Here is another idea:

After a siege, the walls are automatically repaired. Maybe it should take some time to repair the walls. Maybe it could cost you some wood and ore.

There could also be a tower upgrade repairing the walls instantly after a siege.

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Slava14
Slava14


Promising
Famous Hero
I am 16 now....
posted July 23, 2001 05:28 PM

 Maybe there should units that can climb (or fly) and attack the Shooters that are standing there (there should be additional space for them .
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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 24, 2001 04:29 AM

Quote:
After a siege, the walls are automatically repaired. Maybe it should take some time to repair the walls. Maybe it could cost you some wood and ore.

There could also be a tower upgrade repairing the walls instantly after a siege.


I agree it should take time to repair after a siege.

10% a day repaired unless you do the repairs during your turn.
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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 24, 2001 04:35 AM

Quote:
 Maybe there should units that can climb (or fly) and attack the Shooters that are standing there (there should be additional space for them .

Would there be a separate battle like when you attack a ship. This tower battle would take place then continue
with the castle siege.
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Sha_Men
Sha_Men


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
posted July 24, 2001 09:05 AM

No separate battles please...

It would make a single battle too complicated.

I think arrow towers shouldn't be customizable before there is an effiecient way to make flyers to attack them. Also other ranged units could target these towers but the ranged units in the tower would have an edge compared the ones on the ground.
There could be some sort of restrictement how many of units from levels there are allowed put into towers. I think maybe Titans shouldn't be allowed put in anyway.

There are many things that could be added to sieges but they are hard to be done with heroes engine. However battering rams could work even now but how example siege towers could?

I feel that there should be more defensive structures in the towns so sieges would be hard. Battlestations could be the first this kind of defensive structure implented but not before they can be attacked by flying creatures.
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Paradigm
Paradigm


Adventuring Hero
posted July 24, 2001 10:20 AM

Quote:
It would make a single battle too complicated.

Current siege battles are not complicated. They only take a little longer than standard battle field squabbles.

Quote:
I think arrow towers shouldn't be customizable before there is an effiecient way to make flyers to attack them.

I agree that flying units and the climbing unit (mentioned above) should be able to have special attacks. The more that is added to the siege the better.

Quote:
......There could be some sort of restrictement how many of units from levels there are allowed put into towers. I think maybe Titans shouldn't be allowed put in anyway.

I do not agree. We can not start restricting witch unit can be in this tower or with this hero or this group cant be in the same army as that group. It would be maddening.
Plus Titans are the best Shooters  

Quote:
There are many things that could be added to sieges but they are hard to be done with heroes engine. However battering rams could work even now but how example siege towers could?

What are these limitations? Animations to flying creatures land on the tower?? Shooters aiming down???

I think battering rams are great as well as reinforced gates?

Quote:
I feel that there should be more defensive structures in the towns so sieges would be hard. Battlestations could be the first this kind of defensive structure implented but not before they can be attacked by flying creatures.

Lets Arm the Battle Stations and build the siege machines!
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Sha_Men
Sha_Men


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jack-Of-No-Trades
posted July 24, 2001 11:02 AM

Something to add...

First of all I meant with separate battles...
was that there shouldn't any separated attack to arrow towers like you (Paradr mentioned (boat example). Current siege battles I agree aren't too complicated.

Why cannot we start restricting? Come on, Titans are pretty big creatures. And why not normal ground units could be in towers? We could start putting some ground units into towers too so it would be harder to attack the ranged units.

And how siege towers would fit in? I mean can I put Titan into siege tower? Can there be more than one siege tower at a time? What's the overall use of siege tower anyway?
How could one attack siege tower? Would creature attack another creature inside the siege tower or siege tower in overall?

Someone said that Heroes isn't wargame. I partly disagreed and agreed. Basically if we had one element that's hard to put into heroes engine like siege battle. I mean there are so many details and different kind of siege engines that can be used that battles could pretty much be overcrowded and whole battle could last forever. Could attacker camp outside the main gate and wait some days there. Maybe the defender couldn't get any reinforcement and resources into the town to be used if there's siege camp outside...

I'm not against making sieges more variable and stuff like that, but also other things that add strategic depth into game should be there. Just read "Raize towns", "Wandering monsters" and "no hit'n'run in HoMM4" threads.

I personally feel there are so many things that could be added to the heroes but I can only say that I don't believe 3do will do this. They only add something so the game could be balanced in the way that gameplay is easy and fun.
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Shae_Trielle
Shae_Trielle


Honorable
Famous Hero
of Heroes
posted July 24, 2001 02:50 PM

Pretty complex...

LordPaul seems to have the essence of this strategy down to a nut (flawed), but that doesn't mean that it can't be improved in some way...

I personally would like to see a cauldron option, it was a great feature in Castles (long long ago in a galaxy far away, lol) and I reckon that as a common siege tactic, should be featured in Heroes.

I personally find the idea of towers to be rather complex and they are extremely powerful as it is (try an average of 120 points damage per round with a full 3 towers (30 points average damage multiplied by four shots). I think towers should be limited to three, but the defensive/offensive capabilities of these should be given some... player choice?

I also think that towers should be affected by spells. It would be great to be able to cast blind on a tower or stike the thing with a lighning bolt. It would add a new dimension to spellcasting/tactics (waste mana on the towers or not?).

A rebuild option would be fantastic too. Broken walls from one siege should be still there for the next one. Speaking of sieges, I would like to see FOOD as a resource (I know it's been done to death) but not to support the manufacturing of units, but to keep them alive during lengthy sieges. It could cost the attacker one point of morale for every day sieged and if the enemy doesn't have enough food (i.e. ten food units per day of siege) then they could lose troops randomly. A loss of all food in a garrison could also cost the defender morale...

A siege could also be the only way to make an enemy sally forth, because if they run out of food and start losing troops then they'd HAVE to attack. If this occurred it would effectively mean that the person laying siege would not have to contend with walls and tower units anymore and the battle would be fought on even ground!

There are many many more ways that the programmers could add to the whole siege thing, I sure hope they consider it, because at the moment, the only way to get through a castle is to have greater numbers and greater spellpower. A typical battle can last many many rounds and those towers have the ability to take out a LOT of troops in those rounds. I think there should be more options open for a simple 'attack castle' manoevre.

*smile*

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