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| Thread: Building a better world - please help with ideas | |
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted May 24, 2004 02:33 AM |
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Building a better world - please help with ideas
1 Building a better world
Everyone that has seen ”A Beautiful Mind” knows that John Nash showed that Adam Smith was wrong when claiming that the best result is reached when everyone does what’s best for himself. The best result is reached when everyone does what’s best for himself and for the group. That theory has been awarded with the Nobel Prize.
Couple this with Sun Tzu’s writings about how supreme excellence is not to beat the opponent in a fight, but to win without fighting at all. Many people who quote Sun Tzu have failed to understand it, but that is, in his own words, “Supreme Excellence”.
If we are to reach a state where everone does what is best for himself and for the group, our only enemy is fear and uncertainty. And if fear is the enemy, the antidote must surely be safety and trust. You can’t shake hands with a clenched fist, and the best way to defeat an enemy – is to make him into a friend.
Thus, I propose that we put our collective intelligence to work and come up with ideas to place structures into our world, that provide ways to help create a better world. (structures as in laws, systems, material items, feelings, and beliefs). I have sorted out 4 topics of structures. Please reply with one or several structures that you would like to see in a better world, and make sure to let us know under which headline it should be.
Good luck to us all! 
1.1 Structures that eliminate fear
1.2 Structures that provide safety & security
1.3 Structures that provide justice & fairness
1.4 Structures that provide freedom
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted May 24, 2004 03:26 AM |
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ill post more later, but heres a quick thought (im playing a video game sorry  )
if enough men on earth did what was best for themselves it would by default also be what is much much better for the entire world. If you think about the theory bjorn mentions it makes alot of sense.
Quote:
our only enemy is fear and uncertainty.
I had a dream, actualy a consious one (lol mlk).. that a potential heaven is like a neighborhood knowing that there is no fear. And total certainty that no one on the block has something against a race. Neighbors peacfully work things out, and laugh if they have trouble doing so 
Of course, theres a reason why this isnt possible on this earth (more than 1). This is because there will always be atleast one skeptikle person. In this case, your probably skepticle yourself, just like the one who will read after you.
If it was proven to each of you, that a vast majorit of humans were not skeptikle, then you would be a minority and see logical reason to have faith in our furutes.
(post left short, so more people will read it- although...)
-> Theres an economic thing too bjorn. 1.5. (economic security systems) But, if that were brought in here I fear it would become an argument between people speaking uncivily about errors in eachothers posts.
(im not perfect or always civil. I'm sorry but i try with observations I have, to be clear to people so firm in belife. Republicans are more than skepticle to democrats VV.. Your all wierdos man.. nm)
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Defreni
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted June 02, 2004 01:45 PM |
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if enough men on earth did what was best for themselves it would by default also be what is much much better for the entire world. If you think about the theory bjorn mentions it makes alot of sense.
Sorry, but thats not at all clear that a persons self interest is compatible to what is best for a group, or the world in this case.
If at all you want to have an argument that goes along the lines u write, you would need to have every individual given perfect information. Both about his own situation and about the world. This is highly unlikely, if not impossible.
The second problem about this, is the problem about free-riders. If everybody was paying their taxes and everybody had acces to the same amount of social services, it would actually be rational for me NOT to pay my taxes.
This is offcourse just the basic arguments against what you said. Theres alot more spin to it.
Regards
Defreni
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doomnezeu
Supreme Hero
Miaumiaumiau
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posted June 02, 2004 01:52 PM |
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1.5. Structures that provide pleasure & entertainment
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted June 02, 2004 08:56 PM |
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Defreni, if it was really everyones self interest to not pay taxes, then it would be a strange world.
Taxes actualy pay for the entire group. They buy things that you would not beable cover for yourself. If nearly everyone did what was best for themselves, then taxes would be lower unless it was best to pay more for good things. Alot of cost would be taken off because of no need for (only a few examples) alot of police, military ect. We wouldn't have smokers and alcoholics in this senario either but so many expenses would go down.
If I did what was best formyself I'm pretty sure it would involve neighbors aswell. If they did what was best aswell, then the neighborhood would be some type of earthly utopia. But as you said there is alot of spin to it all. I just belive that if a tribe did what was best for itself, and another neigboring trib did likewise, then I dont think they would be attakcing themselves. I think they would be working together. Which is something I am unfortunately not gonna see if the world keeps on its current course.
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Defreni
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted June 03, 2004 11:45 AM |
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Aloha Celfious.
The problem is not so much that it isnt a beautifull thought, that if everybody did what was in their best self-interest the world would be a better place. Its just not feasible.
And that was what I tried to point out. Youll need perfect information regarding your action if this sort aff thing should happen. Because if you have limited information you would have all sorts off situations where your own best self-interest is conflicting with your neighbours best self-interest.
And even if we did have perfect information regarding our own actions, there is still no guarantee that it would be the best for the world.
If you are interested in this kind off problems I can recommend John Rawles. A contract-theorist who operate with a "Veil of ignorance" to get a moral theory started at all.
Regards
Defreni
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