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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted December 16, 2008 07:09 PM |
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Sex COULD kill you. Do you know what the human body goes through when you have sex? Pupils dilate, arteries constrict, core temperature rises, heart races, blood pressure skyrockets, respiration becomes rapid and shallow, the brain fires bursts of electrical impulses from nowhere to nowhere, and secretions spit out of every gland, and the muscles tense and spasm like you're lifting three times your body weight. It's violent. It's ugly. And it's messy. And if God hadn't made it UNBELIEVABLY fun, the human race would have died out eons ago.
Doesn't sound so rational to me.
Kinda like WoW addicts... why do you blame them for not playing healthy eh? 
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Doomforge
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Retired Hero
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posted December 16, 2008 07:11 PM |
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But first sex is good. Unless you're a woman, ugh, the pain. Everything feels so powerful when you're young.
Also, if drugs and such weren't good first time, nobody would ever become addicted. Junkies say the first tries give the most powerful effects. Later on it's just routine.
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted December 16, 2008 07:12 PM |
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Technically, first smoke is also "good" because you feel more in the "Gang" or "inline" with others (whatever that means), but that's more psychological/mentally because you tell yourself that
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Doomforge
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posted December 16, 2008 07:14 PM |
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Not everyone is a conformist. Not everyone needs to feel trendy. Don't oversimplify stuff, mate 
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted December 16, 2008 07:17 PM |
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ok, don't judge me if I still doubt that you would WANT smoke if no one around you smoked.
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Doomforge
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posted December 16, 2008 07:51 PM |
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I wouldn't - and I don't drink alcohol or take drugs either  Don't forget I'm a abstainer weirdo.
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted December 16, 2008 10:26 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 22:32, 16 Dec 2008.
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Quote:
Do your arguments mean that you believe it is "of the devil?" I tried to ask you in an earlier post about your views but I guess no one looked back. lol...grrrr 
that would be as if I considered drugs (not the highly dangerous ones) "of the devil" but I don't think so. Although I think it has more to do with one's ability than to some "extra" entity (such as "devil").
Then again I do think it's bad, not in the sense that "OMG you're evil bastard!" but in the sense that it is... bad, just like drugs, although again I have to note (because people will then accuse me wrongly) that I am not speaking about those that make you extremely dependent junkies (such as heroin). Even though it is remarkable similar (i.e "it feels good" while having it), but it has no purpose what-so-ever other than maybe pleasure.
And I think that we, humans, have rational 'souls' (since we talk about God and Devil anyway, why not souls?), not just true to our instincts. Drugs also "change" our instincts -- it becomes instinct then to just crave for more, as addicts. That doesn't mean we should, and not in the first place. In fact, since it has no purpose what-so-ever,
I think when people say you have to suppress it, they mean something like "why quit smoking?". Not that quitting would be a bad thing, but the thing is that it doesn't happen (i.e quitting) if you don't smoke in the first place. You can't quit if you don't smoke, it's logically invalid. Likewise, you don't need to suppress your instincts, if you do not have them in the first place, or at least if they do NOT control your life.
It is easy to do, and harder the more you pull it off. Likewise, quitting smoking is easier to do when you have just started smoking than after 30 years. In fact if you do it right from the start, you won't even need to quit. I think quitting smoking is pretty rational -- first, you don't pollute the environment. Second, you don't buy cigarettes. Third, you are not an addict. And fourth, you can calm yourself rationally (if smoking calms you otherwise) rather than with pleasures and instincts.
Pleasures are for the weak minded. Notice that pleasure is not equal to joy or happiness. The latter is emotional. The first is instinctual. And of course, instincts aren't really a display of great minds, in fact it's quite the opposite.
Notice I mean, not have them in the first place! Suppressing them for someone who is used to them will be a lot harder -- just like quitting smoking after 30 years of activity. That's why probably most addicts think that everyone else has the same difficulties in quitting. Well they don't. It's virtually non-existent for them.
All it takes, is a bit of rational thought.
I think we lost all chivalrious attitudes, on average, anyway. What was once the great display of human values and respect, is now something taken lightly. People have lost nobility, we laugh at it, and instead they think that it's ok to "feed" the trolls.
But I always like to think of it like this: The more you feed your instincts, the more they take control over you. It is easy at first to control them, and of course develop a noble (or mental) being instead of a pleasure-driven animal (instead of emotionally). The more deep you feed the instincts, the harder it is to get out of their control. So it's only obvious that people who have done so for their entire lives think that it's difficult for everyone else to control their instincts, while it is not.
It's a lot harder to quit taking drugs after taking a lot of them, but it doesn't mean it's not worth it. However were you have been more wiser, you wouldn't have to go through that process at all, since you would have quit much more easily before. That's how it works.
So yeah I have absolutely no problems or difficulties in doing it (abstinence I mean), since I haven't even "feed" the instincts much. So naturally it's like I just had a smoke, and you had 3000. Guess which one of us is more likely to quit
I also like to compare it to getting "charmed" by someone, when he gives you pleasure but ultimately you know it's not very rational. That's kinda weak mindedness to be honest.
A human is worse than a beast, if the human has reason and chooses to be beastly. (analogy, for violence, but it's just about instincts anyway)
(the idea is that while the beast cannot choose to be different, a human that can choose but chooses the beast way is worse)
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mvassilev
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posted December 16, 2008 10:32 PM |
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TheDeath:
Quote:
so do drugs
Yes, but masturbation isn't going to ruin anyone's life.
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trust me, I'm not a 'saint' in the sense that I actually am that way because of that -- sometimes I was even a bit violent...
if you don't fall in the hole, you won't need to climb up when if want out.
Must... keep... statements... in context... Argh, I failed.
And I don't think that anyone masturbates because it's popular. In fact, it's rather the opposite.
Quote:
Pleasures are for the weak minded.
FAIL.
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted December 16, 2008 10:35 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Pleasures are for the weak minded.
FAIL.
Instincts aren't really the thing that classifies your mind are they? And when you 100% enjoy from them (rather than just having to live with them anyhow) it's called pleasure. This means you like your instincts, and more than your mind. So yeah it's weak minded, literally.
Then again, people who get charmed are also after instincts and "pleasure" but they are weak minded in every aspect.
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mvassilev
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posted December 16, 2008 11:16 PM |
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New things aren't always good. Old things aren't always bad. You act like "primitive" = "bad".
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Eccentric Opinion
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william
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
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posted December 16, 2008 11:22 PM |
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Edited by william at 23:23, 16 Dec 2008.
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Quote:
Pleasures are for the weak minded.
FAIL.
LOL. Priceless. 
Anyway, there isn't anything wrong with masturbation. 
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~Ticking away the moments that
make up a dull day, Fritter and
waste the hours in an off-hand
way~
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william
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
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posted December 16, 2008 11:46 PM |
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Edited by william at 07:36, 17 Dec 2008.
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Totally agree with you, Father. It IS natural. There's nothing really wrong with it. Even if you do it a lot, there still isn't anything wrong with it.
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waste the hours in an off-hand
way~
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doomnezeu
Supreme Hero
Miaumiaumiau
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posted December 17, 2008 04:54 AM |
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Quote:
I think we lost all chivalrious attitudes, on average, anyway. What was once the great display of human values and respect, is now something taken lightly. People have lost nobility
The Dark Age --------------> that way.
We have also lost our horses (well, not literally, at least not us Romanians, who still live in a middle-age-look alike kingdom ruled by one man), our full plates, our Greatswords +3 (and a pretty enchantment since I'm a good enchanter). But must of all, we have lost our maidens. OH NOEZ TEH MAIDENZ.
The Death, mate, you are too much of a dreamer to live in this crappy country of ours.
As for masturbation - it is natural. Everyone has done it. When little doomnezeu sees something extremely beautiful, he needs attention. And if a woman isn't around to give him the said attention, then I have to take the matter into my own... hands.
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mvassilev
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Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 17, 2008 05:50 AM |
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I think TheDeath has the right idea, but he's expressing it the wrong way. Chivalry and respect are very good. On the other hand, there's nothing wrong with masturbation, either.
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted December 17, 2008 02:55 PM |
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Edited by TheDeath at 15:05, 17 Dec 2008.
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Quote:
As for masturbation - it is natural. Everyone has done it.
If everyone smokes, is smoking natural?
but yeah it may be natural. Doesn't mean it's a rational or choice that we must do. Then again, natural is also to hunt into the woods for a living.
Because it's also natural to have as many kids as possible, and not use condoms. Why stop there?
Quote:
When little doomnezeu sees something extremely beautiful, he needs attention. And if a woman isn't around to give him the said attention, then I have to take the matter into my own... hands.
Ok ok, seems I haven't been clear enough. I don't need to suppress this because I don't even get that 'thing' (instinct or whatever).
When a heavy smoker sees a pack of cigarettes, he gets anxious to get it. When a non-smoker sees it, he doesn't need to suppress his anxiousness, he doesn't even have it!
The deeper you go, the more you have to suppress it (if you want to 'quit'). Doesn't mean those that aren't deep in the hole have the same difficulties, if any.
(that's like telling a drug addict who just got into drugs "mate, quit now before it'll be too hard to quit", and it requires a strong will for him to do it though, the harder the longer he waits (the more addictive he is)... wheras he has zero difficulty if he didn't take a drug in his life)
Quote:
New things aren't always good. Old things aren't always bad. You act like "primitive" = "bad".
No, just irrational things = bad. Irrational for no purpose whatsoever, not for emotions, but for pleasure. Yes pleasure is bad because it has no purpose. Rational isn't just selfish gains however, but even art/emotions (NOT pleasure! distinguish).
Also william, what if drugs were/are natural? Does that mean it is good? Because it seems to me that was the argument you had --> what is natural must be done. Computers aren't natural, doesn't mean they're bad though. Drugs do exactly the same things to you as masturbation does: just primitive pleasure. Why bad? Because, for some reason, you can think rationally in drugs' case, but not in masturbation's case?
And what is good about it? Anything other than pleasure (NOT joy or happiness lol)? Nothing. It's just a waste of time, a waste of energy, and a waste of life (you age faster ), and a waste of mental ability (you rather choose instincts and fall into charm).
Pleasures are primitive. They are the instinct's way of doing something that would otherwise not be so ok -- like a charm you know? That is, if you want someone to do something that he won't like to do, make it pleasurable, and the weak minded fall for it.
I think you need to rise above it, if you want to improve. If you do what everyone does just for the sake of it, then you're not going to improve.
Quote:
if God hadn't made it UNBELIEVABLY fun pleasurable, the human race would have died out eons ago.
unless they only do it for reproduction, like animals, anyone would not fall into the charm and realize it.
Look, nature makes it pleasurable because otherwise we wouldn't reproduce. And we understand that, and we STILL fall for the charm (even though not for reproduction)... that's weaker minds than animals (they at least have no choice, can't reason like us). It's not like we aren't aware of it.
also @Father: I've never been bullied in my whole life, except in middle school, but then I became the "brawler" of the class (wasn't very pleasant though)... but mostly about school stuff like lessons etc...
@doomnezeu:Quote:
The Death, mate, you are too much of a dreamer to live in this crappy country of ours.
Beats me why I'm here. 
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mvassilev
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posted December 17, 2008 03:32 PM |
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Quote:
Irrational for no purpose whatsoever, not for emotions, but for pleasure. Yes pleasure is bad because it has no purpose.
Reason is a tool with which pleasure is obtained and modified, not a way away from pleasure. Pleasure is its own purpose.
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TheDeath
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posted December 17, 2008 04:10 PM |
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lol you're confusing pleasure with joy (or happiness) or fulfillment.
Pleasure is nature's way of controlling you -- reason is YOUR way of controlling you
Besides, you know, it's similar to getting drunk -- feels good man, but so do drugs and such, and your mental capacity decreases. (for drunkness). This is what happens in all pleasures -- they are pleasures because OTHERWISE no one would do them!
Like a "charm". Say someone charms you to drink poison, making you feel good for some time. It isn't rational. It's just a manner of doing it the way the charmer wants -- because I hope you know, otherwise NO ONE would do it (except emo people).
consequently, it is less thinking for yourself, and more thinking to please the tamer/charmer. If that is not weak mindedness, i don't know what is. It's like a brainwash of some sort
I don't know about you, but I don't like to be tamed.
Well you may not care (about getting drunk, drugs, or all the other things), which means you aren't rational. I do. Because you aren't better off if you are drunk (and might regret it, if some rational guy decides to shoot you while you're drunk, for example).
Let me put it like this: a robot has no instincts, no pleasures, and is 100% logic, and possibly rational (if we make an AI... if) by thinking self-awareness. Willpower is required to break charms. And rationality is a tool for that.
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Truly_Cursed
Adventuring Hero
Unchained
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posted February 05, 2012 02:43 AM |
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I'm going to revive a great thread with great people.
Really deserves a spot in Tavern's greatest 
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted February 05, 2012 02:50 AM |
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with great people.
*checks whether I'm in it*
....
*ego satisfied* 
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Truly_Cursed
Adventuring Hero
Unchained
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posted February 05, 2012 03:00 AM |
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If you weren't in it, I would have never put that Azy. You know that, man!
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This thread is pages long: 
