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| Thread: Are we really an “advanced culture”? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 · «PREV |
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Consis
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Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted September 16, 2005 03:37 AM |
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Hmm?
Jebus, would I be correct in assuming you want to discuss the current theory being debated on whether the pollution of our Earth is to blame for the hurricane disaster?
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Roses Are Red And So Am I
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted September 16, 2005 03:43 AM |
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Edited By: Jebus on 15 Sep 2005
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Quote:
Jebus, would I be correct in assuming you want to discuss the current theory being debated on whether the pollution of our Earth is to blame for the hurricane disaster?
(without a ponder, you can't start a post, hmmmm?)
no. my point was how did we get to a point where government is seemingly unprepared or unwilling to deal with a natural disaster... someone, somewhere said that the US was better prepared to deal with natural disasters a hundred years ago. That should make you ponder. hmmm?
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"You went over my helmet??"
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Conan
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted September 16, 2005 03:55 AM |
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my point was to argue with myself. I'll explain.
I said before that we are indeed an advanced race of animals.
After, I pointed out what we are doing with the flood waters to the envirronment to argue that an advanced race would not do such a thing. What motivates us is greed at present and in addition to consuming the elements of nature, we also destroy it for no good reason exept that it will cost more to clean it up.
I gave the flood waters example, but I could've given any example. It was not my intent to comment about it more than that, but I had to answer the question.
To me, it was in relation to the subject all along.
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Your life as it has been is over. From this time forward, you will service.... us. - Star Trek TNG
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Consis
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Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted September 16, 2005 03:59 PM |
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Jebus,
Hmm, all right then. Perhaps you don't understand a common pre-hurricane American misconception. Many people in this country had thought some of our imagined science fiction was possible. Some even believe that government had, and still has, a secretive lab or base where their technology is at least 10 years ahead of what's on the current public market. Some people have even considered that the government can control weather patterns with their closely-guarded secrets.
But the real truth is they can't. No one anywhere in the world can do such things at this point in time. It's wonderful to scientifically attempt to accomplish such things but it isn't possible. And so when the Sumatra quake hit and then this hurricane, people are beginning to realize exactly where the world stands; in the context of being advanced.
The way in which this disaster is being handled is very questionable. Our advanced culture might be better described as arrogant. Arrogance is a great flaw of my country in particular. I hope to help abate this common belief but it may take something drastic such as a hurricane and globe-splitting quake to finally bring people back to reason and logic.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted September 16, 2005 08:01 PM |
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Sorry for going off-topic again...
... but the budding historian in me just reacted on this:
Quote:
I wasn't sure what you meant. I define "cultural" progress as being more tolerant of historic differences between warring peoples.
There are different kinds of toleration: environmental, religious, and political. Religious tolerance can be found in examples relating to the evolution of certain christian religions such as Catholics moving toward protestantism and then going further toward something like what the Quakers did.
Quakers, ok.
But are you trying to say that Protestants are are/were more tolerant than Catholics? If so, can you explain why, in e.g. 17th century Britain, Catholics were burned? 
(Of course, this was politics, but what isn't?)
More on topic, I'm just wondering if there's seriously people here who think that global warming doesn't have an impact on the climate? Or if there's even some people who reject the concept of human-created pollution as a reason for the climate changes of the last decades?
(Oh, and Russ' last post on page 1 was good. )
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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Consis
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Of Ruby
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posted September 16, 2005 11:44 PM |
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Edited By: Consis on 16 Sep 2005
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terje_the_mad_wizard,
Let me be clear that my point is in fact on-topic in my opinion. We are discussing whether today's humanity is an advanced culture. I hardly think it's appropriate to seperate any historical context of any human culture from the impact of religion. I've always looked for clues in virtually every religion where some sect of it seeks to take a much more peaceful approach to life while holding on to the religion itself.
My mention of christianity was an intended specific mention. As you correctly point out, terje_the_mad_wizard, protestantism behaved almost as badly as catholicism, save one very important detail. Other than the fact that the bible could now be read by just anyone, religious tolerance was now acceptable in some small way. It was a small way considering their intolerance of catholicism but it was more tolerant none the less. I believe Jews were let back in to Britain under Cromwell's protestant revolution yes? They'd been kicked out for more than 3 and a half centuries. Further down the line, the Quaker movement in this part of the world were protestant, but heavily focused on non-violence. In fact it was many of their beliefs that help form the original 13 colonies of the United States. I think they were instrumentally significant in the formation and foundation of early Pennsylvania.
It is my opinion that an advanced culture is one that has tamed the barbarian wilds of intolerance. Whether some agree with me or not, racism and intolerant fascism is very much antiquated and rightly so.
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Roses Are RedAnd So Am I
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted September 16, 2005 11:51 PM |
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Aha. Well, then I have to agree with you. Thanks for clearing that up.
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted September 28, 2005 12:46 AM |
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because I didn't want to start a new thread..
so to add to all the complaints i've made thus far about today's society...
doesn't it bother anybody else that we live in a world of no responsibility??
I mean you buy anything today, and you're pretty much taking a shot in the dark as far as the quality and durability of the item. Everywhere you turn you see people getting screwed over by they car dealership, their home builder, an appliance manufacturere, furniture stores, insurance companies...
... a few examples of this:
I was in a car accident... i got rear-ended by a guy that fled the scene, then when found by the cops, he claimed he was epileptic.. he got off with a crap ticket and lost his license... but IM the one who had to fight with my auto-body shop, my insurance, his insurance, my adjuster... he was at fault, and I got screwed!!
my gf was driving down a road under construction and a truck lost a part of his load.. damaging the hood of her car.. when she called the company, she was told that without identifying the driver of the truck, there'd be nothing they could do!! I mean, she's dodging debris and trying to not kill herself, and they want her to identify the driver!!
... you buy a house, praying that your contractors do their jobs... the builder assures you that everything will be ok but there are no garantees! you can find out down the road that they did shaddy work, or that the soil was not fit to build on...
i mean you have hardworking people who rely on wouldbe "experts" when they need to purchase something or need a service and unless they really know what they should watch out for, someone is trying to take advantage of them...
..I miss the old days where my name, my reputation and my word was "worth" something.
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"You went over my helmet??"
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Disciple of Herodotus
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posted September 28, 2005 03:42 AM |
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Hey, the market has to be "free", you know? Can't burden it with silly laws about the rights of the consumers, right?
And the responsibility of the insurance company's not to you, it's to the shareholders - giving you money when they can think of a way to screw you over would be the same as letting them down.
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted September 28, 2005 04:55 AM |
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Im not sure if you're agreeing with me! 
(im confused)
:S
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"You went over my helmet??"
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TitaniumAlloy
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Professional
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posted September 28, 2005 03:46 PM |
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Quote:
You should have ended your phrase here. It won't benefit them. Period. They will never do it.
I didn't end it there though. Did you read the rest? I think it will in the long term. If it saves 1000s of lives? How is that not a benefit? Are they so shortsighted that they ignore the factual long term weather consequences of global warming??
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Russ
Promising
Supreme Hero
blah, blah, blah
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posted September 28, 2005 05:59 PM |
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Edited By: Russ on 28 Sep 2005
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Quote:
I didn't end it there though. Did you read the rest? I think it will in the long term. If it saves 1000s of lives? How is that not a benefit? Are they so shortsighted that they ignore the factual long term weather consequences of global warming??
Read my post from September 15, 2005 12:29 PM
Also, please tell me what does making money has to do with saving lives?
Have you seen Fight Club? "My job is to calculate the amount of money we will spend paying off the people who burned alive in our cars and compare it to the price we would have to pay to recall our cars and upgrade the faulty injection system. If paying off is cheaper, then we won't do the recall."
Even if they exaggerated it a bit, I think this is pretty close to how the system works.
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terje_the_ma...
Responsible
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Disciple of Herodotus
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posted September 29, 2005 10:35 PM |
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*unlurking*
Quote:
Im not sure if you're agreeing with me!
(im confused)
:S
I'm completely agreeing with you. I think I was being sarcastic, but I always mess that up with ironic, so I'm not sure.
So, anyway, I agree. Basically.
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"Sometimes I think everyone's just pretending to be brave, and none of us really are. Maybe pretending to be brave is how you get brave, I don't know."
- Grenn, A Storm of Swords.
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Jebus
Promising
Supreme Hero
TheJester akaJeebs akaJebfoo
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posted September 29, 2005 10:59 PM |
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Edited By: Jebus on 30 Sep 2005
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mark this date and time down in the HC history books!!
Terje and Jebus .... agree!! 
EDIT:
Im throwing a question out there for anyone to answer...
Have you ever wondered how we're supose to accomplish world peace, eliminate hunger, pauverty and sickness when we (as an online community) can't even discuss our feelings, ideas and opinions without prejudice?
If we, coming from all parts of the globe, can't learn to discuss serious issues in a civil and respectful manner (on what should be a social chat board), how can we ever expect cultures that have been at war with each other for years to reconcile their differences?
I don't have to agree with you, nor you with me, but if we can't deal with those differences and accept each other for them, there is no hope of growing and evolving as a people.
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"You went over my helmet??"
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Russ
Promising
Supreme Hero
blah, blah, blah
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posted September 30, 2005 06:34 PM |
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Quote:
Have you ever wondered how we're supose to accomplish world peace, eliminate hunger, pauverty and sickness when we (as an online community) can't even discuss our feelings, ideas and opinions without prejudice?
Well, most people aren't very open-minded by nature. And even the most open-minded of us will have some prejudice. This is actually a good thing in a way that has kept our species alive so far. Sometimes it is better to use the old way that has worked so far rather than trying to gamble with something new even if it has a possibility of being much better than the old way. (If you want to read more about it - read some psychology 101 book, it is quite interesting, you won't regret it.) With age stereotypes only get worse as people will unconsciously look for the proofs of their stereotypes and will eventually find them (as they say, "those who seek shall find"), thus continuing this vicious cycle.
So, if you see a middle-aged or an old guy who doesn't look very open-minded, you have a better chance of proving something to a brick wall.
Also, even though our brains are designed to make us live as a part of a community, it also has a lot of egoism programmed in it (what good can we do for the community if we cannot ensure our own survival?), this is why we don't live in a perfect society and this is why the true communism is impossible.
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