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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Not in the Manual
Thread: Not in the Manual This thread is 26 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 10 20 ... 22 23 24 25 26 · «PREV / NEXT»
Binabik
Binabik


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 13, 2006 01:01 AM
Edited by Binabik on 12 Mar 2006

Creatures in the moat take an extra 10% damage when attacked.

The attack/defense penalty is 2 1/2% per point difference, not 2% like the manual says.

Wondering creatures grow by 10% per week.


@Legend, the GDs aging can be removed with cure. Also it lasts for three rounds (the round they got aged plus two more)
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LegendMaker
LegendMaker


Promising
Famous Hero
The Metal Specialist
posted March 13, 2006 01:26 AM
Edited by LegendMaker on 12 Mar 2006

Someone is Still Awake !

Quote:
@Legend, the GDs aging can be removed with cure. Also it lasts for three rounds (the round they got aged plus two more)
Hehehe I was testing the audience's level of attention, Bin ! Ahem. Glad to see at least you noticed this inaccurate statement I purposedly thrown into my otherwise brilliant posts for said attention level testing ! Lmao

Furthermore, I hinted at that fact myself :
Quote:
In fact, you can only possibly "Dispell" what sticks to the creature(s) they are cast upon (ie it affects the color of their "status bar", and if you right click on the stack in question, the spell's icon will appear on the list).

Disrupting Ray, like GD's aging, has an immediate and definitive effect. It's not uncastable, simply because it's not cast anymore. It HAS BEEN cast, and only the CONSEQUENCES of that still exist afterwards.
GD's Agin will off course affect both the color of the stack's "status bar" and incorporate an "Aging" icon if you right click on the aged stack.

So, this statement was (again purposedly ) contradictory in itself.

All the rest is bullet proof true (one obvious mistake was enough to test the audience's attention hehehe).

Btw, Expert Dispell will of course also remove GD's Aging.

Legend.

PS : Thank you for your pointing that out, Bin ! I edited my corresponding posts accordingly.

PPS : Don't let that fact fool you, folks : 3 rounds is much more than Galthran needs to cast "Haste". So what you can see in my signature WILL happen if you play me, you can bet your life on it !
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Zsa
Zsa


Famous Hero
posted March 13, 2006 07:12 AM
Edited by Zsa on 13 Mar 2006

If you have units of 7 alignments, you will get -5 morale, but the morale screen will only display a -3 to morale.  

Fighting against shooters with cents and goblins, it is always a bad idea to defend with your centaurs if you want to keep them alive
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LegendMaker
LegendMaker


Promising
Famous Hero
The Metal Specialist
posted March 13, 2006 10:17 AM
Edited by LegendMaker on 13 Mar 2006

@ Bin : I retested. Expert Cure will remove GDs' Aging indeed, as well as various other Critters' specials. But, contrary to Expert Dispell, it will NOT remove the Dends' Binding.

Some More :

* Neither the Recantler's Cloak nor the Orb of Inhibition do affect creatures' AUTOMATIC special abilities.

They won't stop the "Level 4 magic ability" of Scorpicores from happening. Nor the GDs' "Level 5 spell".

But they WILL keep any creature SPELLCASTER from casting : AAs, Master Genies, Pits, Ogre Magi... (Orb only for the latter, since Recantler allows Level 1 spells).

Trivia : When you have the Orb of Inhibition on, it won't stop the wandering Scorps from paralysing your units. But it will keep YOU from dispelling their special ! So throw that cursed thing in the backpack before you attack them !
Quote:
If you have units of 7 alignments, you will get -5 morale, but the morale screen will only display a -3 to morale.
Sorry, Zsa, it's not that "the screen displays -3 Morale", it's that you HAVE -3 Morale.

* There is NO SUCH THING as " -5 Morale" (nor +12 Luck, for that matter) in PRACTICE.

When you have accumulated 5 " - 1 Morale ", what it means is that you have -3 Morale, AND you will STAY at -3 Morale even if you get up to 2 "+1 Morale" bonuses.

Only when you'll get a third +1 Morale boost will your -3 Morale turn to -2 Morale.

You can't get neither more than +3 nor less than -3 Morale / Luck in practice. It doesn't exist.
Quote:
If a hero with Grail in his backpack retreats, he will appear in Tavern without it.
True, Vlaad, but there is more to it than just that :

* When a hero carrying the Grail is killed, retreats or flees, the Grail will be forever lost for ALL players in the current game.

* TPing home (using the spell, not the "poor man's TP", of course) won't make the Grail disappear.

* You can give the Grail to another hero.

Some more :

* Maximum possible Level for any Hero is 108.

* Maximum possible value for any Primary Skill is 99.

(Trust me, you don't wanna know what happens if you go beyond that ! It's SOOOO ugly ! )

* Minimum possible value for Attack and Defense is 0.

* Minimum possible value for Spell Power and Knowledge is 1 (NOT 0) !!!

(Even if you customize a hero in map editor and set his Power or Knowledge to 0, he will have 1 when you launch ! )

Rather trivia but still... how many of you did know that, huh ?  moo hoo ha ha ha ha

Legend.
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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted March 13, 2006 02:10 PM
Edited by csarmi on 13 Mar 2006

The effects of morale are capped at +3/-3. At +3, every stack of you has a 3/24 chance to get an extra action. At -3, however, your troops have a 6/24 chance to freeze!

There is no such thing as bad luck, good luck works the same as good morale.

(Mighty Xarfax, feel free to rephrase my sentences. The info given is of course tested)

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Zsa
Zsa


Famous Hero
posted March 13, 2006 06:49 PM

explanation: yes I know that you cannot have effectively more than -3 morale gents. However, if you have troops of 7 alignments you will have -5 morale (effectively -3). This means that even if you have expert leadership, you will have -2 morale. Now the pickle is that when you go click on a unit, the displayed morale table will be
Expert Leadership: +3
Troops of 7 Alignments: -3

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Zsa
Zsa


Famous Hero
posted March 13, 2006 07:46 PM
Edited by Zsa on 13 Mar 2006

97. Rogues in your army is the equivalent of a permanent vision spell with 1 spell power and an expert school of magic.

And finally poison, the most complex passive ability a unit has in HoMM3:

98. Wyvern Monarch's Poison acts like aging (except it's 10% instead of 50%), the effect is cummulative up to 50% and lasts for the duration of the battle.

(ie if a naga queen has been poisoned, the total hitpoints of the stack will drop by 10% for every turn the unit is poisoned until a maximum where each naga in the stack has 55 health)

99. Wyvern Monarch's Poison also deals 10% damage from the original HP to the top unit from the stack at the end of every turn , and the "aging effect" of the poison lasts for the entire duration of battle.

note: you can remove the decrease in hit points of your stack only with cure.
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dimis
dimis


Responsible
Supreme Hero
Digitally signed by FoG
posted March 13, 2006 08:25 PM
Edited by dimis on 14 Mar 2006

Great thread!! Many thanks for sharing! :)

> A hero may only return from an allied Castle-Gate to one of the towns with the same flag as his (meaning he can not jump around on allied towns with a different flag).
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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted March 13, 2006 09:01 PM
Edited by csarmi on 13 Mar 2006

Xarfax, it's been tested by me and some moderator guy on the round table forums. It's 100% true. It's actually a useful thing to know and not in manual. You can test it out yourself by creating a little map with a hero who has -3 morale. Creatures freeze about 1 in 4 times. We've made like hundreds of experiments btw.

http://www.forumplanet.com/strategyplanet/homm/topic.asp?fid=3806&tid=1447690&p=1#15939323

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Russ
Russ


Promising
Supreme Hero
blah, blah, blah
posted March 13, 2006 09:33 PM

Quote:
There is no such thing as bad luck, good luck works the same as good morale.
A bit off topic, but removing bad luck kind of unbalanced the game. Devil's -1 luck special is useless because of that and HOMM2 bad luck animation looked really cool. It would be fun to see that AA powerstack fly over to your ADs only to do 1/2 the damage.

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supersonic
supersonic


Famous Hero
being digested. E=mc^2, s=vt
posted March 13, 2006 09:41 PM
Edited by supersonic on 13 Mar 2006

Xarfax, thanx for calling me "super evil sonic eye". ;-)

101.You can recruit heroes in towns that belong to your allies.

That's why I actually like playing with AI ally. I can get resources pretty fast. I don't know if that works in multiplayer.

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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted March 13, 2006 09:54 PM
Edited by csarmi on 14 Mar 2006

Storm Elementals do have melee penalty. I believe this bug is not corrected anywhere (maybe in h3 complete, i dont have that)

Psychic Elementals do half damage against other elementals. Magics do normal damage. (tested)

Opposite elementals do double damage against each other. (tested)

There is something with elementals of the same type fighting each other, but I no longer remember it and I am too lazy to test again.

edit: just found my test results from back then:

In Reply To #14
Full and confirmed info (I have just tested).

Fire/Energy does double damage to Water/Ice and vica versa.
Storm/Air does double damage to Magma/Earth and vica versa.

Psychic Elemental does half damage to any elemental.
Magic Elemental does half damage to Magic Elemental.

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Binabik
Binabik


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 14, 2006 05:03 AM

Anti-Magic is effective against the special abilities of zombie, unicorn, thunderbird, and mummy, but not against efreet, dendroid, ghost dragon, medusa, scorpicore, basilisk and monarch. (all tested)


92  I tested this with original starting numbers from 1-19. About half end up with lots of 20, the other half with lots of 21.


94  Not sure how you meant this.  Minimum BASE damage is 1, but att/def penalty still applies.  100 skells can do as little as 29 damage.

Also #41 and Zsa's #100 are in the manual.
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Zsa
Zsa


Famous Hero
posted March 14, 2006 05:44 AM

Quote:
Anti-Magic is effective against the special abilities of zombie, unicorn, thunderbird, and mummy, but not against efreet, dendroid, ghost dragon, medusa, scorpicore, basilisk and monarch. (all tested)


92  I tested this with original starting numbers from 1-19. About half end up with lots of 20, the other half with lots of 21.


94  Not sure how you meant this.  Minimum BASE damage is 1, but att/def penalty still applies.  100 skells can do as little as 29 damage.

Also #41 and Zsa's #100 are in the manual.


yeah thanks bb, the rest with poison dealing 50% damage of the top unit on the stack is bogus tho. Does anyone remember if it ever was like that?
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Binabik
Binabik


Responsible
Legendary Hero
posted March 14, 2006 07:25 AM
Edited by Binabik on 14 Mar 2006

Quote:
the rest with poison dealing 50% damage of the top unit on the stack is bogus tho. Does anyone remember if it ever was like that?


What you might be thinking of is it does 10% of BASE health damage per turn, but no more than 50% of CURRENT health.  So if it is down to 2 HP, it will only do 1 damage...and never completely kill a unit.

I didn't even know about the aging affect. For me, that's the best hint in this thread, can't believe I never noticed that before....all this time I thought the monarch special sucked!  Now I'm totally stoked


edit: um, just noticed the manual says 50% poison damage per turn, but it's wrong, it's like I said above (I tested it)
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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted March 14, 2006 09:01 AM
Edited by csarmi on 14 Mar 2006

So the correction is:

Magic Elementals do magic damage, any creatures immune to magic take half damage.

Psychic Elementals to psychic damage, any creatures immune to mind spells take half damage.

However:

Fire/Energy elementals do normal damage to creatures immune to fire. They do double damage against Ice/Water elementals (and take double damage from them as well), however.

etc...

Not so logical. Unless Fire elemenals don't have a fire damage.


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Zsa
Zsa


Famous Hero
posted March 14, 2006 09:02 AM
Edited by Zsa on 14 Mar 2006

Quote:
Quote:
the rest with poison dealing 50% damage of the top unit on the stack is bogus tho. Does anyone remember if it ever was like that?


What you might be thinking of is it does 10% of BASE health damage per turn, but no more than 50% of CURRENT health.  So if it is down to 2 HP, it will only do 1 damage...and never completely kill a unit.



True, it never completely kills a unit, but it still does as much damage as it can.

ie - again with the nagas - base health 110 hp. The poison will do 11 damage every turn.

Now if the top naga in the stack has above 11 health, it will do 11 damage.

If the naga has below or equal to 11 health, the poison will always bring it to 1 hit point.

So no, it can do more or less than 50% of its current health.

the only times when it does exactly 50% damage is when
a) the naga has 22 hp - poison does 11 damage
b) the naga has 2 hp, poison does 1 damage

All the other cases (top naga from stack having a different current amount of hp), the poison does more or less than 50% damage.

edit: interesting thing csarmi, I didn't know that stuff you just mentioned about the elementals, completely new to me
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LegendMaker
LegendMaker


Promising
Famous Hero
The Metal Specialist
posted March 14, 2006 12:53 PM
Edited by LegendMaker on 14 Mar 2006

The Morale Factor / Glad many of you are active in this thread again

Quote:
Me :

* There is NO SUCH THING as " -5 Morale" (nor +12 Luck, for that matter) in PRACTICE.

When you have accumulated 5 " - 1 Morale ", what it means is that you have -3 Morale, AND you will STAY at -3 Morale even if you get up to 2 "+1 Morale" bonuses.

Only when you'll get a third +1 Morale boost will your -3 Morale turn to -2 Morale.

You can't get neither more than +3 nor less than -3 Morale / Luck in practice. It doesn't exist.
Quote:
Csarmi :

The effects of morale are capped at +3/-3. At +3, every stack of you has a 3/24 chance to get an extra action. At -3, however, your troops have a 6/24 chance to freeze!

There is no such thing as bad luck, good luck works the same as good morale.
Quote:
Xarfax himself :

Its NOT true that it is NOT usefull to get moral bonuses higher then 3, cause there are effects possible, e.g. Ghost Dragon that can reduce you higher moral bonuses back to 3.
* There is NO LIMIT to the number of Morale or Luck "points" you can accumulate (positive or negative). A "secret count" of those points do exist, though it doesn't actually show (or display) "on the screen" (mentionning Zsa here).

* However, IN COMBAT, the EFFECTIVE amount of Morale or Luck points you get is CAPPED at +3 / -3. But it's ALWAYS the CORRECT RESULT of your total points that is taken into account.

* Example : My "secret count" for Morale is +6 (Expert Leadership + Pendant of Courage). I go into a fight with an opponent that has GDs (-1 Morale to opponent). My base "secret count" for that battle will then be +5. So I'll still have the maximum effective count of +3. Then he casts Expert Sorrow. My secret count drops to +3. So I'll still have +3 on the battlefield. If I had done the exact same fight after visiting an empty Warrior's Tomb (-3 Morale), I'll have Neutral Morale instead of +3 after my opponent cast Expert Sorrow.

So it does of course make a difference to gain or lose Morale or Luck points beyond the caps.

Btw :

* Same as the Magi / Pegasi affect the spellcasting cost beyond their own death, ArchDevils reduce opponent's Luck and GDs reduce the opponent's Morale beyond their own death. [EDIT : And AAs give +1 Morale after death as well !]

(quick opinion : "We, your army, have been sooo shocked at the sight of these Ghost Dragons that the mere fact of destroying them wasn't enough to regain our self-confidence !" )

[EDIT : "We, your army, are soooo proud that ArchAngels once teamed up with us that the mere fact their corpses currently lie bleeding on the battlefield isn't enough to attain our self-confidence !" ) ]

* The Spirit Of Oppression doesn't cancel all Morale "BONUSES", it gives Neutral Morale to any and all units on the battlefield, no matter what...

[EDIT : Proven wrong by Csarmi. Legendary blush, here : ]

* I've retested it myself, it's absolutely true, but the fact that the Badge of Courage (so-called minor artie) supposed to give "+1 Morale" also gives MIND SPELL IMMUNITY is a SCANDALOUS BUG !

I don't think it fits in that list (based on your own "no cheats" policy, dear Mister X.).

Cheers. Legend.
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csarmi
csarmi


Supreme Hero
gets back
posted March 14, 2006 01:02 PM
Edited by csarmi on 14 Mar 2006

Spirit of oppression sets any morale to zero if it's positive. But if it is negative, it has no effect!

I'm 100% sure of this, tested it and experienced it several times. So if you have -3 morale and wear the Spirit of opression, your troops will still freeze 1/4th of the time.

As for Badge of Courage, it would be okay to add mind spell immunity, but that should be written in the descrition and the artifact should move up a level at least. We all know that artifact levels are not as well-thought out, by the way.

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LegendMaker
LegendMaker


Promising
Famous Hero
The Metal Specialist
posted March 14, 2006 01:47 PM
Edited by LegendMaker on 14 Mar 2006

Quote:
Spirit of oppression sets any morale to zero if it's positive. But if it is negative, it has no effect!

I'm 100% sure of this, tested it and experienced it several times. So if you have -3 morale and wear the Spirit of opression, your troops will still freeze 1/4th of the time.
This contradicts my own tests (from some time ago). Knowing that you are a very reliable tester, Csarmi, I will take your word for it until I've retested it myself.

[EDIT : Done. Edited my previous post accordingly. Fairly quick to test, I must add. Hence further Legendary blush : ]

Thanks, Csarmi !

Legend.
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LM

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