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Heroes Community > Heroes 5 - Temple of Ashan > Thread: Enlightenment Overpowered?
Thread: Enlightenment Overpowered? This thread is 3 pages long: 1 2 3 · NEXT»
silentbobus
silentbobus


Adventuring Hero
posted May 19, 2006 04:14 PM

Enlightenment Overpowered?

Reading the description of it, it seems that Enlightenment would have to be incredibly overpowered. An extra stat boost every other level at expert, and more experience to gain levels... am I missing something?

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Mantra
Mantra


Adventuring Hero
posted May 19, 2006 04:29 PM

Basic skill is powerful. Perks derived from it are weak.

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okiesolidarity
okiesolidarity


Known Hero
right brain/left brain wizard
posted May 19, 2006 08:14 PM

Let's also forget that levels begin to require much more experience after a certain point...I haven't seen an experience chart, but I do remember that from H3, having the extra experience meant almost almost nothing by level 20+, and cost you a precious skill slot.

as far as your question about posting, that's a means to keep new people from posting new threads too often (enouragement to check and see if the thread you want to start could possibly be handled in another thread that has already been started).  Just read and respond to more posts and you'll be able to post another thread.


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silentbobus
silentbobus


Adventuring Hero
posted May 19, 2006 08:36 PM

After 10 posts it would only let me start 2 topics though, that seems a little harsh. I would expect 4-5 posts per topic.

As for experience gain, you're right, since it's a sliding scale, 30% more exp might only be a level or 2 difference as you got higher up. Still, at level 20 you would have receieved 10 additional skill points. The minor skills associated with Enlightenment aren't great, but they aren't so bad it would prevent me from using the skill.

From previous Heros I always liked logistics the best, so Enlightenment and Logistics will probably end up being the two I try to get with every hero. At least... every hero that travels.

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ZeroXcuses
ZeroXcuses


Known Hero
posted June 29, 2006 07:27 PM

I think that enlightenment is a great skill, especially for Necros. Scholar helps your heroes to trade spells, which is even better with Magic Insight (Sorcery). I would take Intelligence over Mana Regeneration, because it seems that Nival has littered mana well all over their maps. A spellflinger should almost never run out of mana, unless they run into a legion of imps or something.

Extra xp per battle helps you level faster, especially in the higher levels where you will need that extra 30%, and Lord of the Undead (Necro) is a MUST. Anything that increases Necromancy is invaluable.

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Fuzzier
Fuzzier


Adventuring Hero
posted June 30, 2006 11:10 AM

Basically, EVERY hero should get Enlightment.
It is VITAL to get the primary skills of ANY hero up.

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rainalcar
rainalcar


Promising
Famous Hero
Heroji su zakon
posted June 30, 2006 12:04 PM

Some people underestimate enlightment a lot. You have to consider that this skill is in many ways superb (to attack and defense, although these skills in practice have better abilities):

For Academy: it raises your knowledge (good for arties, but in general, if resources are scarce, this can be wasted) and spell power (pretty much essential).
Dungeon: Raises SP (absolutely crucial, if you get +5,6 SP through enlighment at lvl 20 this is MASSIVE) and Attack (less important, but still, most welcome, your dragons will tear through anything).
Haven: Defense and Attack (this I will demonstrate in an example below)
Sylvan: knowledge (mostly wasted) and defense
Inferno: attack (very good) and knowledge (not wastes as much as sylvan, but still, less important)
Necropolis: Attack (very good) and SP (so so, mostly not so useful, Dark Magic isn't really SP dependant).

So, I would say that enlighment is brilliant for dungeon and haven, has tremendous potential for academy, and less for the other three towns. Now, to show the effectivness with haven:
The heroes start with 1A, 2D, 1K, 1SP. Say they reach endgame at lvl 20. They will probably end up with stats 8A, 10D, 3K, 3SP or similiar (19 levels with no map objects/arties). With expert enelightment they will get cca. 10 more points - say the new stats will be similiar to these: 12A, 15D, 4K, 3SP.

Now, consider your 12 paladins are attacking/being attacked by three black dragons (neutrals).
1) First situation paladins attacking with Expert Attack skill, but with no enlightment:
min damage=(12*20)*(1,15)*(1+0,05*2)=303
max damage=455
Average=379

2) Second situation paladins attacking with enchanced stats from enlightment, but with no attack skill:
min damage=312
max damage=468
Average=390

You can see that enlightment bonus beats attack bonus already, and we haven't even counted the GREATER enlightment bonus in defence! I am confident that defense would turn out better (in defending only ofcourse ) than enlightment because it's 30% (compared to 15% from attack), but still, attack and defense combined may be better than enlightment, but any of these skills solely - no way.


____________

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juventas
juventas


Adventuring Hero
posted June 30, 2006 04:44 PM

Knowledge is wasted with elven unless you have imbued triple ballista and rain of arrows on 3 favored enemies.  With the necromancer: Raise Dead.
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silentbobus
silentbobus


Adventuring Hero
posted June 30, 2006 04:54 PM

Knowledge is definately the worst stat, it's the only one that doesn't necessarily help you the higher it goes. So it would be correct to say the Enlightenment is more helpful for Heroes that don't normally divert points to that stat.

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Andmcmuffin2
Andmcmuffin2


Hired Hero
In need of Undead Avatar
posted June 30, 2006 06:29 PM

Knowledge helps dungeon because of empowered spells. I had a dungeon hero with necro units. Empowered Curse of the Netherworld- 2k damage from a lvl. 20 hero with expert enlightment.
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The wraith is reserved?!?! NOOOO I'M NOT GOING TO BE PINK AND UNDEAD!

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted June 30, 2006 07:04 PM

enlightment pays off late. Will you survive to lvl 20 without proper skills? I doubt you will. You need good skills and abilities fast.. not a skill that can EVENTUALLY add 10% to your damage in the very end.

Enlightment sucks.

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Gus
Gus


Known Hero
Not-So-Bright Crusader
posted June 30, 2006 09:50 PM

I thought "humour" involved being funny. That's probably what your jokes lack
back on spam-free topic if you like?
____________
If Pacman had affected us as kids we'd be running around in dark rooms, munching pills and listening to repetitive music.

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Vicheron
Vicheron


Known Hero
posted June 30, 2006 10:08 PM

The usefulness of Enlightenment depends on what skill you're giving up.

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Andmcmuffin2
Andmcmuffin2


Hired Hero
In need of Undead Avatar
posted July 01, 2006 12:21 AM

Amen, Vicheron!
____________
The wraith is reserved?!?! NOOOO I'M NOT GOING TO BE PINK AND UNDEAD!

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Thanatos
Thanatos


Known Hero
posted July 01, 2006 12:46 AM
Edited by Thanatos at 00:47, 01 Jul 2006.

Quote:
Knowledge is wasted with elven unless you have imbued triple ballista and rain of arrows on 3 favored enemies.  With the necromancer: Raise Dead.


And Arcane Armor and Summon Phoenix and Puppet Master and Summon Elementals and Curse of the Netherworld and and and...

edit: whoops, thought you were talking about spellpower... I guess I should get some more sleep

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juventas
juventas


Adventuring Hero
posted July 01, 2006 01:40 AM

Quote:
Quote:
Knowledge is wasted with elven unless you have imbued triple ballista and rain of arrows on 3 favored enemies.  With the necromancer: Raise Dead.


And Arcane Armor and Summon Phoenix and Puppet Master and Summon Elementals and Curse of the Netherworld and and and...

edit: whoops, thought you were talking about spellpower... I guess I should get some more sleep


I actually was talking about knowledge for sylvan and spellpower for necro, so yeah, you're right.  I mentioned only Raise Dead since it's the major tactic of many necro fans.  Most people would be satisfied in casting Raise Dead every turn they get.
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Kingpriest
Kingpriest


Hired Hero
posted July 02, 2006 04:10 PM

I usually like to play with Haven and get the following skills:

Attack
Defense
Light Magic
Logistics
Leadership

I was contemplating replacing leadership with enlightenment.  So the question is, in regards to Haven, which skill is better, leadership or enlightenment?  With leadership I usually try to get Retribution (don't know exactly how much extra damage this provides) and then Power of Speed.  

I know luck isn't in my build, as it should be, but I usually try to get luck bonuses from artifacts and neutral power ups, usually works just fine without taking up a skill slot.

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juventas
juventas


Adventuring Hero
posted July 02, 2006 05:55 PM

Quote:
I was contemplating replacing leadership with enlightenment.  So the question is, in regards to Haven, which skill is better, leadership or enlightenment?  With leadership I usually try to get Retribution (don't know exactly how much extra damage this provides) and then Power of Speed.  

I know luck isn't in my build, as it should be, but I usually try to get luck bonuses from artifacts and neutral power ups, usually works just fine without taking up a skill slot.


Leadership doesn't get those abilities.  Attack/offense does.  Divine Guidance and Aura of Swiftness are good in the leadership track, but I think leadership is less useful than luck because you already get an automatic +2 morale bonus with having troops all from the same faction.  You don't get something like this with luck.
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Kingpriest
Kingpriest


Hired Hero
posted July 02, 2006 08:09 PM

My bad, thanks for the correction.  I usually get aura of swiftness with leadership, not power of speed.  I had the two mixed up.  I am still unsure of what skill is better for a Haven player overall, leadership or enlightenment?  

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BigBadVoodoo
BigBadVoodoo


A poster
posted July 02, 2006 08:49 PM

uhh... based on a 3 hero strategy (one scout, one scout/castle sitter with recruitment, one main)

leadership on the castle sitter, and on the main it's a tossup based on the map...

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