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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: All about hand-to-hand attacks!
Thread: All about hand-to-hand attacks!
AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted July 15, 2006 08:39 AM

All about hand-to-hand attacks!

When you want your creature stack, either 1-hex or 2-hexes wide, to attack an enemy creature stack, either 1-hex or 2-hexes wide, hand-to-hand you choose only the place from which the attack will be done BUT NOT THE ATTACK DIRECTION! Interesting?
There are only three types of attack directions:
FRONT, REAR and TURNING.

Read line is FRONT attack;
Orange line is REAR attack;
Green line is TURNING attack;
If you creature stack can't hit the chosen enemy creature stack with front attack then your unit attempts to hit the enemy with rear attack (only for 2-hexes wide creatures). Eventually if this attack can't be done too, your unit will turn round and hit the foe with turning attack.

Retaliation attacks have the same mechanism.

For example,

White hexes are the attacker creatures;
Black hexes are the defender creatures;
Orange line signifies the direction we have chosen;
Read line signifies the attack direction.
(The attack have done from the left side of the battlefield, so the Head of the attacking unit is right-oriented)
Now, I hope, you will understand all the pictures posted by Rainalcar here and find some mistakes.

Good luck!

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AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted July 15, 2006 01:38 PM

Hand-to-hand attack trivia

Try to compare:



Trivia:


>> I was wrong about 1-hex wide units: they don't have REAR attack directions, they have only TURNING directions. <<

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Truliche
Truliche


Adventuring Hero
posted July 15, 2006 05:12 PM

Wow you have a LOT of free time...
____________

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AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted July 16, 2006 11:07 AM

And how can you hit both enemies with you dragon(phoenix) from these directions in THIS case?



Good luck!

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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted July 16, 2006 04:46 PM

Here.
____________
Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.

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AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted July 17, 2006 03:51 PM

2-hex attack rules, wrong :)

You don't need to remember ALL the situations posted by Rainalcal! You only need to know THE RULES:

1) Front attack is the first priority;
2) If front attack is impossible, your unit attempts to do rear attack;
3) If 1 and 2 are failed, turning attack will be done.

Rainalcal didn't explain why in some cases you can hit both enemy units while in the rest of cases you can't. These rules EXPLAIN both pictures posted.

Knowing these rules you can foretell attack and retaliation directions in 100% cases without any tables or tests.
I want to say that in HoMM III there are no illogical moments in hand-to-hand attacks and retaliations.

So CAN you solve the situation posted above?


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GrayFace
GrayFace


Promising
Known Hero
posted July 26, 2006 12:42 AM
Edited by GrayFace at 00:47, 26 Jul 2006.

Quote:
And how can you hit both enemies with you dragon(phoenix) from these directions in THIS case?




If you stand on the right side of the field and hit from any of those directions, you'll hit both. (according to your theory)
Cool theory.
____________

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Ecoris
Ecoris


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted August 02, 2006 04:06 PM

Nothing new in this thread. Much of it seems like copy-paste to me.

"THE RULES" are nice, but they've already been uncovered in the thread referred to.

But can you tell me when a flying creature will turn around when it moves

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AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted August 03, 2006 04:19 PM

Dragons wonder if they must turn round before attack :)

2Ecoris:

Whether a flying unit turns round before attack or not, that depends on the result of subtraction:

[position of the head before attack] - [position of the head after attack].

Both these positions are known. "Position" means the distance from the left (for attackers)/right (for defenders) side of the battlefield.

If this result is negative your unit WILL turn round before attack otherwise WILL NOT.

See this:


The result of subtraction is zero, so archangels will not turn round before attack.

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Ecoris
Ecoris


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted August 04, 2006 11:21 AM

Right you are. Thanks.

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AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted August 04, 2006 11:45 AM

Correction

I wanted to say:
Delta = [position of the head AFTER attack] - [position of the head BEFORE attck] (see above). Sorry.

Also try to compare:



Good luck!

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Ecoris
Ecoris


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted August 04, 2006 12:15 PM

I got your point anyway. That illustration really shows the interesting part: The rows are important, even though the move is practically the same.

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AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted August 14, 2006 06:50 PM

Ground moving creatures

Also I wonder how do ground moving creatures move when obstacles (units etc.) are present on the battlefield? If there are no obstacles it's simple...
Does any theory exist on such a problem? Thanks.

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Ecoris
Ecoris


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted August 15, 2006 10:12 AM

I don't know. Does it really matter, I mean, you know where it's going to end. And I guess we all know that creatures move forwards before they move up/down, haven't we all tried clearing half the mines with a single unit during a siege against tower?

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AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted August 19, 2006 08:27 AM

The theory is coming soon...

It seems like I have the theory... I will post it after some extra tests. Remember cyclops from Heroes I? This theory might be useful there...

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AlexSpl
AlexSpl


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted August 21, 2006 02:40 PM

The first stage (moving forward):

a) Mark as "0" the source hex;
b) Mark as "1" all the empty hexes adjacent to the hex marked as "0";
c) Mark as "2" all the empty (and, of course, without marks) hexes adjacent to the hexes marked as "1", and so on.
d) Repeat this procedure until the destination hex is marked.

As you can see, a "mark" means the distance (by ground) from the source hex.

The second stage (moving backward):

a) n := [the mark of the destination hex];
b) Among the hexes adjacent to the hex marked as "n" choose the one marked as "n-1" with the highest priority value (see the picture below).



This hex will be last but one in the chain of hexes from the source hex to the destination one.

c) n:=n-1;
d) Repeat b), c) until n=0.

As a result, you will find the whole chain of hexes from the source to the destination hex.

I understand that this theory is of little practical use but it's a good idea to create a computer program based on this theory that could imitate real battles.

The theory of 2-hex ground moving creatures is nearly the same. All the distances should be measured from creature's head. Hexes where heads of creatures cannot stand must be marked as "*" (except the hex left [for attackers] / right [for defenders] to the source hex [head hex]. Such a hex shoud be marked as "1"). Hexes where neither heads nor tails of creatures can stand must be marked as "N". The second stage is the same absolutely.

Awaiting feedback...

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