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JungleMan
Hired Hero
Funkenstein
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posted January 09, 2007 12:31 PM |
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damage
Lets say we have two same monsters,same hp,speed,attack,... One of them has 15-30 dmg,another has 20-25 dmg. Which monster will win? I know that blessing will make first monster stronger,and cursing second monster.
I want to know is archangel's dmg(50) better then titan's(40-60)?
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liophy
Famous Hero
Bulgarian
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posted January 09, 2007 12:58 PM |
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Same speed, but one has to strike first, right? About the magics - sure: bless, curse, weakness, stone skin, shield, bloodlust... all effecting the damage you inflict or receive.
About the Angel vs Titan. I assume you mean Archangel, because Titan is also upgraded. So - the AA has 30 attack, 30 deffence and fixed damage 50. Titan has 24-24. That means the actual damage of the AA will be 65, and the titan will do 36-51
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HeymlicH
Famous Hero
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posted January 09, 2007 03:02 PM |
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In the case you described both monsters have the same chance to win. This is based on the assumption that from the damage range (15-25) each value has the same probability. It sounds logical, but I didn't verify it.
Regarding Arch angel vs Titan: The AA will win, that's for sure.
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angelito
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
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posted January 09, 2007 03:40 PM |
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It's like liophy described it. You have to take the attack/defense difference into account also. And that's why AA will deal more damage.
Titan has 50 hp more than the Archangel. So if the Titan deals around 43 damage each hit, they need approx. 6 hits to kill an Archangel. If they are very lucky and deal their max. calculated damage each hit (51), they still will need 5 hits to kill the Archangel.
The Archangel on the other hand needs exact 5 hits (65 damage each hit). Every unit hits twice a round (attack and retail), which means, the Titans will be dead start round 3, coz Archangels start first.
____________
Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.
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william
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
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posted January 09, 2007 03:46 PM |
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I don't understand how the Titans damage will go down, like 40-60, but then it goes down because of it's attack and defense.
Hmm but yeh, AA might be better, but it can always come down to the hero, depending on the skills of the hero like Archery, or anything like that and the secondary skills attack defense etc etc, and artifacts.
But forgetting all those, AA might win cos it is faster and deals out more damage.
____________
~Ticking away the moments that
make up a dull day, Fritter and
waste the hours in an off-hand
way~
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bjorn190
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Jebus maker
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posted January 09, 2007 04:34 PM |
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Quote:
In the case you described both monsters have the same chance to win. This is based on the assumption that from the damage range (15-25) each value has the same probability. It sounds logical, but I didn't verify it.
Regarding Arch angel vs Titan: The AA will win, that's for sure.
It all depends on other factors:
if the creatures have 30 hps exactly, then the 15-30 damage creature has a larger chance to win, because in theory, he can win with 1 blow while the other creature needs 2 blows to win.
With the AA vs Titan, william is right, it depends on the hero stats, skills, artifacts, how the tactical moves are made. If the AA doesnt attack, the titan can shoot him down slowly.
Damage is only useful when it is done in a strategical and tactical way in order to win.
____________
I am the hope of the universe... I am the answer to all living things that cry out for peace... I am protector of the innocent... I am the light in the darkness... I am truth.
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JungleMan
Hired Hero
Funkenstein
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posted January 09, 2007 04:50 PM |
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I just wanted to ask if AA's damage is better then titan's, so 50 vs. 40-60, not dealt damage, just pure damage. Another example are champions(20-25) and dread knights(15-30), dread knight will surely win.
AA will defeat titan, that's for sure, especially when there are more groups, resurection owns almost no losses
Do you like more fixed or variable damage?
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Binabik
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted January 10, 2007 01:21 AM |
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Ignoring everything else and looking strictly at the damage number, the AA and Titan are exactly the same "on average". The Titan has a chance of dealing more damge than the AA, but it has exactly the same chance of dealing less damage.
When there is a range of damage, the actual damage is very close to the center of the range. It is a very steep bell curve, not a linear curve with all values within the range having an equal chance of occurring. In other words, with a Titan, damage of 41 does NOT have an equal chance as damage of 49. Damage of 49 has a *FAR* greater chance of happening.
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liophy
Famous Hero
Bulgarian
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posted January 10, 2007 09:52 AM |
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Quote:
Do you like more fixed or variable damage?
I can rely on fixed damage and make my plans, on variable damage i can only hope and pray.
Its the same as offense and leadership - what do you prefer offense or leadership?
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william
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
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posted January 10, 2007 09:56 AM |
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Quote:
With the AA vs Titan, william is right, it depends on the hero stats, skills, artifacts, how the tactical moves are made. If the AA doesnt attack, the titan can shoot him down slowly.
Thanks for that Bjorn.
Luck and Morale would also affect what could be more powerful, Titan might get good luck and deal more damage.
Soo many factor's come in when in battle's, so comparing can sometimes be hard when there are alot of other factors.
____________
~Ticking away the moments that
make up a dull day, Fritter and
waste the hours in an off-hand
way~
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Binabik
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted January 10, 2007 10:13 AM |
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Quote:
Luck and Morale would also affect what could be more powerful, Titan might get good luck and deal more damage.
If their att/def stats are equal, I don't *think* luck gives an advantage to one over the other. I think it will affect them equally.
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JungleMan
Hired Hero
Funkenstein
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posted January 10, 2007 10:20 AM |
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Sure it will. Creature with greater interval of damage can deal bigger damage, and then again they can deal lower damage.
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william
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
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posted January 10, 2007 10:25 AM |
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If you have higher luck, would that affect them differently?
____________
~Ticking away the moments that
make up a dull day, Fritter and
waste the hours in an off-hand
way~
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Binabik
Responsible
Legendary Hero
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posted January 10, 2007 10:43 AM |
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Edited by Binabik at 11:43, 10 Jan 2007.
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It doesn't work the way the manual says. The manual says "maximum damage" but that's not what luck does. Maximum damage implies that the Titans would do 60 damage, but that's not what happens. I emphasised that I *think* luck affects them equally because I'm not 100% positive about that and all my test data is on another comp. Bascially luck doubles the normal damage, but there are limitations. The limitations are what I'm not sure about.
I *think* what will happen is that the comp will pick the damage like it normally does. So with Titan that will be 50 on average. Then the damage will double to 100. And the AA damage will also double to 100.
Again I stress that I'm not sure about this. But for sure it does not do max damage like the manual says.
edit:
http://heroescommunity.com/viewthread.php3?TID=16975
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yasmiel
Supreme Hero
Former Chessmaster
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posted January 10, 2007 12:15 PM |
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Edited by yasmiel at 12:22, 10 Jan 2007.
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Quote:
When there is a range of damage, the actual damage is very close to the center of the range. It is a very steep bell curve, not a linear curve with all values within the range having an equal chance of occurring. In other words, with a Titan, damage of 41 does NOT have an equal chance as damage of 49. Damage of 49 has a *FAR* greater chance of happening.
Hmm.. i always thought thats not the case in H3..
In H5 damage 49 indeed has far greater chance to happen,.. along with 49.3, 49.7 and other similar damages...
However, doesn't H3 manual state that damage is picked at random for all creatures in one roll(and is always an integer), which is then multiplied with the number of creatures in stack... if that is the case... damage would indeed be - a linear curve.... which i preferred to h5's bell curve since it deemphasizes the damage differences between such 2 creatures like titan and angel. (in h5, its IMPOSSIBLE to have maximum (and minimum) damage roll with huge stacks of titans, in h3, chance is much higher, tho its still only like 5%)
As for the thread question i would prefer 50 to 40-60, simply because its always reliable, while 40-60 can roll 60-s even when 40 is enough and vice versa), .. this is just an opinion tho, some players prefer otherwise
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JungleMan
Hired Hero
Funkenstein
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posted January 10, 2007 12:21 PM |
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I agree with yasmiel. Damage 41 has same chance as 49,
100/21=4.7619... percent. You can see that while playing. Titan's dealt damage repeats rearly.
Smaller interval or even fixed damage is my choice, but it's interesting when max damage occurs and you don't expect it - and mofo is dead!!!
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