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ChaosDragon
Famous Hero
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posted May 22, 2007 07:39 AM |
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True, while they ignore pit lords, they gate and cast spells, and when the ignorers are low in numbers, pit lords are still at their full power, then they're finished by the ignored ones.
Never ignore lv 6 creatures no matter how bad they are, why? even the worst lv 6 creatures are almost usually the second most threatening after the lv 7, in some cases they're not, still they posses very dangerous threat.
About magma dragons, it's true they're the strongest lv 7 without the help of hero.
Without the help of a hero, the strongest 3 of all lv 7 are:
1. Magma Dragon
2. Black Dragon
3. Fallen Angel
If you don't believe me, test it yourself.
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Stella
Adventuring Hero
Little girl with a BIG sword:)
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posted May 22, 2007 10:18 AM |
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Edited by Stella at 10:47, 22 May 2007.
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Quote:
True, while they ignore pit lords, they gate and cast spells, and when the ignorers are low in numbers, pit lords are still at their full power, then they're finished by the ignored ones.
Never ignore lv 6 creatures no matter how bad they are, why? even the worst lv 6 creatures are almost usually the second most threatening after the lv 7, in some cases they're not, still they posses very dangerous threat.
About magma dragons, it's true they're the strongest lv 7 without the help of hero.
Without the help of a hero, the strongest 3 of all lv 7 are:
1. Magma Dragon
2. Black Dragon
3. Fallen Angel
If you don't believe me, test it yourself.
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-- I'm thinking the same way as you do about the level 6 creature thing. For example a lot of people say that the Dungeon's ShadowM is useless tho I think they can be very useful in many many situations (since they are both shooters and casters). They are very versatile creatures tho it is true that they are not the strongest shooters in the game.
-- The problem with the Magma Dragon is that when you are on a Siege - and you are attacking the castle NOT defending it - unless you have Teleport (on expert Light Magic level, cause the lesser levels can't be used to port over the castle walls) or Teleport Assault (and with that action your hero wastes a precious turn for just moving 1 unit instead of buffing the whole army or cast a destructive spell or something more useful.) you most likely have to wait for at least 3 or 4 rounds till they make a hole on the wall and they can attack somebody (of course without expert war-machines or the Earthquake spell). At least if the defenders won't come out sooner than that but they usually don't come out. And if they have some strong ranged troops they migt kill the majority of the MagmaDs before they could even hit anybody. The inability to fly is a huge disadvantage I believe.
-- The new Fallen Angels (I'd rather call them Vampiric Angels - sounds muck "cooler"/"darker" in my opinion  ) are my favourite level 7 unit now. The main problem with them is that they can't be recruited en mass in most cases (Let's hope they will be the alternative upgrade path for Haven in ToE.). And the secondary problem is, that tho they have an attack value of 35 and their maximum damage is 75, but the minimum damage is a disastrous _25_!!!! They really do need Expert Divine Strength and then I think they are awesome...
-- And all in all (unfortunately) BlackDragons are only fearful as long as the enemy level 7 unit is NOT fully buffed with light magic, cause in thet case a fully buffed (DivS,RMight,Endurance,Haste) Vampiric Angel can kill the Blackie easily cause poor Black Lizard can't be buffed at all.  In a full-buffed battle the Black Dragon would be the weakest of the 3 above mentioned contestants (BD, MD, FA). Magic immunity really is a double edged sword.
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ChaosDragon
Famous Hero
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posted May 22, 2007 10:55 AM |
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Since you talk about a hero helping creatures, then the fallen angels will die quickly to empowered lucky implosion than the black dragons attacked by fallen angels fully buffed.
Month 2 very good warlock player can have 3k dmg implosion which will kill 15 fallen angels instantly, without the second castle, even if fallen angels are buildable, their number will not reach 15 in month 2, i doubt it even reach 10, consider this on hard or heroic difficulty, and on those difficulty, a good warlock player will always have those 3k dmg implosion, if not 3k then 2k (this is empowered implosion without warlock luck occur), still it will make lots or pack of fallen angels die in a blink of an eye.
So i'd say that magic immunity is very good ability. And you forget the breath attack, fallen angel will never make two creatures disappear in a blink of an eye, but black dragon can.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted May 22, 2007 11:02 AM |
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Black dragon suits warlocks. They can't dispel, so a magic-immune level 7 unit is obligatory.. otherwise they'd just get pwned by puppermaster like the inferno's devils get.
Fallen angel is impossible to recruit, and will become much less "godly" with the introduction of vampirism spell (unless the bonuses will be cumulative, lol  Vampirised Blessed fallen angels with 35 baseatt, 75-75 damage and +100% life drain, wtf.) Still, spells are ultimate level7 unit killers, so implosion will wash the angels away despite their buffs and skills. or at least halve them if antimagic is casted.
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ChaosDragon
Famous Hero
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posted May 22, 2007 11:11 AM |
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Even with antimagic, they still suffer 1k or 1.5k dmg from implosion (expert irresistible), it's more wtf, also those fallen angels can be puppeted like devils, it's the most wtf thing  .
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Stella
Adventuring Hero
Little girl with a BIG sword:)
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posted May 22, 2007 11:20 AM |
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Edited by Stella at 11:26, 22 May 2007.
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Quote:
Since you talk about a hero helping creatures, then the fallen angels will die quickly to empowered lucky implosion than the black dragons attacked by fallen angels fully buffed.
Month 2 very good warlock player can have 3k dmg implosion which will kill 15 fallen angels instantly, without the second castle, even if fallen angels are buildable, their number will not reach 15 in month 2, i doubt it even reach 10, consider this on hard or heroic difficulty, and on those difficulty, a good warlock player will always have those 3k dmg implosion, if not 3k then 2k (this is empowered implosion without warlock luck occur), still it will make lots or pack of fallen angels die in a blink of an eye.
So i'd say that magic immunity is very good ability. And you forget the breath attack, fallen angel will never make two creatures disappear in a blink of an eye, but black dragon can.
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- - Hmm. Hmm. In your aspect you are right but you missed my point. What I said was _EQUAL_ battle. Cause let's suppose BOTH heroes can ONLY use Light magic. (That's what equal means.) I wanted to point out that it is a big disadvantage that the Black Lizards can't be made any stronger while the Magma Lizard and the Vampiric Angel CAN be a lot stronger.
- - It is also true that in a reversed situation - so if the heroes would be able to use Dark Magic or Destructive Magic the Blackies would get the upper hand. So what I wanted to say is: It is nice to resist the debuffs and the destructive spells but that also means that they can't get those great light magic buffs either.
- - And pretty pleeease when one sais Destructive magic why do they always use it with a Warlock character? Is there a Warlock player on all maps -especially with a perfect skill tree and artifact setup for the lucky nukes? Warlock are just 1 race out of the many but Light magic can be taught to ANYrace /ALL races and it is more or less EQUALLY strong for each of them cause neither of them has a racial bonus for it.And other heroes can capture a Dungeon town not just Warlocks and they can recruit Blackies as well.
- Hehe . I've promised alcibiades not to write too much about the same thing so I'll conclude my opinion:
-- Blackies are strong, tho their skill is sometimes useful, sometimes not (They can't be resurrected either for example while other level 7s can be.) Tho it is true that against a Dark Magic/Destructive Magic school user they are wonderful.
-- Warlocks are the strongest with Destructive magic, but NOT all warlords have the perfect lucky nuke setup at level 1  and NOT all nukers are Warlocks... So when one sais "Nuker" don't immediately relate it to "The PERFECT Nuker" race.
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P.S.: And one more thing: the battlefield is big enough so if the enemy has dragons I almost never get hit on 2 creatures unless the enemy dragon act first in Round 1 cause then it CAN hit 2 units of mine, but later on I do my best so that it can't happen again.
- And Puppet can be Cleansed by a light magic user... (since we were talking about mass hasted/blessed/R.Mighted Vampiric Angel stack there must be a light magic user around... )
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Stella
Adventuring Hero
Little girl with a BIG sword:)
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posted May 22, 2007 11:28 AM |
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Edited by Stella at 11:39, 22 May 2007.
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Quote:
Fallen angel is impossible to recruit, and will become much less "godly" with the introduction of vampirism spell (unless the bonuses will be cumulative, lol Vampirised Blessed fallen angels with 35 baseatt, 75-75 damage and +100% life drain, wtf.)
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- Woow!! Will there be a Vampiric spell? Haven't heard of it yet tho it sounds cool.... Will we get it in ToE?
- Unfortunately Dark Magic schools are most likely to get it and if so they'd really be better than Light Magic unless the "good guys" get something uber as well like Mass Resurrection.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted May 22, 2007 11:53 AM |
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EMIL4O123
Tavern Dweller
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posted May 22, 2007 01:17 PM |
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I'm 13 years old.
____________
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ChaosDragon
Famous Hero
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posted May 22, 2007 11:14 PM |
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Quote:
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- - Hmm. Hmm. In your aspect you are right but you missed my point. What I said was _EQUAL_ battle. Cause let's suppose BOTH heroes can ONLY use Light magic. (That's what equal means.) I wanted to point out that it is a big disadvantage that the Black Lizards can't be made any stronger while the Magma Lizard and the Vampiric Angel CAN be a lot stronger.
- - It is also true that in a reversed situation - so if the heroes would be able to use Dark Magic or Destructive Magic the Blackies would get the upper hand. So what I wanted to say is: It is nice to resist the debuffs and the destructive spells but that also means that they can't get those great light magic buffs either.
- - And pretty pleeease when one sais Destructive magic why do they always use it with a Warlock character? Is there a Warlock player on all maps -especially with a perfect skill tree and artifact setup for the lucky nukes? Warlock are just 1 race out of the many but Light magic can be taught to ANYrace /ALL races and it is more or less EQUALLY strong for each of them cause neither of them has a racial bonus for it.And other heroes can capture a Dungeon town not just Warlocks and they can recruit Blackies as well.
- Hehe . I've promised alcibiades not to write too much about the same thing so I'll conclude my opinion:
-- Blackies are strong, tho their skill is sometimes useful, sometimes not (They can't be resurrected either for example while other level 7s can be.) Tho it is true that against a Dark Magic/Destructive Magic school user they are wonderful.
-- Warlocks are the strongest with Destructive magic, but NOT all warlords have the perfect lucky nuke setup at level 1 and NOT all nukers are Warlocks... So when one sais "Nuker" don't immediately relate it to "The PERFECT Nuker" race.
-
P.S.: And one more thing: the battlefield is big enough so if the enemy has dragons I almost never get hit on 2 creatures unless the enemy dragon act first in Round 1 cause then it CAN hit 2 units of mine, but later on I do my best so that it can't happen again.
- And Puppet can be Cleansed by a light magic user... (since we were talking about mass hasted/blessed/R.Mighted Vampiric Angel stack there must be a light magic user around... 
Then it is clear that black dragon immunities are never a bad abilities.
And one more thing, why people always say that destructive is all about warlock, because destructive are crap without warlock, ofc academy are good too, but warlocks are far better. Also, light magic is good with any faction, but destructive is only with warlock, so it doesn't fair if the destructive user are not warlock, especially if we talk about black dragons, why? as Doomforge said above, Black Dragons only suit warlock, they don't suit any other heroes except warlocks, so it doesn't fair if we don't give warlock as their heroes.
Even in one on one fair fight, fallen angels never win againts black dragon, but the result is different if it's more than one vs more than one.
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Stella
Adventuring Hero
Little girl with a BIG sword:)
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posted May 22, 2007 11:42 PM |
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Edited by Stella at 23:43, 22 May 2007.
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Quote:
Then it is clear that black dragon immunities are never a bad abilities.
And one more thing, why people always say that destructive is all about warlock, because destructive are crap without warlock, ofc academy are good too, but warlocks are far better. Also, light magic is good with any faction, but destructive is only with warlock, so it doesn't fair if the destructive user are not warlock, especially if we talk about black dragons, why? as Doomforge said above, Black Dragons only suit warlock, they don't suit any other heroes except warlocks, so it doesn't fair if we don't give warlock as their heroes.
Even in one on one fair fight, fallen angels never win againts black dragon, but the result is different if it's more than one vs more than one.
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-- Hehe. I've promised alcibiades that I won't write too much about the same thing so this time I let it be your way. You won I give up.
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sheensher
Known Hero
and Slipknot FAn
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posted July 26, 2007 12:09 PM |
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Lv. 1 Peasant
Lv. 2 zombie
Lv. 3 minotaur guard
Lv. 4 Berserker
Lv. 5 Inquisitor
Lv. 6 Shadow Matriarh
Lv. 7 Spectral Dragon
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GenieLord
Honorable
Legendary Hero
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posted July 26, 2007 12:14 PM |
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Quote:
Lv. 1 Peasant
Lv. 2 zombie
Lv. 3 minotaur guard
Lv. 4 Berserker
Lv. 5 Inquisitor
Lv. 6 Shadow Matriarh
Lv. 7 Spectral Dragon
Our opinion is similar, here.
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Pivapivabeer
Adventuring Hero
Dont waste ur time readin this
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posted July 26, 2007 03:09 PM |
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Im just going to say strongest and weakest for fun.
Weakest: Strongest:
Lvl 1:Conscript----------------Assassin
Lvl 2 bsidian Gargoyle--------Marksman
Lvl 3:Sceptre------------------Master Hunter
Lvl 4:Berserker----------------Arch Mage
Lvl 5jinn Sultan-------------Silver Unicorn
Lvl 6:Warlord------------------Paladin
Lvl 7:Spectral Dragon----------Fallen Angel
I know you didn't ask about the strongest tiers (oh yah no offense about djinns being the weakest ) but i just wanted to put them in.
____________
Spider pig, spider pig, does whatever a spider pig does.
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wiseguy
Hired Hero
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posted July 27, 2007 10:16 PM |
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Lvl 1-Consricpts
Lvl 2-Zombies
Lvl 3- Bear riders
Lvl 4- Berserkers
Lvl 5 - Djinns
Lvl 6 - Pit Lords
LVl 7 - Spectral Dragons
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Don't talk with mouth open
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Bombur
Known Hero
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posted July 28, 2007 11:02 AM |
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Quote:
Lvl 1-Consricpts
Lvl 2-Zombies
Lvl 3- Bear riders
Lvl 4- Berserkers
Lvl 5 - Djinns
Lvl 6 - Pit Lords
LVl 7 - Spectral Dragons
Bear riders?They are amongst the strongest level 3 unit?Perhaps minotaurs or spectres?
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ismail222
Known Hero
The Cataclysm
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posted July 28, 2007 12:15 PM |
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1.peasent
2.zombie
3.stone golem
4.brawler
5.djin
6.shadow witch
7.bone dragon
<<<<<<<<<with regards >>>>>>>>>
____________
Ppl griveing,Ppl
Deceving,Ppl lying,Ppl dying
One Word : Life
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HartZa
Known Hero
watchout graveyards!
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posted July 29, 2007 01:17 AM |
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1.peasent
2.zombie
3.iron golem
4.brawler
5.hydra
6.wight
7.bone dragon
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Pivapivabeer
Adventuring Hero
Dont waste ur time readin this
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posted July 31, 2007 03:45 PM |
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Quote:
1.peasent
2.zombie
3.iron golem
4.brawler
5.hydra
6.wight
7.bone dragon
You think hydra is the worst? Compare its stats to a djinns.
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Spider pig, spider pig, does whatever a spider pig does.
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GenieLord
Honorable
Legendary Hero
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posted July 31, 2007 03:50 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
1.peasent
2.zombie
3.iron golem
4.brawler
5.hydra
6.wight
7.bone dragon
You think hydra is the worst? Compare its stats to a djinns.
Djinn Sultans are much better than the Inquisitors... Not that I prefer Djinns are something...
And you always have to look at the abilities as well.
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