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| Thread: The US always pissing and moaning about countries pissing and moaning about the US |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Geny
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted May 19, 2007 06:26 PM |
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Edited by Geny at 18:30, 19 May 2007.
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I found an article in Wikipedia and it says that Israel sucks and Japan rules. I was merely quoting the experts
Oh yeah? Well I want to see a link!
What's that?
You forgot where exactly did you find it?
That's the lamest excuse I've ever heard!!!
Now when I post something I check that it is correct.
The link below clearly explains why Serbia sucks:
Undeniable proof that Serbia sucks
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Nidhgrin
Honorable
Famous Hero
baking cookies from stardust
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posted May 19, 2007 06:29 PM |
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Yep, that's what I would have done too.
An act of pure noblicity 
Why is it that so many threads on the other side sooner or later drag Hitler into the discussion?  Or bush, for that matter! Hmm... wait, the latter isn't completely irrelevant in this thread
I won't take sides in this discussion because I have trouble understanding the whole concept of patriotism. Territorial pissing, sure  For king and country... no thanks 
Be it as it may, the US and its inhabitants sure do stir up a lot of emotions around the world. They're colourful to say the least, and color can't be a bad thing, now can it?
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~Vegetables don't spam~
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executor
Famous Hero
Otherworldly Ambassador
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posted May 19, 2007 07:44 PM |
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@Colonel_here
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Well I got opinion about Sparta and Athens from reading Peleponesian War by Thycidides, they did not seem to be really active in imposing their opinions and actions on other states, they seems to kept more neutral. Athens on other hand first established Delian Alliance, with centre being on island of Delos. Than forcebly moved that centre and the treasury to Athens. And I remeber that when island of Lesbos failed to bring in its share of money and ships, Athens send military force to wipe out all male population of the island.
All you have written is true, I know history well. Sparta was neutral sideforce till they won peloponesian war I, when they became first power in Greece. The they began to be 'nasty'. And even before they used to talk via war rather than diplomats. And they did have best-skilled (and well equipped) infantry in whole mediterranean, if not whole world.
Athens had military due to size and wealth (this in fact US and Athens have in common), not due to good training of troops, which were among worst-skilled soldiers in whole Greece, yet well equipped. Delian alliance was nothing else than a pilitical&economical alliance under Athens' hegemony. It was ment to protect Greece from Persia, but in fact was notthing but a tool for Athens to suppress their dominance. Of course, when Lesbos broke out, and refused to bow to Athen's diplomats (yes first they sent diplomats), they decided to strike, because otherwise alliance would fall apart. Yet Athens did not like to intevene military, preferred political&econical pressure as a 'superpower', till they were one...
I do not say US is not like Athens, I say only it is more like Sparta.
And bear in mind what US' 2nd president said about Athens.
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Understanding is a three-edged sword.
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Spectrum
Famous Hero
Plan B
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posted May 19, 2007 08:52 PM |
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This thread is headed in a direction that seems to me extremely pointless. I'm ofcourse talking about everyone going "Israel sucks" "No! Israel is the best!" "Yeah well look at germany" "What! Germany is so cool" and so on. (No, Baklava, I'm not blaming you, you just "quoted the experts")
You can't just say that country x is better than country y. What you can say is that "I think that counry x has better food/nicer people/nicer climate than country y Every country has something good about it - whether it's food, climate, nature, goverment (Yeah, right) or anything.
Two countries cannot be compared in terms of "which county is better". It should always be "Which countryis better at..." etc. And if people started comparing countries in that way, it would be offtopic. So maybe we should just skip the comparing countries with other countries part and concentrate on the point which, I understand, is that U.S. shouldn't complain when countries piss and moan about it If there even are any arguments left...
Thank you
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Aculias is like the male nipple of HC, TNT being the other one -Baklava
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Geny
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
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posted May 19, 2007 08:57 PM |
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Oh, yeah?
Well, Finland sucks too! And Luxembourg isn't far away as well!
So there.
Oh, and you welcome.
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SwampLord
Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
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posted May 19, 2007 08:57 PM |
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Then countries shouldn't complain when the US pisses and moans about them.(even though we're right)
Wastelands, anyone?
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Spectrum
Famous Hero
Plan B
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posted May 19, 2007 09:04 PM |
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Edited by Spectrum at 21:06, 19 May 2007.
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Quote:
Oh, yeah?
Well, Finland sucks too! And Luxembourg isn't far away as well!
You made a grammar mistake. HA!
I gonna be the more mature and decide not to say anything about Israel...
Oh what the heck You're the one always complaining about Israel's hot weather!
And what does the location of the country have to do with anything?
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Oh, and you welcome.
I knew someone was going to say that
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Wastelands, anyone?
Very soon, yes
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Aculias is like the male nipple of HC, TNT being the other one -Baklava
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SwampLord
Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
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posted May 19, 2007 09:24 PM |
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It's kinda funny how a political argument has descended into a spamfest. I like it.
uSa pwnz, every1 elz3 iz t3h no0bz!
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Spectrum
Famous Hero
Plan B
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posted May 19, 2007 09:29 PM |
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Oh well. No thread Baklava creates can remain serious for very long
And we should really stop spamming or we're definetely facing a -QP
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Aculias is like the male nipple of HC, TNT being the other one -Baklava
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Tenaka
Famous Hero
Makes sense
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posted May 19, 2007 09:37 PM |
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Quote:
This thread is headed in a direction that seems to me extremely pointless. I'm ofcourse talking about everyone going "Israel sucks" "No! Israel is the best!" "Yeah well look at germany" "What! Germany is so cool" and so on. (No, Baklava, I'm not blaming you, you just "quoted the experts")
...etc
Thanks, Spectrum, you're right, I got a bit drifted away.
...[grumpy]but I said 'I think'...[/grumpy]
Anyhow, let's get back on topic, alright...
...I'll be back! (when I find some arguments)
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SwampLord
Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
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posted May 19, 2007 09:43 PM |
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My only real issue with this thread is Shai-Hulud's "proof" that the US isn't really a democracy. Bush cannot order airline employees to search Senator Kerry and women rights activists- why would he want to? I think Shai-Hulud needs to take another look at his "proof".
Other then that, these are valid points- the US can be a little interfering/overbearing at times. But I cannot stress this enough- it is a democracy, the first modern democracy. To imply that it isn't, because of random airline searches and bills passed "in the middle of the night" without any complaining or publicity from the opposing side- passed unaniamously! is ridiculous.
Also, what do you mean, 0 Ayes and 0 Nays? A bill can't pass without a vote! And no bill, I repeat, no bill, can pass "in the dead of night" in the US today. The side that disagrees tells everyone so. And it is literally almost impossible in the US today to get a unanimous vote. In short? I don't accept any of Shai-Hulud's claims about american democracy not being a democracu as valid- there's simply too many holes in your examples.
Again, Shai-Hulud, unless you can give me concrete proof for all those claims, I do not believe them.
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Tenaka
Famous Hero
Makes sense
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posted May 19, 2007 10:11 PM |
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Quote:
My only real issue with this thread is Shai-Hulud's "proof" that the US isn't really a democracy.
If that's the problem:
On the election day in the year 2000, 173,000voters in Florida were not allowed to vote. Why? It all began a year before.
In the summer of 1999 Katherine Harris, who was both G.W.Bush's campaign cochairwoman AND Florida secretary of state in charge of elections, pais $4 million to Database Technologies to go through Florida's voter rolls and remove anyone "suspected" of being a former felon. She did so with the blessing of the governor of Florida, Jeb Bush. Hm. Does that name ring a bell? Yes, it is none other than GW's brother!
This meant that 31% of the black population in Florida couldn't vote! This was a clever move, as black Floridians overwhelmingly vote for the Democrats.
When you still think that this is reasonable, then I might as well tell you that Database also incluided people with names "similar" to the actual felons.
But apparently, this did not suffice for GWB's campaign men? Another 8000 Floridians were removed from the voter rolls because Database used a list supplied by another state, a state which claimed that all the names on the list were former convicted felons who had since moved to Florida.
It turns out that the felons on the list had served their time and had all their voting privileges reinstated. And there were others on the list who had committed only minor misdemeanors - such as parking violations or littering.
And which state was it that sent in this bill?
Texas"
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SwampLord
Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
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posted May 19, 2007 10:27 PM |
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I find it interesting that all the people who are convinced America is no longer a democracy are not from this country.
Also, I believe the Supreme Court itself legalized the recount- they would have found if there had been any such misdemeanors.
It's also funny how everyone wants USA to stay out of their business, and then they're all saying "OMG Bush is t3h evil"! Why does it concern you?
Also, I found what you were talking about, and nowhere does it say that Bush campaigners bribed people to prevent others from voting. It was merely a flaw in the system. Please cite proof for your claim (note: I am not denying it happened, merely that it may not have happened the way you think it did. Please give me the website.)
Don't want to turn this into a political arguement, (more so than it is already) but a certain Senator named John Kerry had the same people who served alongside him in Vietnam denounce him as fit for presidency, when Vietnam was one of his claims of heroism. Hmm.....
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Tenaka
Famous Hero
Makes sense
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posted May 19, 2007 10:39 PM |
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John Kerry was never named so far, I think. He was the 2004 candidate. Neither do I think that any of the other president candidates were any better. But I won't go into that one, as that'll just make things more complicated. Let's focus one one subject...
And as for the recount, when Al Gore was behind with only 66 votes, and STILL gaining, the recount was stopped by the Suppreme Court.
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SwampLord
Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
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posted May 19, 2007 11:00 PM |
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66 of what kind of votes?
Again, website/source, for earlier claims, please.
I'm sorry, I won't be able to respond, hit post limit. Darn.
I'll attempt to respond one more time. Please state which books these were? (sorry if I'm being a bit of a jerk, but these are kinda incredulous claims).
Darnit, I want to reply to Shai-Hulud! (not an angry reply!)
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted May 19, 2007 11:01 PM |
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People, please, stay off-topic!  Swamplord, Tenaka and similar - if you continue like this we'll completely get back to the point... And that's what no one wants, isn't it?
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Oh yeah? Well I want to see a link!
Ha!
There's also many other experts, I can give you links to them.
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No thread Baklava creates can remain serious for very long
No need for flattery my friend...
But, ok, let me put a tiny bit of ontopicness here, lest I get castrated or (God forbid) get a -QP:
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It's also funny how everyone wants USA to stay out of their business, and then they're all saying "OMG Bush is t3h evil"! Why does it concern you?
Cause you won't stay out of people's business
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"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Tenaka
Famous Hero
Makes sense
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posted May 19, 2007 11:02 PM |
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No websites, only books...
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Shai-Hulud
Known Hero
Sicomor
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posted May 20, 2007 12:13 AM |
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I am doing this again.I know I am stupid!
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My only real issue with this thread is Shai-Hulud's "proof" that the US isn't really a democracy. Bush cannot order airline employees to search Senator Kerry and women rights activists- why would he want to? I think Shai-Hulud needs to take another look at his "proof".
1.Does someone need to make a complete 4th grade essay to get someone understand the main ideas? Where i specifically said USA is a fascist country ? More thant that.... I SPECIFICALLY SAID :
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the main idea is a bit exaggerated, but the fact that USA democracy got too much "dirt" on it should be considered.
You simply don't want to get it, do you?
Did you even check the name of the site? It says the Guardian.co.uk. I am no britain, but at least I have heard of the famous The Guardian. If that doesn't have a bit of credibility then who does? Of course, it must have a bit of exaggeration in its overall theme to draw attention beacuse its a newspaper, but what you must understand , i say it once more, are the facts!
You are so confident on the fact that you know everything cause you are there that you refuse to read more. If you are really interested in facts and otherwise and want to research, well go ahead. Do some travelling, do some research. Maybe you'll learn something.
2. Learn to process the information you get. Find out more. Don't resume at bashing whatever others write.
Here you go, put it in your mouth.Happy now? Govtrack.us are liars! Now you caught me!
Information I usually pass I don't just take it from one website and trow it in. Some of the facts I found on the guardian.co.uk I checked on wikipedia or other websites on that matter. One source I am sure is never enough. But multiple sources should start give you some thinking.
GOOGLE IT my momma taught me!
As ending, I merely have to say I am stupid. Stupid for trying to really have a discussion with a fanatic.
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SwampLord
Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
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posted May 20, 2007 04:56 AM |
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I am not a fanatic. BTW, about the fascist thing, you did link to an article called "Fascist America, in 10 easy steps". I asked for proof about the bill, because if the bill is as controversial as it seems, it is unthinkable that it would pass unaniamously. I'm still reading through it. There's a lot of stuff, most of which I believe is standard military funding. I'll post more about that later.
The president already has control of the military- he can order them anywhere he wants for 90 days, I believe, before needing Congress's approval. Also, I realize you are not a native English speaker, but by saying Democracy in US= No democracy, you are saying that democracy does not exist in this country. We still vote. Things like the wiretapping are, it is true, bad, but that was under review as well- I forget what the outcome was, let me check and I'll edit it in. I believe The point is, we still have a democracy. By no means am I a fanatic, either. I just believe that our country is still a democracy. There is some "dirt", true, but that doesn't mean they control who we vote for.
And, finally, the whole point of the US government is that no person has absolute power. The system of checks and balances keeps this from happening.
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Colonel_here
Adventuring Hero
Descendant of Ghengis Khan
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posted May 20, 2007 05:04 AM |
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Fascist government is government which has not only the president/prime minister who is a military leader but which has most of the political representatives, bureacracy and other governmental officials in military uniform.
So with this definition in mind US doesn't fit.
I also believe that US President has only the right to deploy marines without getting approval of Congress first.
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"Only a fool fights a battle he knows he can not win" - Ghengiz Khan
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