Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info mods forum | HOMM4: info CTG forum | HOMM5: info mods forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Heroes 7+ Altar of Wishes > Thread: Gadi's Skill System Proposal
Thread: Gadi's Skill System Proposal
GenieLord
GenieLord


Honorable
Legendary Hero
posted April 07, 2008 08:08 PM bonus applied by alcibiades on 13 Apr 2008.
Edited by GenieLord at 13:26, 21 Apr 2008.

Gadi's Skill System Proposal



Work in progress, incomplete yet

According to my proposal, every hero has 7 skill slots.

Might hero:
1 Slot for Racial Skill
3 Slots for Might Skills
1 Slot for Magical Skills
2 Slots for Bonus Skills

Magic hero:
1 Slot for Racial Skill
1 Slot for Unique Magics
2 Slots for Magical Skills
1 Slot for Elemental Magics
1 Slot for Might Skills
1 Slot for Bonus Skills

When the hero gains a level, s/he chooses one of his/her free slots, and then options for this slot will appear. If a Wizard chooses one of his Magical Skills slots, he'll have to choose from Enchanting, Illusion Image and Sorcery, for example. The hero can also press on a full slot, to improve the skill there (from basic to advanced mastery, for instance) or to add abilities to it. Also consider that according to my concept, every faction has Might heroes and Magic heroes.

Might Skills

1. Offense: Increases damage dealt by your creatures in melee combat by 5%, 10% with advanced mastery, 20% with expert.
-Battle Rage: Minimum and maximum damage of creatures in hero's army is increased by 1.
-Fist of Iron: Every time a creature in the hero's army causes a maximum damage on a melee attack, a stunning effect will be added.
-Tactics: Increases the area in which the hero can rearrange creatures before combat.

2. Defense: Decreases damage dealt to your creatures in melee combat by 10%, 20% with advanced mastery and 30% with expert.
-Magical Protection: Decreases damage dealt to your creatures by magic attacks by 15%.
-Evasion: Decreases damage dealt to your creatures by ranged attacks by 20%.
-Fortify: a group of 3 creatures or more adjecant to each other can fortify together. The turn of the creature that activated the fortifying will pass, but all the creatures' defense will increase by 30%.  

3. Archery: Increases damage dealt by hero's creatures in ranged combat by 5%, 10% with advanced, 20% with expert.
-Accuracy: there's +15% chance that a ranged attack will cause maximum damage.
-Arrow Blader: The supply of ammo for shooters increases by 20%.  
-Force Arrow: there's a small chance that a shot will hit anyway in a row, like the Mage's attack.

4. Leadership: Increases moral of all creatures in hero's army by 1.
-Troops Leader: The hero can choose (as an actived ability) one creatures that the army creatures will see as a leader. Friendly units' morale in the adjacent tiles to the chosen creature is increased by 1.
-Conqueror: During a siege, all the friendly units get a bonus of +1 initiative and +1 morale.
-Recruitment: Increases weekly growth of 1st, 2nd and 3rd level creatures by +3, +2 and +1 respectively. Hero must be stationed within the friendly town on the last day of the week for effect to take place.

5. Empowering: After a melee hit, the damage and the chance for a critical hit, for the next hit is increased by 4%, 8% with advanced mastery and 16% with expert,
-Empowered Spells: Spells casted by creatures for the second time will be stronger by 20% than they were on the first time.
-Melee Strengths Shot: If a ranged unit preforms melee attack, its next shot will cause +25% damage.  
-Rage of Paralyzed: If unit is paralyzed, frozen, blinded, etc, its next attack after it gets back to the game, will cause +25% damage.

6. Diplomatics: Increases the chance that creature will want to join your army instead of fighting/fleeing by 15%, 30% with advanced mastery, 50% with expert.
-Nagogation: When creatures demand payment in order to join, the hero can nagogate with them, in order to reduce the cost (up to 50% reduction).
-Charisma: When only a part of the neutral creatures want to join the hero, his/her charisma will assist him to convince more to come (up to 50% increasement in the quantity of the creatures).
-Reputation: After a stack of neutral creatures joined you, other creatures of the same stack (and their upgrades) will be more likely to want to join you as well.

7. Logistics: Increases hero's movement speed over land by 10%, 20% with advanced mastery, 30% with expert.
-Pathfinder: Reduces penalty for moving through rough terrain by 50%.
-Scouting: Hero receives +4 to his range of view and gets an ability to see precise number of creatures in neutral troops, in enemy armies, towns and garrisons within his range of view.
-Cartographer: Knows spots of interest (such as mines and towns). When the hero passes near them, but still in a distance that they cannot be seen from, they will appear on the mini-adventure map.

8. Vitality: +1 HP for 1st level creatures and +2 HP to 2nd level creatures in hero's army. With advanced mastery, +3 HP to 3rd level creatures, +4 HP to fourth level creatures and +5 HP to 5th level creatures. With expert mastery, +7 HP to 6th level creatures and +12 HP to 7th level creatures.
-Power of Life: Healing and resurrection is more effective on living creatures in hero's army.
-Survival: There's 30% chance that if a several stacks were killed at once, one of them will remain alive with 1 HP.
-The Greater the Stronger: Large creatures in hero's army recieve a bonus of 2 HP.  

9. Estates: Hero contributes 100+10%X[Hero level] gold pieces per day to your cause, 250+10%X[Hero level] with advanced mastery and 500+10%X[Hero level] with expert.
-Tax Lien: every dwelling on the adventure map which is captured by the kindgom, give it 100 gold per a turn.
-Mines Owner: At the beginning of every week, the kingdom recieves 3-6 randomal resources.
-Trader: When the hero trades in the town marketplace, there's an effect that another marketplace in the kindgom would add: buying resources is cheaper.

Bonus Skills

1. Enchantment: Allows the hero to enchant an artifact with an additional minor effect. The chances of the enchanting to succeed is [Spell Power]X10%, [Spell Power]X20% with advanced mastery and [Spell Power]X30% with expert. Effects added will be more powerful with better mastery in the skill.
-Curse of Revenge: When the hero loses in battle, it will curse automatically one of his artifacts (chosen randomally) with a minor effect (like a 250 gold daily tax payment), so the winner (the enemy) will recieve the artifact cursed.
-Increased Value: After artifatcs are enchanted, their price will increase by 25% if they are sold at the artifact market.
-Mark of the Enchanter: The artifacts are marked by the hero and their bonus effects won't work if they are taken by enemy heroes.

2. Luck: Increases luck of all creatures in hero's army by 1, by 2 with advanced mastery, and by 3 with expert.
-Soldier's Luck: Guarantees that useful combat abilities of creatures in hero's army will trigger more often.
-Resourcefulness: The hero tends to find more gold and resources and be more lucky overall.
-Magic Resistance: Increases magic resistance of all creatures in hero's army by 15%. Creatures are more likely to avoid enemy magic.

3. Scholar: Allows the Hero to teach other heroes spells from his/her spellbook. The spells taught can be from the 3rd circle or lower, with advanced mastery 4th circle or lower, and 5th circle or lower with expert.
-Magic Intensification: If the hero teaches a magic hero 3 or more spells of the same school, the skill of Magic school will get better (from basic to advanced mastery, for example) for both heroes.
-Enlighten Veteran: If the hero's level is half or less than the level of the hero s/he teaches, the teaching hero will be able to teach an ability of one of the skills they have in common.
-Secret Knowledge: Spells that were taught to the hero by Scholar skill cannot be learned by enemy hero using Eagle Eye.

4. Enlightenment: Hero receives +1 to one of his primary stats for every four levels including the levels already got and + 5% bonus to the experience gained, 10% with advanced mastery and +15% with expert.
-Eagle Eye: Allows hero to learn an unknown spell used by an enemy hero or creature in combat (hero must be able to learn the spell with regards to his level in this school of magic).
-Intelligence: Increases normal maximum mana by 50%.
-Mysticism: doubles the rate of mana reganaration.

5. Sorcery: Speeds up hero's casting in combat. Interval between two consecutive spell casts is reduced by 10%, 20% with advanced mastery, 30% with expert.
-Arcane Training: Reduces casting costs of all spells by 20%.
-Magic Insight: Allows a hero to learn magic spells of the third circle regardless of actual skills in the respective schools of magic.
-Mana Theft: Once oer a battle, only when the hero finishes all his/her mana, s/he is able to use Mana Theft. Using this ability will take from the enemy one mana for every Spell Power point that the hero has.

6. Magic Mirror: There's 5% chance that spells will be reflected to other creature on the battlefield, randomally. 10% with advanced mastery, and 15% with expert.
-Reflection: if an enemy creature casts an offensive spell on one of the creatures in the hero's army, the spell has a 20% to be reflected back to itself.  
-Mirror Blessings: When two friendly creatures stand one next to each other, positive effects on one of them will effect also the other. The effect will be gone in the moment one of them moves.
-Mirror Fear: Frightful attack has a 20% chance to affect also the creature that caused it.

7. Herbalist: The hero can waste movement points on the adventure map, in order to create potions that he'll be able to give creatures on battefield. Type of potion is dependent on the terrain, rivers and seas around, and stonger with better mastery in the skill.
-Recipes: Allows the hero to see the recepies of all the existing potions that can be made.
-Spot Herbs: Herbs will appear on the mini-adventure map.
-Summon Herbs: this special ability can be activated on the adventure map. It will take a half of the hero's movement, but will summon to him all the herbs in a radious of 6 tiles from him/her.

8. Illusion Image: The hero can duplicate his/her creatures. The clone will be killed in the moment it is attacked, but it will look to the enemy like the same creatures exactly for the enemy, and will be able to attack. Every time a single clone appears. With expert mastery, clones will be incorporeal.
-The Clone's Confusion: The attacks of both duplicated creature and both its clone may cause Confusion to the attacked enemy. This effect will be gone when the clone is killed.
-Horde of Clones: Instead of creating one clone that can attack, the hero can choose to create many clones of the creature (3-5 for small creature, 2-4 for a large creature), that cannot attack or move, but again, they all look like the original creature for the enemy.
-Duplicate Effects: Positive effects on the duplicated creature will affect also the clone.

Elemental Magics

Every spells out of the unique spell schools will have an element, out of the four: Fire, Water, Earth and Air. Both Might and Magic heroes can learn Elemental Magic school in order to increase the power of spells from the same element.

3. Fire Magic
-Master of Flames
-Master of Magma
-Master of Inferno

4. Water Magic
-Master of Winter
-Master of Depths
-Master of Whirlpools

5. Earth Magic
-Master of Rock
-Master of Mud
-Master of Earthquakes

6. Air Magic
-Master of Wind
-Master of Clouds
-Master of Lightnings

Unique Magics

Magic heroes can learn a unique magic. Each Magical faction is specialized with one unique magic school: Arcane Magic for Academy, Death Magic for Necropolis, Runic Magic for Fortress, Druidic Magic for refuge (sounds like I believe my faction will be in H6. lol), and Blood Magic for Dungeon. Ofcourse that every magical hero can choose any unique magic school s/he wants, but the faction is supposed to work the best with its speciality. However, this time, I don't want each faction to have only one kind of spells (like only blessings, only curses, etc). Therefore, every magic school has a several aspects. Its spells are based on them. This gives every magical faction more variety.

1. Arcane Magic - Suited for Wizards
(Summoning, Animation, Creation)

2. Death Magic - Suited for Necromancers
(Curses, Destruction, Raise Dead)

3. Runic Magic - Suited for Dwarves
(Blessing, Destruction, Protection)

4. Druidic Magic - Suited for Druids
(Healing, Protection, Summoning)

5. Blood Magic - Suited for Warlocks
(Destruction, Sacrifice, Blessings)

6. Mind Magic - Suited for Mindflayers
(Control, Animation, Curses)

Bonus Skills

As you may have noticed, both Might and Magic heroes have a "Bonus skill slot". The hero can use this slot for any skill (except of unique magic skills). The hero can also use it for War-Mechines. But remember, you can never know what will be options be, and may get things you don't really want.

I'm showing here also a new concept of upgrading war mechines.
Ballista -> Harpoon
First Aid Tent -> Curing Tent
Ammo Cart -> Ammo Wagon
Catapult -> Fire Catapult

And about the Catapult:
Am I the only one that thinks that it doesn't make sense that the hero carries with him a huge heavy mechine, which appears only on a siege, but doesn't bother him/her in the rest of the time?
My idea is to give the hero the option to carry the Catapult or to leave it in the town (s/he can also give it to other heroes). The point is that heroes with Catapult will have penalty of 3 movement points. You must be thinking, so what if hero attacks a town without a Catapult? What will his/her chance be without many flayers? So my answer is to allow creatures to attack the town walls.

1. Ballista: Allows manual control of the Ballista, but the shots may come out not exact. With advanced mastery, the shots are always exactly according to the hero's wish, and with expert mastery, the Ballista gains one extra shot.
-Upgrade to Harpoon: The hero can upgrade his/her Ballista to a Harpoon. This can be done only in a town with a blacksmith. The Harpoon doesn't have the arrows limint that the Ballista has, it causes 50% more damage, and it has 30% more HP.
-Fire Arrows: Ballista/Harpoon shots cause extra minor fire damage.
-Steel Arrows: Ballista/Harpoon shots have 30% chance to stun the attacked creature.

2. First Aid Tent: Allows manual control of the First Aid Tent. With advanced mastery, heals 20% better, and with expert mastery, the tent can heal twice each time.
-Upgrade to Curing Tent: The hero can upgrade his/her First Aid Tent to a Curing Tent. This can be done only in a town with a blacksmith. Curing tent can also remove poison, and it has 30% to heal some of the dead creatures so they'll be able to fight.
-Cure disease: The First Aid/Curing Tent is able to cure diseases.
-Poison Tent: The hero's First Aid Tent receives an ability to damage enemy creatures.

3. Ammo Cart: Increases the quantity of ammo carried in the cart by 15%, by 30% with advanced mastery and by 50% with expert mastery.
-Upgrade to Ammo Wagon: The hero can upgrade his/her Ammo Cart to a Ammo Wagon. This can be done only in a town with a blacksmith. Ammo wagon has twice HP, and contains 50% more ammo than the cart.
-Carry Artifacts: The hero can put artifacts s/he's not using in the Ammo Cart/Wagon, and if s/he loses, the enemy won't get them. However, if the Ammo Cart/Wagon is destoryed, the artifacts will be destoryed as well.
-Extra Supply: There's a bonus of 25% to the supply the Ammo Cart/Wagon can carry.

4. Catapult: Allows manual control of the Catapult, but the shots may come out not exact. With advanced mastery, the shots are more exact, and with expert mastery, they are always exact.
-Upgrade to Fire Catapult: The hero can upgrade his/her Catapult to a Fire Catapult. This can be done only in a town with a blacksmith. Fire Catapult deals 50% of the damage to the wall parts adjacent to the one it hit strictly.
-Double Shot: The {Fire} Catapult can shot twice.
-Attack Tower: The {Fire} Catapult does 25% more damage to Guard Towers of the attacked town.

But remember, this is a bonus skill slot, and you don't have to choose one of the war mechines skills. You'll have also the option to choose from other skills in other groups.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Drunk_Lord
Drunk_Lord


Known Hero
very happy hero :)
posted April 08, 2008 01:37 PM

So much skills... gives me a headache. Nice ideas GL About the vampirism I think it fits nicely in Death Magic.
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
GenieLord
GenieLord


Honorable
Legendary Hero
posted April 08, 2008 01:48 PM
Edited by GenieLord at 13:49, 08 Apr 2008.

Thanks.
What's more important for me is the hero skill system, (rather than the skills themselves) that gives Might and Magic heroes the structure of the hero type. I'll consider what to do with Vampirism, haven't decided yet.

Anyway, I think that it might be weird to leave a free slot for Elemental Magic to the Might heroes. Maybe it should be only bonus option for them, cause they might not need it at all.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Golemcrafter
Golemcrafter


Promising
Famous Hero
Unlimited Fantasy Master
posted April 09, 2008 07:15 PM

I think, that the whole system is good and clear, I just have some problems with some of your skills:

1. Arrow Blader (Double Arrow: There is 20% chance that the creature will shoot two arrows in a row at one creature. That is just an idea, but I think that the whole skill should be changed.)

2. Reputation (I think that is a bit overpowered. How about: After a stack of neutral creatures joined you, other creatures of the same stack (and their upgrades) will be more likely to want to join you as well.)

3. Cartographer (Hmm... What about that? Acclerated Movement )The hero won't loose movement points if he collects resources, capture mines or visites building on the map.))

4. The Greater The Stronger (Give the increase in per cent, so higher level creatures can gain more HP and not just that +2.)

5. Enchantement (Good idea, but how do you imagine the skill in the game?)

6. Reflection (The per cent number is too high, it's almost 50%! Reduce it a bit!)

7. Mirror Fear (Do not concentrate about just one ability! Use more or at least point more abilites!)

8. Herbalist (No problem here, it is just a bit complicated to me. Can explain this skill a bit deeper?)

9. Mirror Imagine (I'd like to have something like this: Illusion Chaos (After a creature is duplicated, they are going to mix up themselves, so the enemyies won't be able to decide, which creature is the clone.))

10. Vampirism (A strongly overpowered skill even for the creatures Oh, wait, I see it now! Just mark the word "one" in your skill description! )

11: Unique Magics (Don't you want to add "Mind Magic"?)

This is my PERSONAL comment! I think that overall you did a great job! Well done GL!

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
GenieLord
GenieLord


Honorable
Legendary Hero
posted April 09, 2008 07:41 PM
Edited by GenieLord at 19:44, 09 Apr 2008.

Thank you very much for this feedback. Constructive criticism is what I need now.

Quote:
1. Arrow Blader (Double Arrow: There is 20% chance that the creature will shoot two arrows in a row at one creature. That is just an idea, but I think that the whole skill should be changed.)
I don't have this ability. Maybe you mixed two abilities accidentally?

Quote:
2. Reputation (I think that is a bit overpowered. How about: After a stack of neutral creatures joined you, other creatures of the same stack (and their upgrades) will be more likely to want to join you as well.)
I agree. Ability changed.

Quote:
3. Cartographer (Hmm... What about that? Acclerated Movement )The hero won't loose movement points if he collects resources, capture mines or visites building on the map.))
I still think that assitance with spoting things is more useful.

Quote:
4. The Greater The Stronger (Give the increase in per cent, so higher level creatures can gain more HP and not just that +2.)


Quote:
5. Enchantement (Good idea, but how do you imagine the skill in the game?)
Might and Magic 6 has a spell named "Enchant Item" (Maybe other M&M, too, but I played only 6). Maybe Heroes 6 can have an Enchantement spell as well? Maybe as an adventure spell?

Quote:
6. Reflection (The per cent number is too high, it's almost 50%! Reduce it a bit!)
I agree. Reduced.

7. Mirror Fear (Do not concentrate about just one ability! Use more or at least point more abilites!)

Quote:
8. Herbalist (No problem here, it is just a bit complicated to me. Can explain this skill a bit deeper?)
Like we have resources on the adventure map, there would be herbs. They are much smaller. They can be hiden under chests, resources, etc. They don't take a tile on the adventure map. If you collect them, you can make potions. I'll write the herbs and the recepies later.

Quote:
9. Mirror Imagine (I'd like to have something like this: Illusion Chaos (After a creature is duplicated, they are going to mix up themselves, so the enemyies won't be able to decide, which creature is the clone.))
Sounds excellent. The problem is that such ability would be completely overpowered.

10. Vampirism (A strongly overpowered skill even for the creatures Oh, wait, I see it now! Just mark the word "one" in your skill description! )

Quote:
11: Unique Magics (Don't you want to add "Mind Magic"?)
An excellent idea. I'll think how to fit this kind of thing in. Maybe for Mindflayers or Faceless faction?

Quote:
This is my PERSONAL comment! I think that overall you did a great job! Well done GL!
Thank you very much. This feedback really helped me a lot.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
bixie
bixie


Promising
Legendary Hero
my common sense is tingling!
posted April 09, 2008 08:03 PM

so good it needs to be stolen.

i'll do the honours

*Yoink!*
____________
Love, Laugh, Learn, Live.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted April 09, 2008 09:56 PM

Pretty good, but balance is way off on some of them. Sorry, but Vampirism is just a bad idea. This is one of the most powerful spells in Heroes 5 (= free creeping as soon as you get one fast or moderatly tough creature), and giving it as an ability seems to me a bad idea. Magic Mirror is a cool ability as it is now, but come on, who wants to invest 3 levels in it to have a 10 % chance for it to trigger? Of course, numbers are just balancing and can be changed.

Many good ideas abound, but the whole system smells way too much of Heroes 3 for me.
____________
What will happen now?

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
GenieLord
GenieLord


Honorable
Legendary Hero
posted April 09, 2008 10:12 PM

@Bixie: I'll be watching you!

Quote:
Pretty good, but balance is way off on some of them. Sorry, but Vampirism is just a bad idea. This is one of the most powerful spells in Heroes 5 (= free creeping as soon as you get one fast or moderatly tough creature), and giving it as an ability seems to me a bad idea. Magic Mirror is a cool ability as it is now, but come on, who wants to invest 3 levels in it to have a 10 % chance for it to trigger? Of course, numbers are just balancing and can be changed.

Many good ideas abound, but the whole system smells way too much of Heroes 3 for me.

I got convinced. Vampirism deleted. Don't worry, I'll come up with something to replace it.
And it feels like H3 cause some of the H3 skills (and the H2 skills!) that turned to abilities in H5, turned back to skills here. Obviously, the better the best, cause you don't want the same skills or abilities to appear all the time when you choose the slot.
I changed numbers of Magic Mirror to: 5%, 10% and 15%. What do you think?

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted April 09, 2008 10:38 PM

15 % is still not much, but better. I guess it's a matter of temper, I like skills to be more reliable, but some people thought resistance was a great skill in Heroes 3 ...

Personally, I'm not really convinced we need that many skills. It'll certainly make planning a nightmare. I agree sometimes it can be a bit tiresome to have the same skill pop up on every level up for 10 levels, but the charm of Heroes 5 was that the limited number of skills would actually give you a fair chance of planning your advancement and making a strategy for your skill evolution.

Personally, I would like to know whether you've thought about skill interaction and synergy, or whether all skills will be completely unrelated?
____________
What will happen now?

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
Seraphim
Seraphim


Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
posted April 09, 2008 10:56 PM

At unique,how about chaos magic?

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
GenieLord
GenieLord


Honorable
Legendary Hero
posted April 10, 2008 02:45 PM
Edited by GenieLord at 13:24, 21 Apr 2008.

Quote:
Personally, I'm not really convinced we need that many skills. It'll certainly make planning a nightmare. I agree sometimes it can be a bit tiresome to have the same skill pop up on every level up for 10 levels, but the charm of Heroes 5 was that the limited number of skills would actually give you a fair chance of planning your advancement and making a strategy for your skill evolution.
I have an idea that might solve it:
If you chose a slot, and you don't want to choose any of the options, what about having the option to go back and to choose other slot?
And also consider that it wouldn't to be hard to plan, probably eaier than H5, because:
1. With this system, when you want a skill, you can just press the right slot, and there's a higher chance that it will appear than the chance in H5 (where it's always out of all the skills, and you're effect is very small).
2. After you fulfilled a slot, if you press on it when you level up, the options would be to improve the mastery or to add abilities, so it's easier when you decide to focus on one skill.

Quote:
Personally, I would like to know whether you've thought about skill interaction and synergy, or whether all skills will be completely unrelated?
Ofcourse. But I need to put thought into it, so it will probably be ready after I make the recipes for the potions of the herbs.

Quote:
At unique,how about chaos magic?
Part of the unique magics will be belong to chaos, so it can't be a magic by itself, more of a category.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
GenieLord
GenieLord


Honorable
Legendary Hero
posted April 13, 2008 10:27 AM
Edited by GenieLord at 13:23, 21 Apr 2008.

Heroes with the skill Herbalist will be able to see herbs on the adventure maps. They are like resources, but much smaller. They can be hidden under chests, resources, etc. They don't take a tile on the adventure map. Using those herbs, the hero can make potions. The potions can be used on the creatures at the battlefield.

There are 4 types of common herbs:

Phiolic - Red
Grytle - Blue
Fonsol - Green
Tedour - Yellow

Recipes of potions

Healing Potion - Purple. Heals 1-100 hit points for the chosen creature.
Mix 1 Phiolic and 1 Grytle.

Mana Restoring Potion - Turquoise. Restores 1-7 mana of hero/chosen creatures.
Mix 1 Fonsol and 1 Grytle.

Speeding Potion - Orange. Increases speed by 1-4 temporally (for 1 turn with Basic mastery, 2 turns with advanced and 3 with expert) for the chosen creature.
Mix 1 Phiolic and 2 Tedours.

Curing Potion - Blue. Cures any negative effect on the creature, including Torpor, Blinding, etc.
Requires 3 Grytles.

Raging Potion - Red. Increases attack and speed of the creature by 50%, until it recieves any kind of damage.
Requires 4 Phiolic.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted April 13, 2008 10:53 AM

Ok, it's been some time, but I'll like to give you some more detailed feedback to your suggestion, as I think it deserves it!

Quote:
According to my proposal, every hero has 7 skill slots.

Might hero:
1 Slot for Racial Skill
3 Slots for Might Skills
1 Slot for Magical Skills
2 Slots for Bonus Skills

Magic hero:
1 Slot for Racial Skill
1 Slot for Unique Magics
2 Slots for Magical Skills
1 Slot for Elemental Magics
1 Slot for Might Skills
1 Slot for Bonus Skills


This "fixed" system is something I would really like to object to; it goes against one of my most fundamental mantras in developing: Don't make restrictions, make posibilities. I think putting limits like: "Every might hero must have 1 but only 1 magic skill" is a grave mistake - let that be free to decide for the player.

Obviously, things can be tweaked - for instance, Magic Skills can have lower chances to occur for the Might Hero, which is fine, making an all-magic build less likely. Furthermore, the Magic Hero should have stats that doesn't favor such a build - for instance, the current Demon Lord construction puts a very natural limitation to the use of making him all-magic, to give a good example - but there is a crucial difference in making the build not viable and not possible.

One of the very strengths of a really good game is the durability, and in order to have long time durability, a game needs to leave you different options in the same setting. For instance, in Heroes 5, you can choose different paths wiht most of your Heroes - perhaps the best example is the Rune Mage, who can either go completely Might (Defence, War Machines, Attack, Light Magic) or completely Magic (Destructive Magic, Sorcery, Enlightenment, Leadership) providing too radically different forms of game play. My advice would be: Be careful not to cut that branch off.

Quote:
Might Skills

1. Offense: Increases damage dealt by your creatures in melee combat by 5%, 10% with advanced mastery, 20% with expert.

2. Defense: Decreases damage dealt to your creatures in melee combat by 10%, 20% with advanced mastery and 30% with expert.

3. Archery: Increases damage dealt by hero's creatures in ranged combat by 5%, 10% with advanced, 20% with expert.

4. Leadership: Increases moral of all creatures in hero's army by 1.

5. Empowering: After a melee hit, the damage for the next one is increased by 4%, 8% with advanced mastery and 16% with expert.

6. Diplomatics: Increases the chance that creature will want to join your army instead of fighting/fleeing by 15%, 30% with advanced mastery, 50% with expert.

7. Logistics: Increases hero's movement speed over land by 10%, 20% with advanced mastery, 30% with expert.

8. Vitality: +12 HP to 7th level creatures in hero's army and +7 HP to 6th level creatures. With advnaced mastery, also +5 HP to 5th level creatures and +4 HP to fourth level creatures. With expert mastery, +3 HP to 3rd level creatures, +2 HP to 2nd level creatures, and +1 HP for 1st level creatures.

9. Estates: Hero contributes 100 gold pieces per day to your cause, 250 with advanced mastery and 500 with expert.


As I said above, I'm not a huge fan of too many skills. That being said, I think most of these are fair. In my oppinion, Luck very much belongs to the above list.

Estates simply is NOT a good choice for a skill - sorry, but why would you ever use three levels of your Hero on this? At least make it scale with Hero level, in Heroes 4, Lord still was not the best class, but at least the got the better of it with the Estates and Mining skills, making the pretty good.

Empowering seems ... odd. Sorry, but to me, it looks like something that came up in the need to fill an empty skill slot. It just doesn't make that much sense to me. And again, is it worth it? +4 % damage, ok, that's about comparable to +1 Attack bonus. So you roughly get +1 Attack after first attack, +2 after second, +3 after third ... hmmm. Attack adds 15 % damage from start, that's +3 Attack entire battle to give a refference frame. Add to that Retribution ...

Vitality ... ok, that's actually not a bad suggestion for a new skill. The numbers ... ok, that's a detail anyway. More interesting: Why make it apply only to high level creatures on low mastery and then go down? That seems very counterintuitive to me. Particularly because in early game (low mastery) you only have low level creatures, in late game (high mastery) you have high level creatures. Would definitely swap that.

Quote:
Bonus Skills

1. Enchantment: Allows the hero to enchant an artifact with an additional minor effect. The chances of the enchanting to succeed is [Spell Power]X10%, [Spell Power]X20% with advanced mastery and [Spell Power]X30% with expert. Effects added will be more powerful with better mastery in the skill.
-Curse of Revenge: When the hero loses in battle, it will curse automatically one of his artifacts (chosen randomally) with a minor effect (like a 250 gold daily tax payment), so the winner (the enemy) will recieve the artifact cursed.
-Increased Value: After artifatcs are enchanted, their price will increase by 25% if they are sold at the artifact market.
-Mark of the Enchanter: The artifacts are marked by the hero and their bonus effects won't work if they are taken by enemy heroes.

2. Luck: Increases luck of all creatures in hero's army by 1, by 2 with advanced mastery, and by 3 with expert.

3. Scholar: Allows the Hero to teach other heroes spells from his/her spellbook. The spells taught can be from the 3rd circle or lower, with advanced mastery 4th circle or lower, and 5th circle or lower with expert.

4. Enlightenment: Hero receives +1 to one of his primary stats for every four levels including the levels already got and + 5% bonus to the experience gained, 10% with advanced mastery and +15% with expert.

5. Sorcery: Speeds up hero's casting in combat. Interval between two consecutive spell casts is reduced by 10%, 20% with advanced mastery, 30% with expert.

6. Magic Mirror: There's 5% chance that spells will be reflected to other creature on the battlefield, randomally. 10% with advanced mastery, and 15% with expert.

7. Herbalist: The hero can waste movement points on the adventure map, in order to create potions that he'll be able to give creatures on battefield. Type of potion is dependent on the terrain, rivers and seas around, and stonger with better mastery in the skill.

8. Illusion Image: The hero can duplicate his/her creatures. The clone will be killed in the moment it is attacked, but it will look to the enemy like the same creatures exactly for the enemy, and will be able to attack. Every time a single clone appears. With expert mastery, clones will be incorporeal.


Ok, Enchantment is deffinitely an interesting thought. I'm not really positive you'll want to take this skill for your primary, as Estates, it just seems narrow. I might want to put the idea into either some spell or into an ability, though. It's quite inovative. Love the "Curse Artifact" thing, haha. In your face, lol.

Scholar: Not a good skill. Too narrow. Works fine as an ability in my book.

Magic Mirror: Think I commented on this above. I still don't think it's that needed. I also like it as a Wizard special. Maybe I'm too conservative. Whatever, don't mind me on this.

Herbalist: Sounds more like a class special to me. Again, maybe I'm just too conservative. Could work I guess.

Illusion Image: Again, this is a spell made a skill. Do we like that? I guess that's a personal decision. I don't ... I think this will be overpowered. Phantom Images is already a very potent spell.

Quote:
Elemental Magics

Every spells out of the unique spell schools will have an element, out of the four: Fire, Water, Earth and Air. Both Might and Magic heroes can learn Elemental Magic school in order to increase the power of spells from the same element.


So many skills ...

Quote:
Unique Magics

Magic heroes can learn a unique magic. Each Magical faction is specialized with one unique magic school.


Restrictions rather than possibilities ... Maybe that's just me, but why make things so narrow?

Quote:
Bonus Skills

As you may have noticed, both Might and Magic heroes have a "Bonus skill slot". The hero can use this slot for any skill (except of unique magic skills). The hero can also use it for War-Mechines. But remember, you can never know what will be options be, and may get things you don't really want.


Ok, I'm not sure I get this. It does seem very random?

Will have to look into the whole War Machines thing later I think.

All the above being said, good thorough work. Just because I don't agree doesn't meen I know better.
____________
What will happen now?

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
GenieLord
GenieLord


Honorable
Legendary Hero
posted April 13, 2008 11:18 AM
Edited by GenieLord at 11:19, 13 Apr 2008.

I edited Empowering a bit:
Quote:
5. Empowering: After a melee hit, the damage and the chance for a critical hit, for the next hit is increased by 4%, 8% with advanced mastery and 16% with expert,
It is very useful in long battles. At a level of them, the enemy will have to deal with very high damage and a lot of critical hits.

Your suggestion to use the H4 Estates skill is actually a good one. My version is:
Quote:
9. Estates: Hero contributes 100+10%X[Hero level] gold pieces per day to your cause, 250+10%X[Hero level] with advanced mastery and 500+10%X[Hero level] with expert.


The new Vitality, using your tips. Now it makes much more sense.
Quote:
8. Vitality: +1 HP for 1st level creatures and +2 HP to 2nd level creatures in hero's army. With advanced mastery, +3 HP to 3rd level creatures, +4 HP to fourth level creatures and +5 HP to 5th level creatures. With expert mastery, +7 HP to 6th level creatures and +12 HP to 7th level creatures.


About the Magic Mirror, Scholar, Herbalist and Illusion Image, I just don't agree with you. Well, maybe you're conservative, but I'm not.

Thank you for this very constructive criticism.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread »
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.1393 seconds