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| Thread: Building strengths or patching weaknesses | |
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RedFury
Hired Hero
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posted September 01, 2008 04:22 PM |
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Building strengths or patching weaknesses
OK here goes:
The main dilemma comes when you see an Arena (or maybe 2) with your 10/2/x/y warlock and you ask yourself: What now?!? Am i gonna try and build more defense, since attack comes natural, or am I going to support my heroes decisions and help him upgrade Attack as soon and as much as possible. Same thing only in reverse for necro and some other factions as well.
Some artifacts put you in the same position, are you gonna try to fix your heroes weaknesses or do you prefer augmenting his strengths even more.
The same thought process appears in battles. Lets say you play dungeon and have mass haste and mass slow at your disposal. What do you do first: Slow them since your creatures are fast as it is, or hasten your creatures even more, since, because of haste, percentage of the initiative gained is greater when init is high to begin with.
Besides there's his and your hero to consider who are going to cast less with haste and more with slow (from another point of view, with mass haste you technically slow down his army, both heroes, all war machines...).
What do you base your decisions on?
Could have made a poll, but i prefer reading the answers anyway, and now you all will have to write something  , instead of just voting, unless there's a universal rule how to behave in those situations, that I wasn't aware of 
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted September 01, 2008 04:40 PM |
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usually I make sure that my strongest stat is pretty hight and then I will make my weaker one average. Or like you said if attack comes easier the when I hit an arena I will go +2 defence.
about the other one given the coice of casting mass hast or mass slow playing as the dungeon, I would choose mass slow. Because the dungeon has pretty fast troops with good damage it gives them more chances to hit the enemy. That way by the time it was the "bad guys" turn they wouldn't be able to do as much damage cause their numbers would be lower.
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I use big words to make myself
smarter
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adon
Known Hero
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posted September 01, 2008 04:51 PM |
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It depends on the faction.
ie., if I run into an arena:
For a necro, I would take defense instead even though my defense is already high. This gives my guys that much more time to live while my dark magic and summoning magic does its work (puppet, frenzy, phoenix, blade barrier)
But for a ranger, I would take attack and augment a weakness, because its all about killing as much as I can as fast as I can rather than prolonging.
Some factions need stats more than others but aren't compensated for it naturally and need to augment a weakness, while others you want to max out something even though you get it already.
The exception is knowledge, as I find once you get past 150 or so in mana a battle is not going to last long enough to use it anyway...so I will swap out artifacts that boost knowledge (unless I'm building mini-artifacts at the time).
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outshined
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 01, 2008 11:13 PM |
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I tend to pick stats along faction lines;
If I play a magic faction like Necro, Dungeon, or Academy, I generally pick defense. I see my creatures more as a meatshield that needs to last as long as possible so my hero has more time to cast. Survivability is more important.
If I play a might faction like Haven, Inferno, or Stronghold, I generally pick attack, because the objective is to kill the enemy's meatshields as quickly as possible, before all of your creatures get slain/neutralized by magic =P.
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted September 01, 2008 11:27 PM |
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thats a very good point outshined, next time i play (I almost always play deungeon) I will try to get more defense that normal and see if I am more sucsesful.
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I use big words to make myself
smarter
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tann_141
Known Hero
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posted September 02, 2008 01:01 AM |
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i say defense has more uses in general than attack
for a spellcaster your units last longer meaning more spells will be cast and more damage will be done
for a might player... the extra defense mean your units survive longer and their numbers stay up.. this makes their retal hit quite hard and when its your units turn.. they can still slaughter a lot of units
attack is more of a double edged sword.. if the opponent attacks first and your hero has 30 atk and 5 defense (can happen) your units will be almost wiped out.. so that 30 atk is not that useful anymore.. then again if your units hit first then you kind of overkill his stacks 
defense is more reliable as it doesnt matter if your units go first or not
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alcibiades
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
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posted September 02, 2008 09:13 AM |
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Quote:
i say defense has more uses in general than attack
for a spellcaster your units last longer meaning more spells will be cast and more damage will be done
for a might player... the extra defense mean your units survive longer and their numbers stay up.. this makes their retal hit quite hard and when its your units turn.. they can still slaughter a lot of units
attack is more of a double edged sword.. if the opponent attacks first and your hero has 30 atk and 5 defense (can happen) your units will be almost wiped out.. so that 30 atk is not that useful anymore.. then again if your units hit first then you kind of overkill his stacks
defense is more reliable as it doesnt matter if your units go first or not
Defence is useless if your units strike first - true, they will suffer less on retaliation, but so is the case if they have higher attack and hence take down a larger proportion of the stack.
I think Outshined has a very good point above: The clue is in seeing whether you're likely to go before or after the opponent in the battle. If you go before, take Attack, if you go after, take Defence.
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What will happen now?
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Isabel
Known Hero
Dragonblessed
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posted September 02, 2008 10:20 AM |
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Quote:
I tend to pick stats along faction lines;
If I play a magic faction like Necro, Dungeon, or Academy, I generally pick defense. I see my creatures more as a meatshield that needs to last as long as possible so my hero has more time to cast. Survivability is more important.
If I play a might faction like Haven, Inferno, or Stronghold, I generally pick attack, because the objective is to kill the enemy's meatshields as quickly as possible, before all of your creatures get slain/neutralized by magic =P.
Agree. It mainly depends on the playstyle of the faction. For Fortress, if you charge with your army, go for attack. If you use box formation and preperation, you can get more defense. And for Sylvan, defense is very abundant, so I usually get attack when I have the chance.
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Asheera
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Elite Assassin
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posted September 02, 2008 02:47 PM |
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Quote:
If you go before, take Attack, if you go after, take Defence.
It's a little generalized (since most factions have both slow and fast units) but it's a great idea
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ChaosDragon
Famous Hero
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posted September 03, 2008 05:52 PM |
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Imo the choice depends on many factors.
But i myself prefer a balanced stat.
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Nebdar
Promising
Supreme Hero
Generation N
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posted September 24, 2008 07:34 PM |
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Generaly i like balanced stats(26 Att & 10 Def is balanced IMO for some factions)
Haven +Att
Inferno Att&Def(in proportion 6:4)
Necropolis +Att
Sylvan +Att
Dungeon Att&Def(in proportion 7:3)
Academy +Att
Fortress +Att
Stronghold Att&Def(in proportion 5:5)
as for proportion i mean if i visted the Arean 10 times i would 6 times increased Att and 4 times Def.
As for survivabilty balance of Att&Def is important because High Def gives a chance to withstand many blows but good Att gives a chance for counterattacks and good retaliation damage. It makes me mad that my creatures are terribly resistant but can't deal any sirous damage to the enemy(feel like you have an army of duck read to be shot), or the opposite the High Att army that will strike and die swiftly and terribly.
Balance is good everytime
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted September 24, 2008 08:52 PM |
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I would give the dungeon slightly more balance than 7:3. I would go at least 6:4 if not 5:5. The longer your creatures alst the more spells you are able to cast.
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I use big words to make myself
smarter
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razor5
Famous Hero
Freezing...
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posted September 24, 2008 08:59 PM |
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6:4 ? When I play Inferno,my proportion is 7:3 or sometimes 8:2
I really value the attack,and sometime I will play balanced ( 5:5 ) to see if is good to use this proportion 
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MarcusX
Known Hero
*happyface*
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posted September 24, 2008 09:12 PM |
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I agree with you when playing Inferno I almost always go attack with the inferno you need to gain attack momentum early in the battle and then your good you don't need a ton of def. thats my take on it.
____________
I use big words to make myself
smarter
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Nebdar
Promising
Supreme Hero
Generation N
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posted September 24, 2008 11:24 PM |
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For Dungeon Def is really needed in small maps where you hero sometimes deals more damage on the battlefield then your whole army alltogether. I play on Large maps when the power of army is greater the heroes who is just supporter.
As for Inferno the proportion comes from my expierience when the lack of Def(sometimes it was 22 Att & 0 Def) hurts a lot, and they demon are fragile on the begining(thats they need to call for reinforcements)
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razor5
Famous Hero
Freezing...
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posted September 25, 2008 01:23 PM |
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Quote:
(sometimes it was 22 Att & 0 Def)
WOW !!!  I only think how much it hurts other creatures. But no defence is really bad,but I give an example:
I play with Deleb (from Inferno) against Irina (Haven) ,but not in Duel Mod and after the battle with Irina I had 17 atk and 8 defence (I really focused on attack ) with an army of 233 Imps,261 Horned Grunts,177 Cerberi,100 Succubis,31 Nightmare,33 Pit Lords and 12 Arch Devils
I remember only my starting army
and the verdict:the serious problems were with the Griffins and Archangels,the rest creatures were easy to kill and I WON IT 
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kermit
Known Hero
Soul hunter
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posted September 25, 2008 03:29 PM |
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personally I prefer investing in atack for might factions and defence for magic factions. Dungeon can sometimes be played with very high atack too if you get some initiative boosting artifacts.
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Nebdar
Promising
Supreme Hero
Generation N
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posted September 25, 2008 06:48 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
(sometimes it was 22 Att & 0 Def)
WOW !!! I only think how much it hurts other creatures. But no defence is really bad,but I give an example:
I play with Deleb (from Inferno) against Irina (Haven) ,but not in Duel Mod and after the battle with Irina I had 17 atk and 8 defence (I really focused on attack ) with an army of 233 Imps,261 Horned Grunts,177 Cerberi,100 Succubis,31 Nightmare,33 Pit Lords and 12 Arch Devils
I remember only my starting army
and the verdict:the serious problems were with the Griffins and Archangels,the rest creatures were easy to kill and I WON IT
It was on HoF probaly i was shocked too i had probably the Helm Of Chaos. Yeah kill Angels Paladines and the rest is easy pickings
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razor5
Famous Hero
Freezing...
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posted September 25, 2008 08:27 PM |
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Edited by razor5 at 20:30, 25 Sep 2008.
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Quote:
Yeah kill Angels Paladines and the rest is easy pickings
Yes other(Marksman,Inquisitor,Squire and Conscripts)can be hardly weaked with Pit Lord's powerful Meteor Shower,Imps can rubbish the Haven hero by stealing his mana ,and Succubi's ability can again weak powerful the enemy troops
EDIT: I forgot the Griffins,playing against Irina with all factions you can have some problems with the Griffins,sad to say this(but good for Haven strategy) - the Griffins are the best Anti-Succubi Weapon
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