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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 25, 2010 01:56 AM |
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potentially makes sprites the best caster in the game (because of their initiative)
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VokialBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
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posted May 25, 2010 08:03 AM |
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Edited by VokialBG at 08:07, 25 May 2010.
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Doesn't matter, there is new one.
Post updated 
They are not perfect, but fun 
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 25, 2010 06:30 PM |
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...shouldn't the round be over long?! ...just re-arrived from holidays
...@fauch: lol, you're probably right. Did them very short, jsut before going on vacation. ...also, they are merely prequesites, so 
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 26, 2010 09:28 AM |
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Ratings Round 31
Fauch
Power Flare
Right, we have a pretty insignificant gain in Power for all Summoning spells except Summon Elemental which will create a Power monster. Not that balanced, you might say.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 8
BALANCE/REALISM: 0
Barrier Master
Since Firewall is a Destructive spell that you cannot get without Destructive Magic or Sorcery, the perk's use is doubtful, with Blade Barrier being one of 3 Summoning spells of that tier. No prereqs are listed either.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 4
BALANCE/REALISM: 2
blizzardboy
Phantom Node
A perk just allowing a second Phantom would be a bad idea, imo, but this perk has very low ATB-use-up AND a small use on its own; additionally the advanced perk makes sure, that a second illusion makes more sense, at least for Necro. I'm not enthusiastic about this perk, but I appreciate the fine balance it seems to have.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 9
BALANCE/REALISM: 6
Shadow Node
Paradoxically, I like that one better than the first - Phantom Node makes a lot more sense to have with Shadow Node, so here's a better Realism rating.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 9
BALANCE/REALISM: 8
Jirki9
Ethereal Armor
Arcane Armor Light? Don't know what to say about that, to tell the truth. I tend to see it on the positive side, but I'm not fully convinced.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 7
BALANCE/REALISM: 7
Riddlemaster
Sadly I don't like that at all. A spell for free? Big no-no. Random spell for full iniative and reduced effect? With these high prereqs? I mean, Illusion will reduce spell costs anyway. I'd say that picking Illusion plus Summoning would make Sorcery a must-have (faster casting), and the Sorcery perks reduce cost as well, so with this Skill I'd expect more USE, not less mana.
Of course all the prereq skills and stuff are pretty creative, but Balance and Realism is missing.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 9
BALANCE/REALISM: 1
veco
Will of the Maker
Very nice. I like that perk a lot.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 9
BALANCE/REALISM: 9
Binding Shards
Again, very nice, making it a fine double perk with very unique use.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 9
BALANCE/REALISM: 9
Vokial BG
Arcane Wings
Since nothing is noted, this should be an activated ability using up full ATB value... I like the basic idea which seems well balanced - however, I'd have wished for an increase in speed as well... +1 or maybe even +2. As it is, I find it slightly lacking.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 9
BALANCE/REALISM: 6
Light over Darkness/Darkness over Light
This is a very fine perk, although it somehow meddles with the Light/Dark perks that influence spellcasting here. Moreover, the problem is, that while Eternal Light (which would be a fine prereq for Light over Darkness - Eternal Light plus ONE basic Illusion perk as prereqs would be better) paves the way for this, Dark perks work differently harrassing opposing DARK spells, which means, looking at it from the perspective of the whole game Darkness over Light would be a completely new thing, while Light over Darkness would be something of an better Eternal Light.
Which means, I'm not really satisfied with the construction of this perk, since due to the Light/Dark perks I wouldn't construct it as a complete mirror of the other.
CREATIVITY/ORIGINALITY: 10
BALANCE/REALISM: 6
IMPORTANT NOTICE: We have NO real suggetions how to continue.
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VokialBG
Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
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posted May 26, 2010 10:31 AM |
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Edited by VokialBG at 10:32, 26 May 2010.
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How about unique skills per race? Or second circle of skills - skills for skill (like Illusion for Summoning).
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 26, 2010 10:32 AM |
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Quote:
IMPORTANT NOTICE: We have NO real suggetions how to continue.
chrm chrm:
Quote:
For how we shall proceed:
this reorganize thing sounds okay...but could be difficult to find advanced skills for attack and such...also I'm not sure how, on the whole, I like having "advanced skills" for one topic...imho, there are still many possible secondary skills to be done...perhaps we could do another round of that? Or how 'bout a round of alternative perks for racials? Or what about perks "merging" skills - you can learn the perk in two different skills...an example could be a perk called "Veteran": It can be learned as Attack or as Defense perk and it's effect is that it eqalizes the attack and defense values of all your creatures by making both of them into the average of both in the creature. f.e. a devil would have 26 attack and defense then. Just as an example...
so these suggestions aren't real? Perhaps I'm going insane, then, seeing things which aren't real...
okay, enough joking
I REALLY think another round of creating adavanced/new skills would be great and we could go on there. We could easily even make two rounds or, in fact, FOUR out of it: First for magic skills, than Might skills (effecting the army or so), than there could be adventuremap skills (logistics would be one, or the good old nobility) and even than there could be miscellaneous skills (I don't see enlightenment fit in any of the before categories and here we'd have to be CREATIVE.
OR we just do the reorganizing thing you suggested. So you, for example, give as task: give 3 new perks for the Attack skill, at least one basic and one advanced one each ( so not just 2 basics)...
and thogh I personally like the merging perks, I fear most people here won't like it, so
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 26, 2010 11:13 AM |
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Jirki, I read your suggestion, but I'd like to hear more. 
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"Nobody dies a virgin ... Life f*cks us all." - Kurt Cobain
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 26, 2010 12:25 PM |
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 26, 2010 12:35 PM |
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Ok, here's an ambitioned and somewhat complex suggestion, how to proceed:
With the exception of Blizzard's example skill, all our self created skills might be seen as a secondary skill to an existing general skill: Here is the list:
Archery: Attack
Magic TalenT: Destructive Magic
Economics: Leadership
Illusion: Summoning Magic
Heroism: Enlightenment
Art of War: Enlightenment
Maneuverability: Logistics
How about a system where these kinds of SECONDARY SKILLS would replace the BASIC perks for each skill.
This doesn't mean, however, that, the secondary skills would replace existing basic perks only(like it's the case with Archery), it can mean completely new things or advanced perks that may be "promoted" to secondary status (an example fopr something new is Art of War, an example for an Advanced Perk "promoted" to secondary might be "Mentoring" (you can guess the 3 levels there, probably).
We wuld do the following for each skill:
1) Create Secondary skills (for all 12 skills)
2) Create perks for all 36 Secondary skills -
Step 1 would see: Create TWO Secondary skills for the XXX skill. These would include naming of perks becoming redundant plus naming of already existing perks (in reality in the game) that would fall under that secondary skill (for example, under Archery, there'd be the Flaming Arrows perk)
After this round there would have to be an organzational round to sort the stuff out.
Step 2 would see: Create 2 perks for XXX/YYY. Example: Create these perks for Attack/Archery. (We did the example already).
This would be my suggestion then.
I would start this with the Defense skill.
So POTENTIALLY, the next round would be:
Create TWO secondary skills for the Defense skill (and name all redundant perks and which existing perks would fall under these skills).
I'd like comments here; also, I suppose i would be nice if we had some participants.
Are there other suggestions?
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"Nobody dies a virgin ... Life f*cks us all." - Kurt Cobain
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 26, 2010 12:55 PM |
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I am participating however this will go on, i suppose...
however I'm not sure what you mean in detail...will the existing skills come to naught and be replaced by the "secondary" ones or not? And what do you exactly mean by redundant here?
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 26, 2010 02:43 PM |
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What I mean is, that we alter the skill wheel. The outermost layer are the 12 skills as we know them, Defense, Offense, Summoning and so on.
Then we create a new layer: SECONDARY skills. Examples for these are all the skills we created ourselves, for example ARCHERY, which would be a secondary skill to the Attack skill. THREE secndary skills per skill. Then come the perks, with perks being perks of a SECONDARY skill now.
If we consider Archery as one of the three secondary Attack skills, the PERK Archery becomes redundant. Likewise, Flaming Arrows becomes an (Attack/)Archery Perk.
Of course this changes the game. Heroes would have double as many levels (halving experience levels: first level-up at 500, second t 1000 and so on) with THREE windows to pick from, skill, sec skill, and perk.
I forgot that we would need secondary skills for the racial skills as well.
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"Nobody dies a virgin ... Life f*cks us all." - Kurt Cobain
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 26, 2010 03:49 PM |
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that sound awesomely great to me! 
I hope I may just begin with defense, so I allready havee them down if we choose for that...
I'll just do, don't lynch me...
Survival:
With this secondary skill, all your units' max HP are increased, by 10% for basic survival, 20% for advanced survival and 30§ for expert survival.
...makes the "vitality" perk redundant...
Magic Resistance:
GIves your units a spell resistance of 5/10/15% (to completely resist the spell)
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 26, 2010 03:58 PM |
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Of course I wanted to say something about the obvious ones:
For Defense, a skill to increase HPs seems - that is, a conversion of the perk VITALITY - seems natural.
With skills like that the mechanism and detail is important! This means, that double entries are completely in order: you may not be satisfied with the skill sketched by another competitor and rather want the skill to be somewhat different.
Therefore, EDITED perks, that is, perks in EDITD posts, would not count!
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"Nobody dies a virgin ... Life f*cks us all." - Kurt Cobain
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 26, 2010 04:09 PM |
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yeah, I know they're quite obvious...perhaps gonna make some different and replace these two...but I fear, the obvious will easier win...because they're almost NECESSARY...
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 26, 2010 04:12 PM |
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I don't think so. With the known stuff, since the basic idea isn't new, it depends on how things are made as a skill.
For example, those two you made suck.
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"Nobody dies a virgin ... Life f*cks us all." - Kurt Cobain
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 26, 2010 04:26 PM |
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Thank you XD
yet, I don't think so, at least not by the principe - the numbers could be altered probably...
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 26, 2010 04:32 PM |
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I don't want to go into detail here, yet, WHY they suck, but let me just say that your Magic Resistance Skill is based on the LUCK perk, not on the defense perk, and I agree with the initial game design that a CHANCE to completely resist has a lot more to do with Luck than with Defense, while a decease of magic damage might have something to do with warding the armor and therefore with Defense.
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"Nobody dies a virgin ... Life f*cks us all." - Kurt Cobain
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 26, 2010 05:10 PM |
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 26, 2010 05:46 PM |
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Edited by Fauch at 17:51, 26 May 2010.
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Quote:
Power Flare
Right, we have a pretty insignificant gain in Power for all Summoning spells except Summon Elemental which will create a Power monster. Not that balanced, you might say.
maybe, but you aren't supposed to destroy the elementals to win anyway, and according to most players, it seems summon elemental is quite an average spell (?) probably because of the randomness I guess, there isn't much you can do with earth elementals
(note I could have posted a perk to let you choose what to summon, but I think I had already created it before)
Quote:
Barrier Master
Since Firewall is a Destructive spell that you cannot get without Destructive Magic or Sorcery, the perk's use is doubtful, with Blade Barrier being one of 3 Summoning spells of that tier. No prereqs are listed either.
forgot the prereqs. but I said that this perk adds blade barrier in your spellbook, so it is useable and quite good I think, since blade barrier is quite a decent spell.
not sure about the suggestion for next round, the perks are going to be very redundant with the previous rounds I guess.
some ideas :
-change heroes specialities for each faction
-create new primary skills to replace existing ones (12 skills to create. or more? 16?)
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted May 26, 2010 06:02 PM |
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I'm not sure I fully understand the details, but Joker's proposal sounds good to me.
edit: I got excited and made my 2 skills 
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"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."
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This thread is pages long: 
