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razor5
Famous Hero
Freezing...
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posted March 07, 2009 09:31 AM |
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DC,count me in  I started to love all your games,I think also you deserve your 2nd QP
Now the character:
Name: Razor
Stats:
Health:12 (used 2 SP)
Attack:3 (used 3 SP)
Defence:2 (used 2 SP)
Agility:1 (used 2 SP)
Magic Resistance:1 (used 1 SP)
All we have basically 10 SP,right?
What spell I can take? Or all were used?
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DarkCrystal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Staright out of line
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posted March 07, 2009 09:49 AM |
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Quote:
Now the character:
Name: Razor
Stats:
Health:12 (used 2 SP)
Attack:3 (used 3 SP)
Defence:2 (used 2 SP)
Agility:1 (used 2 SP)
Magic Resistance:1 (used 1 SP)
No, not like that.
With the SP system you gave your character it would look like that:
Health 11 (2SP)
Attack 4 (3SP)
Defence 3 (2SP)
Agility 2 (2SP)
Magic Resistance 2 (1SP)
Because all stats except health are 1 on default. And SP are "unmaterial" points which can increase them.
 BUT
I think I could make all stats increase by 1 SP, because basing on Dagoth's post, I maybe will add new feature, "Magic Skill", which can be increased by SPs and makes your magic stronger.
So, now all stats can be increased only by loosing 1 SP. So I'll add "extra points" to people, who used 2SP for some stats, I mean, for people, who have for example 11 health I will add 1 extra point.
So, Razor,
Health 12
Agility 3
Other as it was.
Quote:
All we have basically 10 SP,right?
Right.
Quote:
What spell I can take? Or all were used?
You can take one 1st level spell.
 Lexxan
With the SP system you wanted your char would be
Health - 10 + 3SP 13
Attack - 1
Defence - 1 + 2SP 3
Agility - 1
Magic Resistance - 1
Spell Power - 1 + 2Sp 3
Mana - 1 + 3SP 4
Good for you?
____________
Sometimes I'm about to yell: "It is flat you idiots!" But I don't wanna die in fire. 
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Oscarius
Famous Hero
*sleepy*
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posted March 07, 2009 10:30 AM |
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Edited by Oscarius at 10:32, 07 Mar 2009.
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I'll take energy orb too.
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Need moar avatars!
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razor5
Famous Hero
Freezing...
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posted March 07, 2009 10:30 AM |
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Quote:
You can take one 1st level spell.
I'll take the Energy Orb
But,I'm still now in trouble with the battle system,I'm not sure if I understood it Can you explain,please?
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted March 07, 2009 10:34 AM |
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Edited by Azagal at 10:39, 07 Mar 2009.
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How thick do you have to be to NOT get the system xD? Guys this isn't that difficult comeon read what the guy is saying .
I have a question about combat though. So far I think you've done a nice job explaining etc. but I think you are slightly neglecting the melee fighters in this.
For example:
Quote:
Avoid Attack. (If your enemy attacked you at that moment, damage = attack(enemy's) - (agility + 0.5*defence))
Like the action is now the best possible outcome is to simply not receive dmg. Repeat this 5 times and all actions will have been used up without guy A having hit guy B and B not having hit A. Then how does that fight end^^?
Now what if "agility+0.5*defence" were greater than the enemies attack? Wouldn't it be an idea to have the negative ammount be the dmg the "avoiding" player does to the attacking player? Like a counter attack etc. because as it is now the attack simple reduces dmg you take without having any impact whatsoever on your oponent.
I think you'll have a terribly hard time balancing this out (except everybodys going for magic -_-).
And the way I see it all melee figthers have to do dmg is their +attack skill no multi attack, no rage, no frenzy, no abilities. Caster can nuke the living hell out of you.
Take Fireball the dmg calculation is the same as for an melee attack only it's 0.25*resistance (equivalent of defense in melee). It's already 50% than an melee attack in theory (now let's not forget that you can simply choose an oponent with little resistance but high defense and he doesn't stand a chance. ESPECIALLY since all start out with the same ammount of HP.) This leaves melee fighters either nerfed or caster buffed. Catch my drift?
I'd really like to participate but things should be fair for all participants (or we'll just have casters).
EDIT:
Just saw this
Quote:
Rules are not finished, I have not enough time now.  I'll update it, while you join.
I apologize if my criticsm was premature and those were still matters you would attend to.
And I don't understand why you HAVE to kill an oponent in a normal "Match" why shouldn't showing mercy be allowed? It's much more humiliating.
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"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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Oscarius
Famous Hero
*sleepy*
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posted March 07, 2009 10:41 AM |
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Well I think your onto something (I nearly feel guilty for takng a caster :blush.
Also a suggestion from me: Make the skill fortify a %-ability instead of a constant 3. Image my caster for instance. Nuke, fortify, rinse and repeat. With fortify I got 6 defense, that's pretty high don't you think (For a caster that is.)
____________
Need moar avatars!
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DarkCrystal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Staright out of line
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posted March 07, 2009 10:58 AM |
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Quote:
But,I'm still now in trouble with the battle system,I'm not sure if I understood it Can you explain,please?
Sure, you send 5 actions to mod, who lead this battle. Than your opponent do that too. Battle can have "Special rules" like "are you allowed to use symbiote?" and such. Than mod calculate battle by actions. I'll give an example.
2 opponents. O1 and O2.
O1 sats:
Health 10
Attack 4
Defence 3
Agility 1
Magic Resisatnce 2
Spell Power 3
Mana 3
O2 stats:
Health 12
Attack 2
Defence 4
Agility 1
Magic Resistance 3
Spell Power 1
Mana 2
1)O1 challenge O2 for Carnage (without rules).
2)O1 send actions to mod:
Preparing: nothing.
1.Attack
2.Magic - Energy orb
3.Fortify
4.Attack
5.Avoid Attack
3)O2 send actions to mod:
Preparing: nothing
1.Magic - Magic Fist
2.Attack
3.Attack
4.Avoid Attack
5.Fortify
4)Battle begins
First turn have challenged person, unless it's God.
1.1.O2 use Magic Fist. Damage = 1 - 1 (1.5 should be, but we don't use fraction numbers) = 1 (Note: in the attacks which use defence, except avoid attack, minimal damge will anyway be 1). O1's Health = 9
1.2.O1 use attack. Damage = 4 - 2 = 2. O2's health = 10
2.1.O2 use attack. Damage = 2 - 1 = 1. O1's health = 8
2.2.O1 use Energy Orb. Damage = 3 - 1 = 2. O2's health = 8
3.1.O2 use attack. Damage = 2 - 1 = 1. O1's health = 7
3.2.O1 use fortify.
4.1.O2 use avoid attack.
4.2.O1 use attack. Damage = 4 - 3 = 1. O2's health = 7
5.1.O2 use fortify.
5.2.O1 use avoid attack.
Then cycle reapeats untill one of them win. First battle I'll lead myself and then I guess you'll understand.
EDIT:
Quote:
Like the action is now the best possible outcome is to simply not receive dmg. Repeat this 5 times and all actions will have been used up without guy A having hit guy B and B not having hit A. Then how does that fight end^^?
Now what if "agility+0.5*defence" were greater than the enemies attack? Wouldn't it be an idea to have the negative ammount be the dmg the "avoiding" player does to the attacking player? Like a counter attack etc. because as it is now the attack simple reduces dmg you take without having any impact whatsoever on your oponent.
Normal defence will anyway have minimal dmg as 1, but avoid can have min dmg as 0, it means that enemy missed. But I see your point, now avoid attack can be prapared only 2 times by cycle.
Quote:
I think you'll have a terribly hard time balancing this out
You are right.
Quote:
And the way I see it all melee figthers have to do dmg is their +attack skill no multi attack, no rage, no frenzy, no abilities. Caster can nuke the living hell out of you.
Other weapons will have another damage system. And main disadvantage of spells is their cost. It's not very easy to score much mana, with increasing other stats.
Quote:
Also a suggestion from me: Make the skill fortify a %-ability instead of a constant 3. Image my caster for instance. Nuke, fortify, rinse and repeat. With fortify I got 6 defense, that's pretty high don't you think (For a caster that is.)
Fortify effect loses with next action, unless it's "no action" action.
During my abscense, I'll think on balanse and maybe add something when return.
____________
Sometimes I'm about to yell: "It is flat you idiots!" But I don't wanna die in fire.
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted March 07, 2009 11:28 AM |
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Edited by Azagal at 11:30, 07 Mar 2009.
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Quote:
Normal defence will anyway have minimal dmg as 1, but avoid can have min dmg as 0, it means that enemy missed. But I see your point, now avoid attack can be prapared only 2 times by cycle.
No you don't see my point at all, sorry. The point is that the attack (talking about the "avoid" action ) doesn't do anything for you. It's even damageing you because it gurantees that you'll take dmg (unless your agility is very high). Futhermore now that you say minimum dmg will always be 1 it's easier to pump up your Defense for 1 SP than your agility for 2 SP. The damage reduction will become so insignificantly small that you should just attack on every turn instead of "avoiding" because all you'll miss is keepin HP equal to the ammount of your agility points.
The action is therefore pretty much wasted if it doesn't have any effect of any kind on the guy attacking you. Understand me now? I still think I had a good solution for it though (sorry for not being too modest here...)
____________
"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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DarkCrystal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Staright out of line
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posted March 07, 2009 11:40 AM |
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Quote:
Quote:
Normal defence will anyway have minimal dmg as 1, but avoid can have min dmg as 0, it means that enemy missed. But I see your point, now avoid attack can be prapared only 2 times by cycle.
No you don't see my point at all, sorry. The point is that the attack (talking about the "avoid" action) doesn't do anything for you. It's even damageing you because it gurantees that you'll take dmg (unless your agility is very high). Futhermore now that you say minimum dmg will always be 1 it's easier to pump up your Defense for 1 SP than your agility for 2 SP. The damage reduction will become so insignificantly small that you should just attack on every turn instead of "avoiding" because all you'll miss is keepin HP equal to the ammount of your agility points.
The action is therefore pretty much wasted if it doesn't have any effect of any kind on the guy attacking you. Understand me now? I still think I had a good solution for it though (sorry for not being too modest here...)
Well, if I got it right, you don't like that attack doesn't do anything in "avoid action"? Or you don't like that "avoid" action is wasteful and will anyway have damage?
BTW, I'm thinking about to make "avoid" action like this: If your agility < enemy's => normal enemy's attack. If your agility > enemy's => enemy missed. What do you think?
BTW, now to increase agility you need to lose 1 SP.
____________
Sometimes I'm about to yell: "It is flat you idiots!" But I don't wanna die in fire.
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted March 07, 2009 11:50 AM |
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Quote:
Or you don't like that "avoid" action is wasteful and will anyway have damage?
Yes that is exactly my problem. The damage reduction is simply way too small compared to just normaly taking the hit and you have to waste an entire turn for doing so. It's pathetic.
And the thing with missing your attack if the enemies attack is lower than yours (by just 1 point for example) is a really bad idea.
Check this:
Guy A: 400 Attack points and 300 health 20 agility. Guy B 1 Hp, 21 Agility and 1 attack. Guy B would win according to your new plan.
____________
"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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DarkCrystal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Staright out of line
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posted March 07, 2009 11:53 AM |
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OK. What about that?
Damage = Attack - (2*Agility + 0.5*Defence)
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Sometimes I'm about to yell: "It is flat you idiots!" But I don't wanna die in fire.
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Ednaguy
Supreme Hero
My water just broke! No, wait.
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posted March 07, 2009 11:55 AM |
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Quote:
BTW, I'm thinking about to make "avoid" action like this: If your agility < enemy's => normal enemy's attack. If your agility > enemy's => enemy missed. What do you think?
Then the only reason to use avoid attack would be if you had higher agility than your opponent. IMO agility should be a passive ability, like defence, where the opponent has a chance to miss at you. In that case the formula should be something like this: Chance to hit= Attackers agility/targets agility. In that case, if you have an agility of 5, you would have 83% chance to hit a person with 6 agility, and 56% chance to hit a person with 9 agility. If this becomes overpowered, you could make a miss do 25/33/50% of the normal attack's damage.
Also,(IMO) for the buffs/debuffs, the increasement/decreasement should be a %, and depending on Spell Power and target's magic resistance (only for debuffs).
____________
"Edna, there's a special, tiny, tiny place in hell, waiting just for you... "
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DarkCrystal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Staright out of line
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posted March 07, 2009 12:01 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
BTW, I'm thinking about to make "avoid" action like this: If your agility < enemy's => normal enemy's attack. If your agility > enemy's => enemy missed. What do you think?
Then the only reason to use avoid attack would be if you had higher agility than your opponent. IMO agility should be a passive ability, like defence, where the opponent has a chance to miss at you. In that case the formula should be something like this: Chance to hit= Attackers agility/targets agility. In that case, if you have an agility of 5, you would have 83% chance to hit a person with 6 agility, and 56% chance to hit a person with 9 agility. If this becomes overpowered, you could make a miss do 25/33/50% of the normal attack's damage.
To be honest I don't like a % chance in such games. Why? Because the chance is random and may happen as well as may not happen, there must be a something like six-sided dice to see. It's allright, but it can cause a not honest playing. What if mod don't like somebody personally? But what about new formula?
Quote:
Also,(IMO) for the buffs/debuffs, the increasement/decreasement should be a %, and depending on Spell Power and target's magic resistance (only for debuffs).
That's a good idea. Thanks.
____________
Sometimes I'm about to yell: "It is flat you idiots!" But I don't wanna die in fire.
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Ednaguy
Supreme Hero
My water just broke! No, wait.
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posted March 07, 2009 12:11 PM |
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Quote:
To be honest I don't like a % chance in such games. Why? Because the chance is random and may happen as well as may not happen, there must be a something like six-sided dice to see.
http://www.random.org/
Quote:
It's allright, but it can cause a not honest playing. What if mod don't like somebody personally?
That's why we should have an al-neutral game-leader
Quote:
But what about new formula?
In this case agility is 4x better than defence... ?
Quote:
That's a good idea. Thanks.
Sure, no problem. % is always good 
____________
"Edna, there's a special, tiny, tiny place in hell, waiting just for you... "
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted March 07, 2009 12:13 PM |
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Edna is correct. In the new formula there is no sense in picking Defence anymore because you'll take 4 times less dmg if you invest that point in agility.
I like the idea of it being passive and it giving the chance for evasion. I'd add critical hits though.
____________
"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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DarkCrystal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Staright out of line
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posted March 07, 2009 12:16 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
To be honest I don't like a % chance in such games. Why? Because the chance is random and may happen as well as may not happen, there must be a something like six-sided dice to see.
http://www.random.org/
It gives a random result every time, so we are not able to check honest plaing. 
Quote:
Quote:
It's allright, but it can cause a not honest playing. What if mod don't like somebody personally?
That's why we should have an al-neutral game-leader
I know, I can lead battles, but what if I'm out? And in that case other mods will have not much job.
Isee that avoid action was not a good idea. Maybe get rid from it at all?
____________
Sometimes I'm about to yell: "It is flat you idiots!" But I don't wanna die in fire.
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Azagal
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Smooth Snake
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posted March 07, 2009 12:21 PM |
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Did you read my proposal at all btw? Or is it simply to bad too consider ? It may need tweaking but I think it's a start.
____________
"All I can see is what's in front of me. And all I can do is keep moving forward" - The Heir Wielder of Names, Seeker of Thrones, King of Swords, Breaker of Infinities, Wheel Smashing Lord
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Ednaguy
Supreme Hero
My water just broke! No, wait.
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posted March 07, 2009 12:27 PM |
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Quote:
It gives a random result every time, so we are not able to check honest plaing.
If you/another game leader leads the battle it would be honest playing. I guess the battles would go something like this: Person A and person B sends their 5 actions to game leader. Game leader posts actions here, but after every attack where the attacker has more agility than hte defender, he/she uses the random generator to check if the person hits or not.
Quote:
I know, I can lead battles, but what if I'm out? And in that case other mods will have not much job.
Why shouldn't the other mods be able to lead the game as well? Elvin is a moderator, so he should have a neutral view, and Asheera is also pretty neutral. I know Geny has some "enemys" here, though he could just not lead the fights where they participate.
Quote:
I see that avoid action was not a good idea. Maybe get rid from it at all?
IMO you should get rid of avoid action, but keep agility.
____________
"Edna, there's a special, tiny, tiny place in hell, waiting just for you... "
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DarkCrystal
Promising
Supreme Hero
Staright out of line
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posted March 07, 2009 12:33 PM |
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Quote:
If you/another game leader leads the battle it would be honest playing. I guess the battles would go something like this: Person A and person B sends their 5 actions to game leader. Game leader posts actions here, but after every attack where the attacker has more agility than hte defender, he/she uses the random generator to check if the person hits or not.
I understood that and I like this idea too.
Quote:
Why shouldn't the other mods be able to lead the game as well? Elvin is a moderator, so he should have a neutral view, and Asheera is also pretty neutral. I know Geny has some "enemys" here, though he could just not lead the fights where they participate.
Well, anyway let's try. I hope mods would be honest.
Quote:
IMO you should get rid of avoid action, but keep agility.
Confirmed! 
BTW, I think I can offer Azagal mod status.
____________
Sometimes I'm about to yell: "It is flat you idiots!" But I don't wanna die in fire.
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mamgaeater
Legendary Hero
Shroud, Flying, Trample, Haste
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posted March 07, 2009 01:53 PM |
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Ermm DC can i relocate those double points myself?
only the ones that would've been the second point for advancing though...
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