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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Behold! Battle of Dragons. Dungeon vs Rampart.
Thread: Behold! Battle of Dragons. Dungeon vs Rampart. This thread is 11 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT»
Djive
Djive


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
posted February 24, 2002 10:27 PM
Edited By: Djive on 24 Feb 2002

Quote:
the sacrifice is a killer spell, so dungeon still had a chance, but why wait with blacks, they had the chance to hit pegasi and golds, and after that the minos can hit on something...who is scared of those 40 elves, as you said scorps alrdy in range, so you have to attack attack and attack with what you got...



The blacks will almost certainly get a 'double' attack (if we really want it), but I'd say it's a bit of a disaster if dungeon allow the Dendroids to bind them.

Notice that the Harpies blocked the square from which we could have attacked the Golds through the Pegasi. And attacking the Golds (and breath hits Pegasi) places Blacks in range for the Dendroids and all the other Rampart units for that matter.

So I'm fairly certain that waiting with blacks is the best alternative. The harpy move on the other hand was not the best one.

Also with both Stoneskin and Shield in effect, the Dragons do a lot less damage to the level 1-6 than they would have done otherwise.

I'm fairly certain that Dungeon can't win this combat using attack, attack, attack... The hitpoint advantage of the Rampart is just too big for that tactics to be workable.

If dungeon is to have any chance whatsover then the units must leave the 10-hex range of the elves, and dungeon shooters must have targets within the 10-hex range.

You said the elves were insignificant but in this combat it's them that's doing a very large portion of the Rampart damage.

Added to clarify: You couldn't hit the Pegasi from the South and have breath hit Goldies. The Harpies were blocking one of the required hexes for the Blackies, so it couldn't make that attack.

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andiangelsla...
andiangelslayer


Disgraceful
Famous Hero
posted February 24, 2002 10:54 PM

ya well i ment to hit the pegasi from the south together with the blacks, and than the minos the golds too prolly, once them and the pegasi are down rampart has a speed problem, and dungeon a strong shooter line with medusas eyes and ballista

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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted February 25, 2002 03:16 AM

I was just gone for 2 days and so much has happened!
By the way, I think waiting with Blackies and sacrificing Troglodytes for Minotaurs are good moves!!  Well done, Djive!

Wanted to make a move, but don't have time to think about it at the moment.  I'll be back.



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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted February 25, 2002 03:29 AM

By the way, I think it would be a good strategy to try finishing the Pegasus and GD as soon as possible and at the same time keeping out of the firing range of the Elves.  No concrete plans yet, just a thought.

Guess what the Rampart would have to do without Pegasus and GD?  Only to come to EE and MQ, I guess

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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted February 25, 2002 09:03 AM
Edited By: Snogard on 25 Feb 2002

So nobody wants to move huh?

Well then,

Minotaur King attacts Silver Pegasus from south-east (hence where the Gold Dragon used to be, the tail part not the head - in case somebody wants to diagonally attact SP and GD from south-west with Black Dragon, a hex can be kept in-between BD and MK )

errrrrhh... let me see...


0.93 * 1.3 * 0.85 * 0.7 * 21 * 16 = 241 (hope I got it right...)


that will be, killing 8 SP and leaving the top with 12hp.



SP retaliate with,

0.7 * 0.7 * 14 * 7 = 48,

killing none and leaving the top MK with 2hp.


Grand Elves' next (come on, let's get this game over fast).  

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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 25, 2002 09:29 AM

Ok, it seems my stupid move of pegasus gives Dungeon a much better position. That's a really stupid move.

Btw, Djive's sacrifice spell is also great. Who cares about those lowly trogs.

Ok, ok, it seems this battle is somewhat a defensive battle. Both sides cast protective spells at first to reduce damages but it's not so good for dungeon to do so since it can't take advantage of its magic.

Well, if nobody object, I think maybe it's time to take offensive actions for rampart to see if it can win this way. I don't think it's the best way but I'm tired of the wait/protect elves/shoot/defend tricks. Let's try the all-out attacks mode for rampart to see if it can win under the following disadvantages:-
a). no offense specialty
b). no use of its archery specialty coz elves will soon die.

So, rampart cast expert bless !
Still the turn of elves. I suggest shoot those kings and followed up by centaur & unicons coz kings can't retar.
Dendroid will take care of scorp and also dwarves attacks scorp. Let's see whether rampart is good offensively.
Just a crazy plan nobody may agree.


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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted February 25, 2002 09:37 AM

Wow!  That's ... ... crazy!
How about after your bless spell, put it to autocombat

Seriously, crazy your idea maybe, but sounds quite... interesting.



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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 25, 2002 09:45 AM

Ya, that's crazy coz I've done some quick calculation. Damage done by elves > combined damage by centaur/unicorn. So, it maybe a stupid idea even AI may not make.....

But why I do that ??? coz I want to make centaur/unicorn in the middle so that they can cross field in 1 turn and if blackie dare to touch elves, dendroid can bind it. Well, just a very rush idea and I must say it's not well calculated (I'm poor at calculation, btw) and dungeon shooters are also good fighters......so, even after all the odds, can rampart win ??? Btw, long battle is in the favour of dungeon coz of spell pt advantage and especially sacrifice spell and those fodder hags.

So, anybody disagree with the attacking plan can stop me before it's too late.
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sos
sos


Known Hero
posted February 25, 2002 04:41 PM
Edited By: sos on 26 Feb 2002

Some pretty dumb moves on the rampart part
I think golds should have atacked blackies in the first move this turn - there is no 0.7 shield reduction + there is no sacrifice on blackies. Then pegasi and maybe unicorns would follow. Anyway,

elves shoot kings doing 41 * 2 (shots) * 6 (expert bless) * 0.7 (A/D) * 1.5 (Expert archery) = 517 damage.
10 kings remain, top with 35 health.

evil eyes next.

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Thunder
Thunder


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted February 26, 2002 09:28 PM

!Overlord waits with the Evil Eyes!

I didn't want to attack either Battle Dwarwes or Dendroid Soldiers with them as both of the troops have defense in effect already. Furthermore, I want to see if those Dendroids dare to move closer into the range of Evil Eyes.

!It is now turn of the Medusa Queens!
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Djive
Djive


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
posted February 26, 2002 09:36 PM

The same goes for the Medusa Queens. Dendroids are still in range, but I'm not at all sure they're the best to attack, but if they move towards the Medusa the medusa will do more damage. If nothing else we can shoot some Elves or hit a Goldie.

!Overlord waits with Medusa Queens!

!Now turn of the Battle Dwarves.!
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sos
sos


Known Hero
posted February 26, 2002 10:40 PM
Edited By: sos on 26 Feb 2002

dwarves defend

dendros next

I suggest all rampart units defend this turn. As i said earlier Rampart dont need to fight to win this battle as long as elves shoot. Blackies can have a good attack this turn, but cannot afford to stay in range next turn, because elves + the rest of the troops will hurt them badly. So let us stay put and shoot dungeon to death lol

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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted February 27, 2002 01:46 AM

Quote:
Some pretty dumb moves on the rampart part
I think golds should have atacked blackies in the first move this turn - there is no 0.7 shield reduction + there is no sacrifice on blackies. Then pegasi and maybe unicorns would follow. Anyway,

elves shoot kings doing 41 * 2 * 6 * 0.7 * 1.5 = 517 damage.
10 kings remain, top with 35 health.

evil eyes next.



I don't really understand this calculation, is it correct?
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Fantusta
Fantusta


Known Hero
who wishes he was high
posted February 27, 2002 02:08 AM

Dendroids defend, turn of Queens now.
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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted February 27, 2002 03:04 AM

What about Dwarves?
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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 27, 2002 05:02 AM

It seems Snogard edits his move of kings
so that a space is left for blackie for
double attack. Maybe I should edit my move
of pegasus which is the dumpest move of rampart
, lol. But anyway, mistake has been made, so
let it be the case.

Well, seems nobody agree with my stupid plan of
rampart all-out attack. So, let's stick to defensive
play. Sorry for the chaos I've made.
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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted February 27, 2002 05:36 AM

Quote:
It seems Snogard edits his move of kings
so that a space is left for blackie for
double attack. Maybe I should edit my move
of pegasus which is the dumpest move of rampart
, lol. But anyway, mistake has been made, so
let it be the case.

Well, seems nobody agree with my stupid plan of
rampart all-out attack. So, let's stick to defensive
play. Sorry for the chaos I've made.



... ... I just realised that GD has already shifted after I made my move and I thought it's O.K to amend a move (immediately) before the next player make a move...

I'll be more than willing to "de-edit" my move if required, and I'm sorry if I've violated the rules.

I think your stupid plan of rampart all-out attack is not that stupid though

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zhuge
zhuge


Hired Hero
posted February 27, 2002 06:49 AM

thunderknight: Goldie attacks minotaur kings from the east
thunderknight: pegasi attacks kings from where they stand

snogard: Minotaur King attacts Silver Pegasus from south-east (hence where the Gold Dragon used to be, the tail part not the head - in case somebody wants to diagonally attact SP and GD from south-west with Black Dragon, a hex can be kept in-between BD and MK )   ???


It seems to me that if the BD wants to attack both SP and GD at the end of round 3 then it is exposing itself to an attack by GD on MK and BD at the start of round 4.

Better would be MK attacks SP from east instead of south-east as played.

I have gone through previous play briefly. Dungeon is playing too much on Rampart's half of the battlefield. Not exactly very wise considering the Elves have Expert Archery and are well defended.

While there were inconsistencies on both sides, attacking  Dendroids with Scorpicores and advancing Harpy Hags so far upfield in round 1 seem to be the more critical ones.

A numerical system similar to algebraic notation in chess might help make things clearer. Numbering rows 1-11 as a-k
with a being topmost and columns 1-15 (note that these are staggered) as 1-15 with 1 being leftmost.
For example:
MK to a5
instead of  
Minotaur Kings move 8 hexes up to the right so that they are 3 hexes in front of the Medusa Queens.

Attacks can use the symbol X for brevity.

Just my 2 cents.

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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 27, 2002 10:55 AM

Quote:
I just realised that GD has already shifted after I made my move and I thought it's O.K to amend a move (immediately) before the next player make a move...

Agreed, that's why I won't edit my move. That would cause more chaos.

Btw, zhuge, did your username has anything to do with
"Zhuge Liang" ??? Just curious.
Maybe you would like to join the party. After all, it's Battle of "Dragons".
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zhuge
zhuge


Hired Hero
posted February 27, 2002 03:08 PM

To thunderknight:
I'll let you figure out my username for yourself.  You can get a couple of clues from Astralwizard if you read reviews.
IMO,  with its present state of affairs the battle is a rather 'foregone conclusion' but well that's just my view, mistakes may well jump in before the end so by all means do carry on. I'll probably chip in just a little as I see fit.

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