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| Thread: Behold! Battle of Dragons. Dungeon vs Rampart. |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted February 27, 2002 06:29 PM |
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A few things..
Well, first about the double-attack from Blackies, as far as i can see it's not possible for Blackies to attack Pegasi and Hit Gold with Breath and have a space between Kings and Blackies.
However, the position of the Kings was pretty clear from the move, so when it's Blackies turn Dungeon will have to take a pick on what to do. The Blackies will be adjacent to the Kings opening up for a double attack from Rampart with Gold Dragons. (Gold attack Kings and also hit Blackies.)
The move order is now (other creature have used their moves):
Ballista
Medusa Queens
Evlil Eyes
Centaur Captains
War Unicorns
Black Dragons
!Ballista shoot Grand Elves!
Ballista does 140*0.85*0.93*.5=55 damage to Grand Elves
38 Grand Elves remain, top with 4 Health
Now turn of the Medusa Queens
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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Snogard
Known Hero
customised
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posted February 28, 2002 02:30 AM |
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Quote:
Well, first about the double-attack from Blackies, as far as i can see it's not possible for Blackies to attack Pegasi and Hit Gold with Breath and have a space between Kings and Blackies...
Kings were placed there with the intention to avoid the binders, permit a double-attack and at the same time leaving a space in-between, but seems like I've made a miscalculation after all... ...
well anyway,
Medusa Queens shoot at Grand Elves for
36 * 3.5 * 0.93 * 0.85 = 99 damage.
34 Grand Elves remain, top with 10hp.
Evil Eyes next.
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Seize The Day.
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zhuge
Hired Hero
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posted February 28, 2002 03:23 AM |
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Djive wrote:
Well, first about the double-attack from Blackies, as far as i can see it's not possible for Blackies to attack Pegasi and Hit Gold with Breath and have a space between Kings and Blackies.
Exactly! I mentioned this in my first post, pointing out that attacking Pegasi from East would be better.
Also, Ballista damage in round 2 should have been 55 as in round 3 (instead of 68) as Stone Skin was already cast.
Corrections yield 1 extra Grand Elf, doing extra damage to Minotaur Kings in round 3 by 1 * 6 * 2 * 0.7 * 1.5 = 12.6, thus 42 (instead of 41) Elves do 529 damage (instead of 517)
38 Grand Elves, 4HP left is changed to 39 Grand Elves, 2HP left
10 Mino Kings, 35HP left is changed to 10 Mino Kings, 23HP left
After Snogard's attack with Medusa Queens
36 * 7 * 0.5 * 0.925 * 0.85 = 99dam
39 Grand Elves, 2HP is reduced to 32 Grand Elves, 8HP left
The problem with mock battles such as these is calculations tend to become rather tedious. Counter checks from time to time help ensure correctness.
Still the difference here is minimal, should have had no bearing on deciding moves made in round 3 and the final outcome not influenced.
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thunderknight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted February 28, 2002 05:37 AM |
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Well, wait dungeon move for eyes.
It seems defend with unicorn & centaur
to protect elves for another round is a
more "reasonable" move. Just wait to see.
Ya, the battle is still not yet decided
(at least not clearly decided  )
zhuge, about your username, it's just my
curious guess. 
____________
Choose what you love
and love what you choose.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted February 28, 2002 12:34 PM |
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Edited By: Djive on 28 Feb 2002
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Yes, I noticed that the Ballista damage should have been recalculated for round 2. (The damage done was still in range, so it would not have been unreasonable to let it stay.)
We usually, countercheck everything, but in this case I made the error of copying the damage without thinking about the Stoneskin effect.
Snogard, the fact that you can't leave a space in between is something you're going to discover when you move the Blacks, so therefore I'll say that your move stands.
The thing I thought wrong about the harpy move was similar (Blacks Breath can hit harpies if Gold attacks them next round), but when looked at it a bit closer it appears that there's only position to place golds for this to be possible and if the Golds attack from that position, then their breath will hit both Blacks and Pegasi.) So Harpy move wasn't as bad as I first thought.
!Evil Eyes shoot Gold Dragons!
Evil Eyes do 46*4* (A/D=23-44) * 0.53 * 0.85 / 2 = 41 damage.
5 Gold Dragons left, top with 201 Health
The intention, Blacks can now attack from North-East and hit Golds, reducing them to 4 (very doubtful if they had done that without this attack) and also hit pegasi. Gold will retaliate but I believe we can live with that.
!Turn of the Centaur Captains!
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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zhuge
Hired Hero
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posted February 28, 2002 04:27 PM |
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Previously there were 5 Gold Dragons, 242HP left.
After the Evil Eye attack there are now 5 Gold Dragons, 201HP left.
An attack at the end of round 3 by Black Dragons on Golds will do
6 * 45 * 1.3 * 0.85 * 0.9 = 268.5
So either way the Gold Dragons will be reduced to 4.
I'm uncertain if a North-East attacking move by Blacks will hit the Pegasi (unless the Black Dragons turn back while making the attack). I'll check tonight to be sure.
Anyway skewering Pegs and Golds with a hit on Pegs incurs very little retaliation with good damage and is still a nice viable option if the Unis don't block though there are a number of satisfactory replies next round.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted February 28, 2002 04:48 PM |
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Lazy dragons!
They don't turn to attack, if you attack the front hex for a two-hex creature, not even if you indicate that they are to attack in the "forward" direction. They will turn around if you attack, the back-hex, but that is not going to hit the pegasi in this case.)
You are right about the damage the black would have downed another Gold Dragon anyway. Still any damage done to Gold Dragons are not going to be regained through resurrection. And Dungeon still has the option to attack the Pegasi without retaliation (without hitting the Gold, and leaving themseves open to a breath-attack)
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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sos
Known Hero
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posted February 28, 2002 06:05 PM |
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Edited By: sos on 28 Feb 2002
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Captains defend.
can somebody defend with the unicorns so we can move on?
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Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
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posted February 28, 2002 08:41 PM |
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As you wish
War Unicorns defend.
Black Dragons next.
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Snogard
Known Hero
customised
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posted March 01, 2002 02:41 AM |
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Quote:
Lazy dragons!
They don't turn to attack, if you attack the front hex for a two-hex creature, not even if you indicate that they are to attack in the "forward" direction. They will turn around if you attack, the back-hex, but that is not going to hit the pegasi in this case.)
Now, that's "LEARNING"! Thank you, both Djive and Zhuge (I know your name is not "Liang" )
Shall I make the move for the Blackies? Tempted to, but I guess I will wait for a while. Maybe somebody else has got a better move.
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Seize The Day.
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zhuge
Hired Hero
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posted March 01, 2002 03:51 AM |
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Djive's observations are correct. Just would like to add that if the Blacks were placed more on the right of the battlefield as compared to the same position of Golds and Pegs then when they turn back to make a strike, they WILL in this case really hit both Golds and Pegs.
But as the case stands, Blacks are placed on the left as compared to Golds, and so being a quirk of programming will not turn and hit 2 creatures.
Hitting Pegs and Golds from below is free damage as mentioned by Djive.
Try to think ahead in round 4 and you may be able to see the conclusion already.
To Snogard:
Well actually my name is neither Liang nor my surname Zhuge.
My HANDLE is Zhuge. All names you see at Astralwizard for my ex-guild are all handles. My name on the other hand is not disclosable I'm afraid. ;P
To everybody:
I wonder if any of you have tried the Battlemaps or Battlegrounds at www.h3trio.com and www.mmportals.com.
If so I would certainly like to hear some ideas/comments.
I've just started a new thread on this a day or two ago which doesn't seem to be getting much of a reply.
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sos
Known Hero
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posted March 01, 2002 05:37 AM |
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just wanted to invite everyone to feel free to play along. dont be afraid that you may make a bad move - everyone does that . The more the merrier.
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thunderknight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted March 01, 2002 06:49 AM |
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It's also very tempting for me to
make a move for blackie..........
attack dendroid. 
But I can't or I'll be executed
by angry dungeon players.
Come on, take a try.
____________
Choose what you love
and love what you choose.
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Snogard
Known Hero
customised
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posted March 01, 2002 08:31 AM |
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Quote:
Djive's observations are correct. Just would like to add that if the Blacks were placed more on the right of the battlefield as compared to the same position of Golds and Pegs then when they turn back to make a strike, they WILL in this case really hit both Golds and Pegs.
But as the case stands, Blacks are placed on the left as compared to Golds, and so being a quirk of programming will not turn and hit 2 creatures.
Hitting Pegs and Golds from below is free damage as mentioned by Djive.
Try to think ahead in round 4 and you may be able to see the conclusion already.
Sorry, I know I'm slow. Can anybody elaborate this?
Quote:
To Snogard:
Well actually my name is neither Liang nor my surname Zhuge.
My HANDLE is Zhuge. All names you see at Astralwizard for my ex-guild are all handles. My name on the other hand is not disclosable I'm afraid. ;P
Actually, I've just mentioned that for Thunderknight's sake To me, over here you are Zhuge and that's it.
Quote:
just wanted to invite everyone to feel free to play along. dont be afraid that you may make a bad move - everyone does that . The more the merrier.
You're right! It's so unpredictable, and that's why it's interesting. I would say, anybody can beat me flat on this game anytime of the day, and yet I'm still making moves (sorry, dungeon players);P. So come on, come on... ...
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Seize The Day.
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Djive
Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
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posted March 01, 2002 11:08 AM |
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Edited By: Djive on 1 Mar 2002
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Even though the minotaurs and harpies are not in optimal places, I still think the best is to take out as many Goldies and Pegasi this turn as possible.
!Black Dragons attack Silver Pegasi. Breath hits Gold Dragons!
Damage to Silver Pegasi 6 * 45 * (1.35+0.3) * 0.85 * 0.7 = 265
Killing 9 (240+12) and leaving top with 17 Health.
5 Silver Pegasi remain, top with 17 Health
Damage to Gold Dragons 6 * 45 * 1.3 * 0.85 * 0.9 = 268
Killing 1 (201) and leaving top with 183 Health.
4 Gold Dragons remain, top with 183 Health
Time for a summary Thunder. (I won't be able to upload pics this time around at least not for the next 2-3 days.)
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"A brilliant light can either illuminate or blind. How will you know which until you open your eyes?"
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zhuge
Hired Hero
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posted March 01, 2002 12:01 PM |
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Djive stated:
Even though the minotaurs and harpies are not in optimal places, I still think the best is to take out as many Goldies and Pegasi this turn as possible.
Yes, I can fully agree with this.
Notice that with Shield and Stoneskin, damage done to Golds as compared to lesser creatures is almost similar and as sos mentioned before, this provides much better reason to take them out first because of their high damage capabilities, not to mention enabling a wider range of tactical options once 2-hex breath attack is crippled or out of the equation.
Play on. The next choice of move for Golds should not be too much of a headache.
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sos
Known Hero
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posted March 01, 2002 04:46 PM |
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Edited By: sos on 1 Mar 2002
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yea I also agree that this was he best move with the blackies. Overall not a bad turn for dingeon - resurrecting the minos and double dragon attack. The good news for rampart is that golds have a nice attack next turn (although not as good as blackies this turn), and if blackies want to hit something they must stay in the range of elves. Also rampart units are blessed and can stay blessed until the end of the combat if they want. Dungeon can't do anything about it, because Rampart can always counter their spell (if it is not resisted lol). That means Rampart should wait with casting until Dungeon casts. If nothing bad happens when its elves turn we resurrect all killed elves and 61 of them will drop 2 blackies. Next turn will be decisive I think.
Quote:
!Harpy Hags move out of 10-hex range of Grand Elves. Two rows South on the hex which is just outside the 10-hex range.) Harpy Hags now stands on the second row.!
where exactly are hags? 2 hexes south of where they were is still within 10 hexes from elves. 2 south and 1 west is outside.
I think we should use the zhuge's notation. are hags on j9 or j10?
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zhuge
Hired Hero
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posted March 02, 2002 04:15 AM |
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To sos:
All very good and valid points. Not the entire picture but many of the main points in round 4 have been covered. The Blacks have a good square after the Golds strike but anything within range of the elves cannot be absolutely satisfactory. With a little imagination and calculation, you should see what I mentioned as a 'foregone conclusion' previously. Perhaps Dungeon should start taking wilder shots?
Hags are on j9, if they were on j10 they would be within full bowshot of the Elves which is obviously not what Djive intended.
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thunderknight
Promising
Famous Hero
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posted March 02, 2002 04:41 AM |
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Well, I guess hags are not what we care now.
Actually, they may be the next target for sacrifice.
Unless nothing to shoot, I don't think elves will aim at
them.
Hmm, now maybe next turn is the concluding turn. So, come on, both dungeon & rampart players, take a move or I will.........do something surprising and stupid.
Well, actually, the dumb move of pegasi is half drunken half purposely.........
Forgone conclusion..........hahahahaha
____________
Choose what you love
and love what you choose.
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sos
Known Hero
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posted March 02, 2002 05:37 AM |
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let's wait for summary and picture from Thunder. And no more drinking and playing, at least not on the Rampart side lol
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