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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Behold! Battle of Dragons. Dungeon vs Rampart.
Thread: Behold! Battle of Dragons. Dungeon vs Rampart. This thread is 11 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT»
sos
sos


Known Hero
posted March 05, 2002 05:20 PM

well, after you convenietly placed pagasi so the spell hit 5 units I see no point in protecting the elves. We will still resurrect them and do good damage with them this turn tho. I suggest unicorns wait, centaurus hit minos, then elves, dendros and dwarves almost kill scorps, finally unicorns can attack harpies. Next turn if blackes want to attack elves they will be binded by dendros and attacked with the other units, if not then we attack on the dungeon side and elves shoot with range penalty.

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Djive
Djive


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
posted March 05, 2002 05:46 PM
Edited By: Djive on 5 Mar 2002

I just checked it out. Unfortunately for Dungeon the only unit I really wanted to hit resisted, but on the good side the spell hit the other 4 units. As a small consolation I'm happy I didn't cast Mass Curse with this outcome. Rampart would have defended with all units and then hit with the Elves.

If you wonder what that means then the Grand Elves resisted.

13 War Unicorns remain, top with 70 Health
81 Battle Dwarves remain, top with 10 Health
111 Centaur Captains remain
No Silver Pegasi remain


With this ourcome it's probably better to attack with Scorpicores and hope for Paralyzation of Dendroids. That will aid Dungeon a lot. Scorpicores are not going to be useful after the Grand Elves have attacked them.
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sos
sos


Known Hero
posted March 05, 2002 07:33 PM

well, I am sure glad the pegasi are gone. In 2 turns thunderknight was able to kill 22 of them for almost nothing. I only hope that they were the only "spy" rampart unit

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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted March 06, 2002 02:38 AM

Quote:
well, I am sure glad the pegasi are gone. In 2 turns thunderknight was able to kill 22 of them for almost nothing. I only hope that they were the only "spy" rampart unit


Then you are wrong.  Thunderknight, time to activate SPY UNIT no. 2


Alright, I think there is really nothing much we can do about Scorpicores,

Scorpicores attact Dendroid Soldiers, for


0.72*1.3*0.85*0.7*10*14 = 77 damages;



18 DS left with top 15HP retaliate for


0.55*0.7*14*18 = 97 damages


9 Scorps. left with top 63HP.

War Unicorns are next.


Is it correct for me to say that Dungeon is left with 92 spell points?  Just want to ensure.
   
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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted March 06, 2002 04:06 AM

Oh ya, I share the same opinion with you, sos.

So, unicorn wait. Next comes hags.

Sorry, Snogard, no more spy units. Rampart
units are resistant to my hypnosis due to
the expert resistance skill of rampart hero.

zhuge, thanks for your kind words, the 2nd pegasus
move is simply dumb coz I'm not aware that blackie
already make its move and kings already attacked.
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Aculias
Aculias


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
posted March 06, 2002 05:15 AM

Well unless you can wipe out the Dendroids too with the help of the dwarves why  do you need the elves to help where they can hurt someone else that is more dangerous.
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andiangelsla...
andiangelslayer


Disgraceful
Famous Hero
posted March 06, 2002 11:20 AM

its all just a big toss, how can you ever calculate resistance, specials and so on? set up a map with that battle, post the link in your thread, and than you guys meet on the battlefield without half an hour of math for 1 move...if someone can read the community he can fight a 10 or 15min battle aswell, and than you can post and discuss the outcomes.
the other battles like stronghold vs castle at least didnt have resistance and units with specials...

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Djive
Djive


Honorable
Supreme Hero
Zapper of Toads
posted March 06, 2002 12:16 PM
Edited By: Djive on 6 Mar 2002

Andi - stop posting saying that we're wasting our time here. It's simply not productive.

Describing a combat so others understand is probably a lot more difficult than just posting here. Counting out the damage is easier. If you were describing a combat how would you for instance describe TK's latest pegasi move?

And what's there to discuss if the combat is already finished?

Resistance and specials of creatures are needed. Without them the outcome becomes a bit too predictible, since we've already streamlined damage (always average), luck (none) and morale (none).

Hmmm need to check for Paralyzation of Dendroids, but none of the posters are on-line right now. Will do it a bit later... Until then... posters should keep in mind that the dendroids might have been paralyzed and there could be 10 scorpricores left.

ADDED::
Corrections to the Scorpicores damage:
Scorpicores do 17 damage not 14, so the damage is adjusted to 99.

This leaves only 17 Dendroid Soldiers, top with 63 Health.

Dendroid Soldiers were Paralyzed. (Thus the retaliation never happened, still 10 Scorpicores remaining)

Hmmm, things are beginning to look grim for Rampart...

Anyway...

!Harpy Hags attack Gold Dragons!

Harpy Hags do 36 * 2.5 * 1.3 (Offence) * 0.43 (A/D) * 0.85 (Armorer) = 43 damage.

4 Gold Dragons remain, top with 60 Health.

!Cenatur Captains are next.

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rychenroller
rychenroller


Promising
Supreme Hero
posted March 06, 2002 12:17 PM

I agree with AndiAngelTosser!!


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sos
sos


Known Hero
posted March 06, 2002 06:21 PM
Edited By: sos on 6 Mar 2002

I agree with Djive

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Aculias
Aculias


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Pretty Boy Angel Sacraficer
posted March 07, 2002 04:52 AM

I agree that the two disagreers should stick with toh threads & stick with your own tossed up group.
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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted March 07, 2002 05:03 AM

Quote:
If you were describing a combat how would you for instance describe TK's latest pegasi move?

That's simply dumb move pretended to be wise.

Ok, after death of traitor pegasus, let's back to business.

Centaur attack kings from north east i.e. row 5, hex 3&4 counted from east. So it's outside 10 hex shooting range and kings cannot make use of goldie breath to hurt centaur.

111 * 3 * 0.7 * 0.625 = 145
killing 3 kings, leaving
4 MK, top with 14 hp

No retarliation.

It's point of no return, let the dragon crashes !!!

Next comes kings.
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sos
sos


Known Hero
posted March 07, 2002 05:34 AM
Edited By: sos on 6 Mar 2002

man, why do you always insist on placing some troop next to your dragons, so the blackies can have double attack? Now you are forced to move your goldies next turn first, instead of maybe waiting with them. If you attack next turn only goldies and maybe unicorns can reach the other side, either attacking blackes with a good retaliation and full shooter damage, or attacking shooters and leaving blackes alone. Both doesnt seem very good.

I would wait with captains and move them after dungeon shoots. Attack either minos or harpies, but now they can be placed more agresively to a place where they will reach blackies or evil eyes next turn.

Try to think a bit ahead when playing


oh yea, and expert bless will make captains do 4 damage, not 3.

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zhuge
zhuge


Hired Hero
posted March 07, 2002 06:10 AM

sos admonished:
man, why do you always insist on placing some troop next to your dragons, so the blackies can have double attack?

Spy unit no.2??

Ah well, players come in different skill levels and talents. I share your dislike of the move but let's also give the junior players some room. We all learn from mistakes, though I would be more cautious in making them in a 'public correspondence' battle.
Btw sos if it's any consolation actually Centaurs do 4 dam each with Exp Bless instead of 3. Regardless, another Sacrifice is already in the blueprint so it should make little difference.

sos continued:
Now you are forced to move your goldies next turn first, instead of maybe waiting with them. If you attack next turn only goldies and maybe unicorns can reach the other side, either attacking blackes with a good retaliation and full shooter damage, or attacking shooters and leaving blackes alone. Both doesnt seem very good.

Both aren't good at all! You need another alternative. Watch fodder hags, they are fodder after all.

sos added:
I would wait with captains and move them after dungeon shoots. Attack either minos or harpies, but now they can be placed more agresively to a place where they will reach blackies or evil eyes next turn.
Try to think a bit ahead when playing  

Yes, a far more flexible approach. A discussion at the end of the battle would serve to round up things nicely and hopefully provide a basis for sharper play.

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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted March 07, 2002 06:32 AM

Cool it guys.  We all make mistakes (public or not) and we learn from them.  Anyway, this is not ToH or something like that where you play for honour or stuffs.  The only thing we gain here (either win or lose) is just lots of good fun ... and hopefully some game experience!

Here is another low level and untalented player's move

MK retreat to row 5, hex 4 from the west.


Grand Elves' next.  More blood shedding I suppose......


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zhuge
zhuge


Hired Hero
posted March 07, 2002 09:53 AM
Edited By: zhuge on 7 Mar 2002

Details aside, now would be a good time for a certain spell. Kindly draft a bit of follow up after target selection is made (should also not prove too difficult) so that others may follow your reasoning/thoughts.

Above all keep Sacrifice in mind amongst other Dungeon spells and try to minimize its impact. (from a Rampart player's point of view of course)

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Thunder
Thunder


Responsible
Famous Hero
posted March 07, 2002 11:12 AM

!Ranger casts resurrection on the Grand Elves!

Resurrecting 460 hitpoints.
31 Grand Elves resurrected.
63 Grand Elves on the field.

!It is still turn of the Grand Elves!
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thunderknight
thunderknight


Promising
Famous Hero
posted March 07, 2002 02:08 PM

If centaur wait, kings will retreat, next turn hags died, kings resurrect.

If next turn goldie go for one shooter, unicorn for another, elves shoot another. No chance for blackie breath attack.

Ok, elves shoot scorp. doing ??? damages, too lazy to calculate. (any objection, do we need to wait ????)

Not patient enough for prolong battle, other more important stuff to do so I just want to "speed up" the battle out of selfish. Sorry for that.

Well, it will be my last move in this battle. With the biggest rampart traitor gone, I think rampart stands good chance to win.
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sos
sos


Known Hero
posted March 07, 2002 03:59 PM
Edited By: sos on 7 Mar 2002

I apologize if I have offended you thunderknight. My last post was to give you an idea of what IMO is a bit better move. My plan was to kill all hags with centaurus and unicorns and place them in a position where they both can reach the other side next turn. This will leave 7 minos, but there will be no more sacrificing (at least for a while). Compared to your pegasi moves this was actually quite good, and shooting the scorpies with elves is even better. So I hope you learn something from this battle and please play along, you are getting better with every move

elves will kill all scorpies. this may be a problem tho, because if scorpies are resurrected by sacrifice they will no longer be bound by dendros. This can be prevented (at least for a while) by placing the dwarves on top of the dead scorpies, but this will expose them to full medusa damage (if medusa wait to shoot). Another option is to just move dwarves forward a bit to prevent a breath attack on dwarves and elves. Finnally unicorns will abouth half the harpies so one sacrifice will not be that bad.

I guess I take this a bit too seriously It's different than actual battle, because many factors are not taken into account; it's more like chess where you can think a lot for the best moves for you. It's interesting to see different people play, so again, please play along with us.

edited:
oops my bad - dwarves cant step on top of scorpies this turn, damn

one more point: unit that is dead, not always moves when it is resurrected in subsequent rounds. As far as I know no one has figured this out, even the great Re-Animator after a bunch of tests. It depends on when exactly is the unit resurrected (before/after its time to move, before/after its time to move on the wait phase) - sometimes the unit can move, sometimes not. This means that if Scorpies are resurrected they may or may not move that round. I guess for our purposes tho we can assume that the unit always moves the same round when resurrected, unless someone wants to follow the moves of the battle to check that

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Snogard
Snogard


Known Hero
customised
posted March 08, 2002 02:21 AM

Hey Thunderknight, we know that this battle is not going too well for the Dungeon and here you are saying of leaving!!!?  Come on, you know how much we depend on your "spy uintS".

Oh, and seems like SOS has got a rather good strategy, so don't listen to him. ;P

Well seriously, SOS has got a rather good point.  This is really like chess where you have all the time to analysis the possibilities and think of your moves.  I am never a good player and I feel that I'm learning quite a bit from it.  But the greatest fun is still that because different people are making moves, we always have to make room for the "unaccounted" - the game is alive!

So how about trying a move Andi?
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