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Heroes Community > Tavern of the Rising Sun > Thread: writing this stuff as I go...
Thread: writing this stuff as I go... This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
DagothGares
DagothGares


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
posted May 23, 2009 12:12 AM

writing this stuff as I go...

Anyway, I'm quite depressed and when I'm depressed I become insomiac (if that's even an adjective) and the gears inside my mind start turning over and over and it's really tiring, but not on a physical level, which sucks, because sleep is a welcome relief. (in fact, the only thing being more welcome would the arms of a woman, but there goes my mind wandering again). (Anyway, i'll start doing some brain and memory exercises to make me feel better)

Anyway, I was just thinking about my current state. And I was wondering: Would life look like this?
y = sin x


I mean, I am studying modernist and post-modern literature this year and one of the ideas expressed in their writing (yes, post-modern literature is usually not entirely random, but entirely thought out) was that everyone will get scratched both on a mental and physical level, since that's life. It isn't the romantic BS where life is always horrible or medieval BS where life is always good if you do what's right. Life goes up and down. You have to remember: no matter how happy you are, things will always go to worse, sooner or later. Good will always tur to bad, you will be scratched, but also don't forget that bad will turn into good. You can't expect anything from life, since it's entirely unpredictable and will probably kick you in the shins when you're depending on it.

Now, back to the sinus function:
Would a depressed person then be y = sin x - 1?
Would an anti-depressant be +1?

Now, about love, which is always pretty interesting, no? Is that not what most people are looking for? I mean some people have ambitions, sure and usually the capacity to make, but isn't it that many others seek comfort or romantic ideals in a relationship?
What is love?
Well, I always imagine that being in love is the first step, you know, dreaming, desiring, having fun, wanting. I think being in love is watching the idealised version of the person and accepting that. I think that love is twofold. I think that the necessary realisation for love is the following: This person is not perfect, but I accept his/ her flaws. That is love, no? What usually triggers this is another realisation: "I am not perfect, I am also scratched on certain levels of my being."

So would we define love as the realisation and acceptance of the flaws of your partner?
I think it's quite a good definition, but what do I know, I'm seventeen...

I think my relationship got stuck at that part. I was still in love and she already spotted flaws, plus the fact I was becoming irrational, but I'll stop writing about that, because this is not the purpose of my writing.

The post-modern author said there are generally three ways to look at a relationship: (illustrated with the three couple sin his book)
- The inability to be conscious about a relationship (animals and people who generally act on instinct)
- The refusal to be conscious about it (people who escape into booze or something)
- The attempt at being conscience in a relationship (a functional relationship where two people try to make an effort at advancing)

The third relationship is the realistic one, while the other two are the post-modern views on a romantic relationship. The first two live in a dreamscape more or less. They deny or can't perceive the flaws in their system, nor will they try to resolve anything. The third one is quite difficult to live through, because when you look at things with open eyes, you come to the two realisations (I am not perfect and neither are you), followed or preceded by the third (Everyone will be scratched on ay level). the thirdrelationship, while being the most truthful and healthy, is also the most painful and 'mature' (ironically, the third couple in the book are children).

The breaking point is either the point where you can't hide from reality (this is applicable to the second couple) or the moment where the realisations happen (the third couple).

What do you guys think? Reply quickly, because I'm growing mad!
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Nebdar
Nebdar


Promising
Supreme Hero
Generation N
posted May 23, 2009 12:22 AM
Edited by Nebdar at 00:33, 23 May 2009.

Be yourself and be happy about it. do what you feel you should do.

If you don't know what to do....... take the risk if you can, it is always worth it, because of the prize or real life expirience you can gain.

Belive that good things happen just because they do

Those that don't make mistakes learn less....
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DagothGares
DagothGares


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No gods or kings
posted May 23, 2009 12:35 AM

Oh, yes, I believe you. It's the hardships and the misery that teach us things. There is no such thing as a book or poem that is happy all the time, because you don't work or create your own mark on this world, if you're happy. (Hence why I believe that all greats were mad once)

My gears are grinding as we speak and it's driving me insane for a bit, so here I am just writing/ spamming.
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Nebdar
Nebdar


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Generation N
posted May 23, 2009 12:39 AM
Edited by Nebdar at 00:53, 23 May 2009.

And i am also in the mood of going back to the my "missed" love the girl that i still feel that we have unresolcved issues
And the  Boom
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Elvin
Elvin


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Endless Revival
posted May 23, 2009 12:55 AM

If you take the responsibility for your life you can start changing it. Slow will be the change, only in the course of time will you start; moving into the world of light and crystallization, but once you are crystallized you will know what real revolution is. Then share your revolution with others; it has to go that way, from heart to heart.
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TheDeath
TheDeath


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posted May 29, 2009 12:46 AM
Edited by TheDeath at 00:47, 29 May 2009.

Interesting analysis, though I would say it's a bit more random than that, not always so periodically predictable like a sin.

Quote:
(Hence why I believe that all greats were mad once)
Madness is actually one of the many characteristics of a genius
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DagothGares
DagothGares


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No gods or kings
posted May 29, 2009 12:55 AM

Yes, the periods of the sin are very random, but the important part is that the upward and downward movement both are inevitable.
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DagothGares
DagothGares


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
posted May 29, 2009 01:40 AM

A lot of people are Romantics nowadays. I'll be just going on about Romanticism.

A true romantic is someone who considers life to be very problematic and is very pensive about his life and emotions. Romanticism is very much just emotions, at least, nineteenth century romanticism is. Romanticism has actually become very modern again (neo-romanticism), but it has actually captured the spirit if intellectuality of modernism (nowadays, neo-realism and neo-romanticism is about ideas as much as emotions (okay, more emotions)).

Now, the first thing about Romanticism is the following: Life is a problem and I cannot advance any further and I cannot get help. A romantic person is someone who actually has become estranged of everything (including himself in extreme cases). Mind that around the time of romanticism, Freud and Jung were developping their theories and this is no coincidence. Men became more isolated in mass society and couldn't work together to solve problems or had no one to share their problems. Mental illnesses, like depression and schizophrenia became abound.

Now, there is a statue that is very muc in touch with this idea: the thinker of Rodin:


This 'thinker' sits on a rick. He's isolated and in trouble. he is very pensive and will probably push anyone off the rock who comes disturb his thoughts. This is part of the typically male style of thinking, but it can be illustrative to romantics. You see, once the problem is solved, a normal man will leave his boulder and reimmerse himself into society. A Romantic is incapable of doing that, because he considers life to be very problmatic all the time.

Now, a romantic is usually aware of the bitter irony of life and he represents it through a duality, everything is close but far away. He expresses himself through seemingly conflicting ideas and this sometimes evolves into a combat with yourself (hence why schizophrenia is actually romantic). He finds ways to distance himself from himself by mocking his desires (constant relativating/ comparing himself to worse things as to belittle the problem). A very common style in Romantic poetry is making a perfect sonnet, for xample, but they disrupt their own rhythm by adding an extra word, so they are their own problem. They come near perfection, but just barely don't achieve it.

So we can confirm one basic truth: A romantic can't advance in the material relam. let's create a graph.
X = the material plane
Y= the mental/ emotional plane
x = 0 => the limit of the romantic

This would mae something like this:



Now, a romantic can only go three ways from this point:
This can be illustrated like this:


All three options are very very common and you'll recognize them, ether because a friend has said it or you thought it. You can go:
- Like A: Back to the past, back the happy times, roots, nature. A romantic will always claim everything used to be better, even if it wasn't so, because he has become so detached things will seem better while not being so.
- Like B: Upward to pure idealisms. Because the Romantic can't advance in one way, he'll want to do the impossible. He'll be a full-blown anarchist or extremist. Around the time when Romanticism came to existence, many of nowadays political ideologies came into being as well. This doesn't necesarily extend to plain thoughts. The romantic may true to turn the government socialist or turn the anglicans to catholicism or something.
- Like C: The Romantic has fallen into a pit of self-pity, despair, depression and even suicide. Most Romantics have committed suicide at avery young age.

I think I'm a romantic. While not going as far as suicide, I do face these things when I have my mood swings. one moment i think i'll make everything better, get good grades, bring my family together, reconnect with my friends, while at the others I feel as if no one understands me and I will fall and never get back up.

I do not idealise nature or childhood, though...
Well, I admit they were happier, more innocent times, I also feel I was stupider back then.

Now, does anyone follow when I say that Goth and emo-culture is very Romantic in itself?
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TheDeath
TheDeath


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posted May 29, 2009 01:45 AM
Edited by TheDeath at 01:45, 29 May 2009.

Incredible and insightful post Dagoth

Quote:
Now, does anyone follow when I say that Goth and emo-culture is very Romantic in itself?
Definitely, and that makes me a romantic as well, and also on the lower part of the graph hehe

EDIT: Why did you post this in the VW? It should be moved to OSM or Tavern.
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DagothGares
DagothGares


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No gods or kings
posted May 29, 2009 01:46 AM

I thought this post wouldmake little sense since I write what i study at school, here, when i'm stressed. It's very liberating to write down what i remember and just sit back and keep typing.
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DagothGares
DagothGares


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No gods or kings
posted June 23, 2009 02:10 AM

Memories,
It's best to keep all of them. Things make sense once you have all of them. We do forgetthat as humans we are irrational beings per se and some people view life as the eternal struggle between their irrational nature and their rational desires. Some beings don't, of course, and I can expect no sympathy of them, because they have the eternal strength of logic behind them.

Now, logic and rationality beats us most of the time and that's what makes us human. We accept these things as good usually, you know, crying is quite irrational, just like worrying and insomnia created by panic attacks. Now, the idea is voiced that humans should have the ability to exercise control over themselves. Knowledge should be a tool in their hands, but can we entrust our irrational nature with our memories? Can we allow our mind to twist images of the past. If you haven't experienced something for a long time you forget how things go. If I meet friends I haven't seen for months, the experience is usually quite different than what I expected.

This is a common trait for romanticism to idealise things they haven't really dealt with yet.

Now, even images change over time. Like the image of my father. I haven't seen a picture of him for a long time, but I know that if I see one I will think: "was he that wrinkly?" such are our memories, but our memories shape the way we view reality. Think about it. The more different experiences we gather in our mind, the more... Mature we grow, right? The more experienced we grow we can say the least. Now, I suggest we should be careful when we distinguish memories and knowledge from physical shapes and possesions. Now, the practical man would look at our brain and clearly point out the fact it's very capable of harbouring a great potential to produce and learn.

Now, this has much to do with our irrational nature that doesn't necessarily want to act in a productive way. Our logic and life finds a way to overrides this (romantic) desire to escape society and be no part of it.

Anyway, I want to make a bold statement and say that knowledge and memories can be a physical handicap. Knowledge is something I use to refer to skills and skills are always good, right? And memories are the staple, the vault where we store all our experience, right? That can't be bad, can't it? Well, isn't it possible for our bodies to react in an irrational way to memories? I mean, many people tend to cry and despair when they learn about the loss of a loved one and many people that memory can sting for the rest of our lives. Add to that the twisting that can happen in our brain when we don't know it. Emotions will probably twist the memories according to which one affected you at the time.

Now...

Now, I...
I'm sorry...
I'll just leave off here.
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Totoro
Totoro


Famous Hero
in User
posted June 23, 2009 05:16 PM
Edited by Totoro at 17:22, 23 Jun 2009.

The best cure for depression is direct sunlight and physical stress.

I'm not sure if this has been researched or anything, but from my experiences I think it is impossible for body to be both mentally and physically stressed at the same time; after a hard physical exertion you're simply too tired for mental problems that you had before to bother you. I've experienced this many times.

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mvassilev
mvassilev


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Undefeatable Hero
posted June 23, 2009 06:21 PM

"My mom said she needs her anti-depression medication, or she'd be depressed. But I don't think she needs it. All you need is to stand out in the sun; then you can't be depressed!" - stupid girl I know in RL.

Now, as for memories. For some, knowledge can indeed be a handicap. But for rational people, it isn't.
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted June 23, 2009 06:26 PM
Edited by Elvin at 18:26, 23 Jun 2009.

Logic is overrated -Gothika

Don't be so cold mvass, everyone has some sort of emotional problem whether they admit it or not. Doesn't mean they are irrational, just that they need some time to come to terms with it. You speak like you are a machine or the rest are weak - you may not mean it but that's how it sounds.
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Totoro
Totoro


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in User
posted June 23, 2009 06:47 PM

Rational people? That's way too black & white. Everyone is more or less rational and more or less emotional, at least if they are humans.

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Elvin
Elvin


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Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted June 23, 2009 06:49 PM

Too capitalist to be human -anonymous
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TheDeath
TheDeath


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posted June 23, 2009 06:52 PM

Quote:
Logic is overrated -Gothika
Oh yeah I remember that quote

Quote:
You speak like you are a machine or the rest are weak - you may not mean it but that's how it sounds.
I thought I was the machine around here, and ironically, I agree with your quote
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Galev
Galev


Famous Hero
Galiv :D
posted June 23, 2009 07:02 PM

I am going to be super compact and try to avoid wordiness, hope you see my effort.

I also hope you will forgive me not reading all the entries as you asked for quick answers. I will read through I promise. Tell is I touched already discussed topics.

In the book "Screwtape letters" by C.S.Lewis it is written then the life on men is appr. like how you described it: ups and downs. Also in the book the writer indirectly warns the reader to be aware this. (indirectly, since the whole book is indirect) So one should not think: I was happy and so I should be happy now as well, otherwise I screw up sg. OR I am sad now, so this is the way it is, my happiness was just an illusion, I should not strive for it. You should accept that one time you are up, the other you are down. And I think it shows some wisdom that you figured it out more or less on your own.

I know this well. Very well. Much more than I would like to know it. I was through so many downhill periods... To illustrate: I was down about 1,5 weeks ago, then appr. OK for a few days and I feel I'm starting to slip down again. I think it is not normal, but that's my problem.

What I think this function (fx=sinX) can be transformed, and should be. In order to make downhills and ditches less frequent and uphills more "persistent" with plateaus. Something like this:
  _______       _______   __
 /       \     /       \_/
/         \   /
/           \_/

I agree with that view about relationships. Though it is very hard to face flaws in yourself and in your partner, and face the conflicts in order to find solutions, it is inevitable for a developing and viable, happy relationship, IMO.
From Dr.House:
"I still love my wife as I did when we married."
"You should love her more."

And don't be mad. And don't give up. Keep asking yourself questions, because I think you are asking good questions. Asking the right question is always the first step.

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mvassilev
mvassilev


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posted June 23, 2009 07:08 PM
Edited by mvassilev at 19:09, 23 Jun 2009.

If I am a machine, then so be it. At least I am happy more often than I am unhappy.
And I assure you I have no emotional problems.
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TheDeath
TheDeath


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with serious business
posted June 23, 2009 07:11 PM
Edited by TheDeath at 19:12, 23 Jun 2009.

Quote:
"You should love her more."
He's asking for too much. It's already good that he doesn't love her less

Quote:
And I assure you I have no emotional problems.
You must be a machine with flawed logic then. How can you have problems with something you don't even have?
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