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| Thread: I am really sorry |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Lexxan
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Unimpressed by your logic
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posted May 24, 2009 10:56 PM |
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Yes.
It ought not to have happened in the first place.
However, some big trouble about the destruction of one single book shows a big gap in one's wisdom.
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Coincidence? I think not!!!!
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted May 24, 2009 10:59 PM |
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What some people are arguing, is that it doesn't matter the book is considered great and register with the very spirits of millions of people.
So what your saying, is that a forest full of we'll say a billion trees, there is no difference in killing the one single tree that millions of people cherish for spiritual reasons, than killing any other of the million trees.
Your saying that things dont matter like peoples feelings and perceptions.
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What are you up to
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 25, 2009 12:05 AM |
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blizzardboy:
Quote:
But since it's internationally accepted to have great value, it therefore has great value.
The same could be said for any object.
Celfious:
Quote:
So what your saying, is that a forest full of we'll say a billion trees, there is no difference in killing the one single tree that millions of people cherish for spiritual reasons, than killing any other of the million trees.
No, what I'm saying is that while that tree may be cherished by millions, it is only owned by one person, so it's only an act against one person - same as if he were the only person to cherish the tree.
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Eccentric Opinion
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TheDeath
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
with serious business
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posted May 25, 2009 02:07 AM |
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Quote:
But there is more than one Koran in the world. 
I was talking about the fact that a "value" to some object (in my example, a hard disk) is subjective, and you absolutely can't decide for someone else's object.
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The above post is subject to SIRIOUSness.
No jokes were harmed during the making of this signature.
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted May 25, 2009 02:16 AM |
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Edited by Celfious at 05:34, 25 May 2009.
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Ok so its just as cool to burn national flags and do horrible things to for example crucifixes.
Its just as cool to do it to those things as any other object or thread material because they mean nothing more than some random object..
Ok, I am gonna pee on the first dog and we'll see if I get treated as if I peed on some stray... Jk I wouldnt pee on a dog.. geeze
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What are you up to
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 25, 2009 06:05 AM |
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted May 25, 2009 06:42 AM |
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Quote:
Gold is just a yellowish metal. It's soft too, so for purposes of utility, it has limited use. But since it's internationally accepted to have great value, it therefore has great value. Likewise, regardless of what you personally think, if 1.2 billion people deem a book to be important, then it obviously carries greater potential consequences if an officer destroys a Qu'ran as opposed to destroying a photo album.
Gold is not "just a yellowish metal". Gold is valuable because it's rare and has unique physical properties. The oxidation potential of gold is such that it is (essentially) impervious to chemical oxidation by molecular oxygen, a property which is shared by platinum and, to a lesser extent, silver. Is it any wonder these are also the most precious metals? This property makes them both aesthetically useful (jewelry, etc.) and in currency, where oxidation would be problematic.
A Koran has no physical value. Physically, it's dried wood pulp with some ink printed on it, bound maybe with a bit of dead animal skin, just like about every other book on the planet. Physically, it has nothing to distinguish it from a Danielle Steele novel. Thus the analogy to gold - which does have distinguishing physical characteristics - is invalid.
The value of a Koran is psychological. However, psychological value is much harder to quantify and is much more likely to vary from person to person than is the value of gold. Moreover, the Koran has no value to me, and if a police officer gave me the choice of destroying a Koran or one of my photo albums, I wouldn't hesitate to tell him to burn the Koran. Why? The album has value to me.
So, what is worse, burning a photo album or burning a Koran? Well, it depends on who you ask. But the fact that 1.2 billion people would be offended by the burning of the Koran and only 1 would be offended by the burning of my photo album certainly doesn't mean that the Koran is ***MORE VALUABLE*** in any absolute etched-in-marble sort of way.
Well, there's a few snapshots into my feelings about the philosophy of value.
Anyway, I think destroying ANY book is bad. But I also believe people invest way too much importance in the symbolism of physical things, and getting violent because someone in a country half a world away destroys a book you feel is important/symbolic/meaningful is as much a pointless waste of energy as it is ridiculous and without real purpose. Whether you believe in God/Allah or not, a given copy of the Bible/Koran/Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone is just an object, and its significance/symbolism/meaning/VALUE will still be there long after it is destroyed.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted May 25, 2009 07:05 AM |
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What were the protests about in the first place?
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"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Jiriki9
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Altar Dweller
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posted May 25, 2009 07:29 AM |
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THE protests? which protest?
btw...for the: "You do not need to be sorry!"stuff. That's right, you do not!
But I know one can feel rather ashamed for the deeds of their nation!
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted May 25, 2009 07:38 AM |
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Ok those who say it should be treated no differently than if the police guy had destroyed a 10 page childrens picture book, or a novel of Koontz.
I have a question for you.. It's not gonna mean much except it will ease my curiosity.
Do you see a difference between burning a nations flag or a bed sheet when they both cost the same?
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What are you up to
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DagothGares
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
No gods or kings
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posted May 25, 2009 07:38 AM |
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Quote:
THE protests? which protest?
btw...for the: "You do not need to be sorry!"stuff. That's right, you do not!
But I know one can feel rather ashamed for the deeds of their nation!
BELGIUM HAS NO COLONIALIST PAST!
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If you have any more questions, go to Dagoth Cares.
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Rarensu
Known Hero
Formerly known as RTI
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posted May 25, 2009 11:25 AM |
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Quote:
But really, it's time for the Muslims of Europe to assimilate.
It isn't going to happen. Average time for immigrants to America to assimilate is a little over 2 generations (about 40 years for European Muslims). However, in 40 years, most of Europe is more than half Muslim anyways. They'll just be assimilating into themselves! It's the natural Europeans who will be assimilated, if they don't move to Canada first. The numbers are very clear. 85% of Europe's population growth is Muslim. All they have to do is wait.
This is actually a much more serious problem than people today are willing to believe, because of the "we're all the same under the skin" policy. However, about ten years from now, whites around the world are going to wake up to the fact that when you give Muslims a favor, they repay you by destroying your civilization. When I start writing my book (a future history / speculative fiction), this will be a major part of it.
Democracy (20th Century) - A warm fuzzy feeling that happens when the American people vote as one.
Democracy (21st Century) - The most ignorant lowlife scum that breeds the fastest takes over.
Quote:
Do you see a difference between burning a nations flag or a bed sheet when they both cost the same?
Intent matters. If your intent was to warm yourself up, then I don't care. If your intent was to send a message, then I recognize the message.
Burned sheet (intent to heat) = -$15
Burned sheet (intent to confuse) = -$15 + confusing message
Burned flag (intent to heat) = -$15
Burned flag (intent to alarm) = -$15 + alarming message
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Sincerely,
A Proponent of Spelling, Grammar, Punctuation, and Courtesy.
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mvassilev
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Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 25, 2009 04:37 PM |
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Celfious:
Quote:
Do you see a difference between burning a nations flag or a bed sheet when they both cost the same?
Emotionally, yes, because the flag is the symbol of a nation. Legally, there should not be any difference.
Rarensu:
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Average time for immigrants to America to assimilate is a little over 2 generations
I don't know about that. It's not uncommon for first-generation immigrants to mostly assimilate.
Quote:
However, in 40 years, most of Europe is more than half Muslim anyways. They'll just be assimilating into themselves!
Not if European nations take some very drastic measures: eliminate immigration of the poor, severely cut down on welfare and unemployment, and be much less tolerant towards the protesters.
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Eccentric Opinion
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Darkshadow
Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
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posted May 25, 2009 04:59 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
THE protests? which protest?
btw...for the: "You do not need to be sorry!"stuff. That's right, you do not!
But I know one can feel rather ashamed for the deeds of their nation!
BELGIUM HAS NO COLONIALIST PAST!
"Leopoldville" 
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted May 25, 2009 05:24 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
However, in 40 years, most of Europe is more than half Muslim anyways. They'll just be assimilating into themselves!
Not if European nations take some very drastic measures: eliminate immigration of the poor, severely cut down on welfare and unemployment, and be much less tolerant towards the protesters.
So it's either
or
I'm not sure I like either.
Canada suddenly seems unbelievably cool to live in.
____________
"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Darkshadow
Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
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posted May 25, 2009 05:29 PM |
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This, cause in the end the government falls cause of some masked vierdo
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted May 25, 2009 05:29 PM |
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Canada likewise has a rapidly breeding Muslim population + a native population that doesn't reproduce. It's not quite as far along as a lot of Europe, but it's getting there.
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Darkshadow
Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
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posted May 25, 2009 05:40 PM |
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I have found the perfect place for you to stay!
No muslims either
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mvassilev
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 25, 2009 05:57 PM |
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There's nothing wrong with Muslims. There is something wrong with immigrants who come to a country, don't work and just leech off welfare, try to establish special privileges for themselves (in the name of religious tolerance), and have a bunch of children with the same beliefs.
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Eccentric Opinion
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted May 25, 2009 06:00 PM |
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Quote:
I have found the perfect place for you to stay!
Russia?
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