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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: LGBT Community
Thread: LGBT Community This thread is 33 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 10 20 ... 29 30 31 32 33 · «PREV / NEXT»
Tsar-Ivor
Tsar-Ivor


Legendary Hero
Thunderlord of Nighon
posted August 04, 2012 07:50 PM
Edited by Tsar-Ivor at 20:19, 04 Aug 2012.

I don't mind the parades, but it certainly doesn't deter my personal prejudices, it only enhances them, I mean how I'm I to conclude that homosexuals are just like anyone else, when there's a group of dudes in pink panties walking down the road. Which is just another contradiction to add to the list.

All my life I've been under the illusion that a homosexual individual is just a person with a different bedroom preference, this has been reinforced with films and shows. And now I'm confronted (well a few years ago when I still went to school piecing the facts together now) that homosexuals have nothing in common with heteros, (male) even down to speech and body movements, I thought that this must've been a unique homosexual who simple adheres to the prejudices. Then came my collage years, and I identified homosexuals by their very distinct 'prejudice' behavior.
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Seraphim
Seraphim


Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
posted August 04, 2012 08:09 PM

Quote:

Exactly, and why do you think that there aren't any half-nude males skipping about on these events?


Hmm. Half nude males would make the products look bad...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=fvwp&v=F1z2aTcumlY&NR=1

Quote:

Because the target group are straight males.



Hmm, see my point above. Also, I dont think its discriminatory if somebody bases their products on a particular gender.

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Adrius
Adrius


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
posted August 04, 2012 08:18 PM

It'd make the product look bad to straight peeps like me yes, which is why they use females instead.

I was merely pointing out that conventions like E3 and the like, while not advertised as a "straight convention", is in effect that anyway because it caters to the majority of gamers who are indeed: straight males.

And no it's not discriminatory at all to have a specific sexuality as your target group, that's why Gaymercon is ok in the first place.
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Tsar-Ivor
Tsar-Ivor


Legendary Hero
Thunderlord of Nighon
posted August 04, 2012 08:24 PM
Edited by Tsar-Ivor at 20:26, 04 Aug 2012.

So wait, the conclusion that I drew from our talk about school showers is that homosexual males/females should be treated the same as hetero males/females. So sexuality doesn't matter at all at that level, but it does when it comes to video game conventions? So homosexuals feel 'uncomfortable' in the hetero shower so the solution is to construct a homosexual exclusive shower?
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Adrius
Adrius


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
posted August 04, 2012 08:26 PM
Edited by Adrius at 20:27, 04 Aug 2012.

Eh, I don't think I was in that talk.

Note that I'm not saying that anyone is discriminated or treated unfairly at all, I just think that if gay gamers want a convention: why the hell not?

Just let them, it's not hurting anyone. Uh you know, besides bursting the veins of some homophobes here and there.
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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 04, 2012 08:33 PM

of course, if you have a "gaymercon" straight people should be allowed to come if they want to

but I don't think they want to
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Over himself, over his own
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mind, the individual is
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Elodin
Elodin


Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
posted August 04, 2012 09:34 PM

I wonder how many people in this discussion condemned the Boy Scouts for being a straight organization? Shall I look to see who said what?
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Elodin
Elodin


Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
posted August 04, 2012 09:38 PM
Edited by Elodin at 21:41, 04 Aug 2012.

Oh, I'm sure everyone heard recently about the owner of the Chick-fil-A restaurants saying he believed the Biblical value of traditional marriage. All kinds of gay activists launched all kinds of protests and gay activists in positions of political power have tried to ban the restaurants from some cities.

Clicky

Quote:

"We are bewildered by those who would take offense at your values and would block the expansion of your business into their communities," it states. "We welcome Chick-fil-A's investment in our districts."

Nunnelee said he was moved to pen the letter after what he called a "vicious smear campaign" against the restaurant.

“The criticism they have received has been appalling," Nunnelee said. "Elected officials that are now threatening to block new Chick-fil-A restaurants in their cities are acting in a manner that is un-American. Demanding ideological conformity in order to be allowed to run your business is a dangerous precedent. It is like something that would happen in Soviet Russia."

After Cathy told the Baptist Press he supported the "biblical" definition of marriage, same-sex marriage advocates called for boycotts of the restaurant. In Chicago, an alderman vowed to keep the restaurant from opening a second restaurant in his district and Mayor Rahm Emanual announced that "Chick-fil-A's values are not Chicago's values." Boston Mayor Thomas Menino said the restaurant would not be welcome there, but he later acknowledged it is not his right to stop Cathy from doing business there.

New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg, who supports same-sex marriage, said its nobody's business what a company exec thinks, but City Council Speaker Christine Quinn, who is openly gay and has mayoral aspirations, urged New York University not to renew a contract with Chick-fil-A.


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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 04, 2012 09:39 PM

I got the impression from VF that homosexual boys weren't allowed into the Boy Scouts.
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Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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gnomes2169
gnomes2169


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Duke of the Glade
posted August 05, 2012 12:41 PM

Quote:
I got the impression from VF that homosexual boys weren't allowed into the Boy Scouts.

Our council decided to table that movement in our section of
Minnesota, but yes this is a rule now.

And I honestly cannot understand why. As a bisexual scout myself, I can say that it seems to be like discriminating against another genetic and controversial trait known as skin color. Which doesn't exist in any of the national chapters, if I'm not mistaken. In other words, it feels like I am being barred from a set of activities because I like the color green just as much or more than I like the color red, completely and absolutely pointless, retarded and just all around hateful for something that I can't help.

Oh, and Chick-fil-A can suck it up. If they was to influence politics, then they get the good and the bad. Being a business in no way shape or form gives them immunity to repercussions for taking a stance on this issue. Also, they are a fast-food chain... so they aren't exactly the most qualified people to make social decisions. Do we want companies like Mc. Donalds making our domestic policy? No! We want experienced and specialized individuals to think through the problems of our generation logically, and come to the best decision for the majority based on what they decide. I do not want fries to come with that, thank you very little.
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Tsar-Ivor
Tsar-Ivor


Legendary Hero
Thunderlord of Nighon
posted August 05, 2012 01:28 PM
Edited by Tsar-Ivor at 13:52, 05 Aug 2012.

So your solution is doing unto others, what you don't want done to yourself, that's certainly going to birth interesting results. (you want your rights, but you want to destroy a business owner's basic human rights in the process)

And it's a god-damned fast food restaurant, we already have too many different ones, (quantity wise too) and if you're so mentally handicapped that you want to go to the one place you can't, then simply tough.

Homosexuals should eat anywhere, but the catholic has to scrape the streets for food, since his religious beliefs are being repressed.

Mutually beneficial solution, it seems people have forgotten what that means.

Edit: Also why does it annoy you that these "satanist-bigots" have a sure-place to eat? Surely you should be rejoicing that you can visit every restaurant and get fair treatment, while the haters go to their own little corner. Oh I get it, you want to create the illusion that there are no haters because they can't voice their opinions without a massive backlash. O'wait, are my rights being, repressed?!
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Elodin
Elodin


Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
posted August 05, 2012 05:11 PM
Edited by Elodin at 17:13, 05 Aug 2012.

Quote:

Oh, and Chick-fil-A can suck it up. If they was to influence politics, then they get the good and the bad. Being a business in no way shape or form gives them immunity to repercussions for taking a stance on this issue. Also, they are a fast-food chain... so they aren't exactly the most qualified people to make social decisions. Do we want companies like Mc. Donalds making our domestic policy? No! We want experienced and specialized individuals to think through the problems of our generation logically, and come to the best decision for the majority based on what they decide. I do not want fries to come with that, thank you very little.


The owner of Chick-fil-A was asked in an interview about marriage. Being a Christian he said he believes in the Biblical definition of marriage, being between a man and a woman. He is being oppressed, harassed, and  attacked by gay activists simply for being a Christian. Gay activists can be such bigots, demanding that all people should think and say only things the gay activists want them to say. No tolerance of the thoughts and beliefs of others at all. The Chick-Fil-A owner was not on a crusade but there are certainly gay activists on a crusade against him.


The Boy Scouts is a private club. The Scout oath is:

Quote:

On my honor I will do my best
To do my duty to God and my country
and to obey the Scout Law;
To help other people at all times;
To keep myself physically strong,
mentally awake, and morally straight.



The scouts have always been a theist organization. It espouses Christian values. Anyone who does not agree with those values but who takes the Scout oath anyways is lying when he takes the oath.

Clicky

Quote:

Spirituality has been an integral part of the international Scouting movement since its inception. As early as 1908, Scouting founder Robert Baden-Powell wrote in the first Scout handbook that, "No man is much good unless he believes in God and obeys His laws."[5]

Religious organizations host/sponsor over 60% of the approximately 123,000 Scouting units in the United States and use the Scouting program as part of their youth ministration.[6][7] Officials from various religious organizations—including the The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormon), Catholic, Methodist, Lutheran, and Presbyterian churches—are included on the BSA National Executive Board, its Advisory Council, and the BSA Religious Relationships Committee.

In reciting the Scout Oath, Scouts promise to be morally straight and to do their duty to God; the Scout Law holds that a Scout is clean and reverent. As early as 1978, the Boy Scouts of America circulated a memorandum among national executive staff stating that they held it was not appropriate for homosexuals to hold leadership positions in BSA.[8] Similarly, since at least 1985, the BSA has interpreted the Scout Oath and Law as being incompatible with agnosticism and atheism.[9] In both instances, the organization asserted that it was not a new policy to oppose and disfavor atheism, agnosticism and homosexuality; and, in support of that, to deny membership to atheists and agnostics, and to deny leadership roles to and occasionally expel "avowed" homosexual persons  — rather, the BSA argued it was just enforcing long-held policies which had never been published or publicly challenged.[8][10]



No, exclusion of a person from the Scouts because they don't share the morals of the Scouts is not the same as excluding a person because he is black or white or green.

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 05, 2012 06:32 PM
Edited by xerox at 19:20, 05 Aug 2012.

I agree with that gay activists can be crazy bigots too.
But are you saying that you can't believe in God and be gay at the same time now O.o  

Because that's how they reason down in rural Afghanistan.
And they even have those dancing boys there.
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Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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gnomes2169
gnomes2169


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Duke of the Glade
posted August 05, 2012 06:59 PM

Silly Elodin, it is not a moral decision. Would you ban a boy from scouts if they had asthma or bad vision? Both of them are genetic as well. And I'm not talking about life-threatening asthma or near-blindness, I'm saying if you have any amount of asthma are less than 20/20 vision you are banned. Does that make any sense?

Yup scouting is an exclusive club (That lets in all kids of all backgrounds and (in Minnesota at least) gender), and they are under no obligation to make reasonable rules, but as a club that stresses being the pinnacle of moral standing they should honestly try to be an example of fairness.

And yes, Elodin, I know the scout Oath, Law and Promise (no one cares about the motto...), and nowhere in them is the statement that "I shall like women." Of course all of these arguments are wasted on you, so I'll leave you to your opinions and keep my own, alright?

Hey Tsar, who was that to?
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Corribus
Corribus

Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
posted August 05, 2012 07:35 PM
Edited by Corribus at 19:53, 27 Apr 2013.

@Gnomes
Quote:
Silly Elodin, it is not a moral decision. Would you ban a boy from scouts if they had asthma or bad vision? Both of them are genetic as well.

You're on shaky ground scientifically, because I know of no definitive studies linking homosexuality to genetics, and even if there were such studies it wouldn't mean much.  A guy could just as easily choose to engage in homosexual behavior regardless of his genetics.  And then your argument is moot.

You're also on shaky ground practically because the boy scouts do continue to discriminate on genetics.  No human with two x chromosomes has ever been a member.

In any case the whole "nature versus nurture" argument has always been a red herring.  As far as rights go, it shouldn't make much of a difference, and when you start comparing homosexuality to physical diseases or handicaps, you start down the slope toward calling homosexuality an illness, defect or disease.  And look at all the fun places you can go from there...
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg

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mvassilev
mvassilev


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
HC SUPPORTER
posted August 05, 2012 07:41 PM

Quote:
I know of no definitive studies linking homosexuality to genetics
Here's one.
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Eccentric Opinion

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 05, 2012 07:48 PM

I know this is not scientific, but I think a vast majority of all homo- and bisexual people can confirm that they didn't choose their sexuality.

I would personally love to be a hetero- or bisezual so I could have a girlfriend but that would force me to live in a lie.
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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Corribus
Corribus

Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
posted August 05, 2012 07:53 PM

Quote:
I know this is not scientific, but I think a vast majority of all homo- and bisexual people can confirm that they didn't choose their sexuality.

Just because a trait isn't genetic, doesn't mean it was necessarily acquired through a conscious choice.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 05, 2012 07:59 PM
Edited by xerox at 20:15, 05 Aug 2012.

But there wasn't a point in my life where I said: "Oh, I'm a homosexual now". Homosexuality being a conscious choice implies that we are all born hetereosexuxal. I'm not sure we are. I mean I had several girlfriends when I was between four and six years old. Since hetereosexuality is the norm, people always asumed that I was straight. But today I can't say that I ever felt in love or attracted to those girls. It was more like a game. It wasn't untill puberty that I started becoming aware of my sexuality. I'm not sure if there is science that supports it, but I think sexuality really only starts to surface when puberty is about to hit. What I mean is, that we are born with a specific sexuality but it only starts to surface when puberty hits. Before that, it is social norms that "dictate" what sexuality we "should" belong to.
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Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
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- John Stuart Mill

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 05, 2012 11:30 PM

All of that isn't the point, though, is it?

The question is, should people be able to bar others from business transactions with them, due to some trait. Gay, Texan, female, smaller than 6 feet, blonde, good-looking...

And if you own a disco and you can people bar entrance because you personally think they don't look good enough - what's wrong with saying, NO GAYS? Or NO CRIPPLES? Or NO MEN? Or NO TEXANS?

Can you say - as an Exec - you don't like gays? Heck, why not? Can gays say, they don't like that fast food dive? Sure Can they arrange a boycott? Sure, but the exec already said, he can live without gay customers.

Politics should not be involved in this.

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