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| Thread: Used games worse than piracy |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 · «PREV |
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted July 11, 2010 11:09 AM |
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Yup, it's way worse.
1. You have to pay for it. Patches are free, but DLC is at least 5$ and goes up to 15$.
2. It adds marginal content. It may be an armor, weapon, new faction, new XXX or a short quest in a new location which you can complete in 1-2h. Most Dragon Age DLCs were possible to complete in 20-30 mins.
Content to price ratio is so horrible that DLCs are simply a disgrace.
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Shyranis
Promising
Supreme Hero
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posted July 13, 2010 06:56 PM |
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Edited by Shyranis at 18:57, 13 Jul 2010.
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The US Ninth Circuit court seems to be siding with the "can't resell or do what you please with your things" crowd.
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ohforfsake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted July 17, 2010 02:29 PM |
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The main problem, as I see it, is that in stead of selling the product in this industry, people are basically selling the manual to create the product to people who have machines that can create it for them.
It's like, in stead of selling a car, you sell a piece of code, so a machine at your home can spit out a car for you.
If the middle men of the industry, the record companies and stuff, want to survive, they need either to find a way to take advantage of the popularity created by the quality of the art they're trying to sell, in stead of getting X amount of money from each person. Otherwise they need to find a way to only sell the product and not the manual of creating the product (basicly meaning, they'd be creating their own types of computers as well, and selling those, but probably much more complicated than that alone).
Of course people who create something others wants to pay sufficently for should be able to get a living that way, but it's their own responsibility, if they decide to sell their product in a way, where they give away the mean to produce the work, and not solely the result/effect of the work.
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DOSNerd
Tavern Dweller
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posted July 18, 2010 11:02 AM |
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Hmm... there's a lot of businesses that sell used games, or do trade-ins etc. Probably one of the most prominent is EB Games.
So, I don't think selling used games is illegal. That would mean throwing out the game would be illegal, cause, it could end up in the hands of someone else.
As much as game companies would like to impose such a thing (to prevent anyone from buying a used copy and not paying the company directly for the full price), you can't deem selling used games as illegal.
Pirating is a whole new story however. In this scenario, the company doesn't get ANY profit for an original copy. At least when someone sells something used, the company gets money from the initial sale.
I've bought a handful of used games, particularly because I was in situations where they were discontinued (except in rare occasions where obscure retailers on the internet had some old games in stock).
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted July 18, 2010 11:10 AM |
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Well, console games and computer games are a bit different. Now if the game makers make a way that you have to have the disk physically in the computer to play it, and it was un'crackable' then it would be a moot point. Of course, people would complain about that..*shrugs*
The problem with a computer game is, you can 'save' the information on your computer..and pass it on..and still play it. Where as a console game, once you resell it, you can't play it any more.
So consoles have an advantage over computers in that area. Personally I think that computer games SHOULD be the same. Something on the disks that enable people to play ONLY when the disk is present, and unable to be hacked. That way, piracy would be cut way down, or at least MUCH harder to pull off.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted July 18, 2010 11:27 AM |
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That would put us back to the nineties, where people bought tons of pirated CDs off their local market. Well, at least here.
ANY cd-protection is a waste of time and the nerves of legal buyers BECAUSE pirated games used to come with cracks bypassing the stupid cd-check. In those days, it was awesome, because the CDs used to take time to "speed up", they were loud, and the games often froze so that they could load some CD data. No-cd pirated games solved ALL those problems at once.
I don't want to see that stupid **** again in ANY legal game I buy. Please 
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Mytical
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted July 18, 2010 11:34 AM |
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Thus the 'unhackable'/'Uncrackable'. The codes would be good enough, IF there was a way to prevent people from getting around them also.
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del_diablo
Legendary Hero
Manifest
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posted July 18, 2010 06:37 PM |
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Quote:
The problem with a computer game is, you can 'save' the information on your computer..and pass it on..and still play it. Where as a console game, once you resell it, you can't play it any more.
Not paying attention of times anymore are we?
That point became moot around the PS2/GC/Xbox days...
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dosnerd
Tavern Dweller
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posted July 18, 2010 09:58 PM |
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Quote:
Well, console games and computer games are a bit different. Now if the game makers make a way that you have to have the disk physically in the computer to play it, and it was un'crackable' then it would be a moot point. Of course, people would complain about that..*shrugs*
The problem with a computer game is, you can 'save' the information on your computer..and pass it on..and still play it. Where as a console game, once you resell it, you can't play it any more.
So consoles have an advantage over computers in that area. Personally I think that computer games SHOULD be the same. Something on the disks that enable people to play ONLY when the disk is present, and unable to be hacked. That way, piracy would be cut way down, or at least MUCH harder to pull off.
All of the games I get are computer games (And it's perfectly legal to sell them).
Just because information is saved on the hard disk instead of a memory card doesn't change anything. I can pop a Wii disc or a playstation disc in my computer drive and create an ISO image of it, just as I would of a normal computer game.
With that said, if you take most computer games and stuff the whole directory on a CD, often or not it won't work. So just because files are saved on the HDD, doesn't necessarily mean you can pirate anything. You have to make an entire ISO image of a game.
And it's actually a GOOD thing you can backup your games. A lot of my CDs are discontinued and practically impossible to get, so if any of them get damaged, I wouldn't be able to obtain another copy.
It's really impossible to make computers closed like a console, since they actually MAKE console games on computers.
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 19, 2010 01:03 AM |
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lol, good luck preventing piracy that way. trying to prevent it = encouraging it. if there is no constraints, no one can try to bypass what doesn't exist.
Quote:
The main problem, as I see it, is that in stead of selling the product in this industry, people are basically selling the manual to create the product to people who have machines that can create it for them.
It's like, in stead of selling a car, you sell a piece of code, so a machine at your home can spit out a car for you.
lol, that kind of information is the last thing they would sell. they don't want people to be able to do their stuffs themselves, because then, they become useless. otherwise, you would have access to all the resources of every game, and would even be provided with the right tools to modify them. but developpers have no interests in you buying one game and then spending 10 years playing on it, because you can do whatever pleases you with it. much more profitable for them if you have to buy a new game each time you want a new experience.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted July 19, 2010 10:53 AM |
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Well, that's rather obvious. If you knew how to make a car in your garage, car-making companies would also be useless. 
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Vangelis21
Supreme Hero
Manchild
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posted July 19, 2010 11:16 AM |
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well here is my opinion:
I am not an expert, i have never worked in a job that has to do with software etc.
When I buy a DVD/CD etc it becomes mine. The same way that a table or somehting else becomes mine. So the same way that i am allowed to invite others to sit on my chairs and table, the same way i can lend my furniture to someone else etc etc i should be able to lend, sell or even loan my things (DVDs) to others. I don't accept the fact that they ask us not to reproduce etc etc.
And be careful, i am not talking about piratic reproducing. I am totally against selling or buying a copied version of a game when some people have worked hard to create it in the first place. BUT in the same way I have worked hard (and in some ways harder) and when i buy a piece of software it should be MINE to do WHATEVER I want with it.
IF now we consider that accept all those things etc my bottom line opinion on the subject is that piracy is WORSE than used games
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ohforfsake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted July 21, 2010 08:03 PM |
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To be clear.
My point was, in stead of selling a "car", the computer/music companies sells the manuscript for that exact "car" to someone they know have the means to produce such a thing, if they've the right manuscript.
They should certainly be rewarded for their good and hard work, but it's their own fault, when they give away all their ressources and then try to hide behind the law, an artifical construction only giving them that extra power, because it happens to be so that those with most power supports them.
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vahleeb
Hired Hero
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posted July 27, 2010 05:28 PM |
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Edited by vahleeb at 17:29, 27 Jul 2010.
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I believe we have to make a difference here. When you buy a game the truth is that you don't really buy the game, instead you buy the right to use the fruits of someone's creative effort. It's not just a DVD with content that can be sold to your brother, it's a contract to use the game. There's that thing that pops up when you install the game called EULA (END User License Agreement) which clearly states what your rights are pertaining to this game, and from the name you can easily deduce that re-selling it is not among them.
Unfortunately for gamers, they(the gaming companies) are within their rights this time and it's only a matter of enforcing their legal claim. The only way to force change would be a Utopian blockade of games purchases from the end users, until companies cave in and remove this end user licensing system. Unfortunately the chances of this working are below zero. This has always been the kind of problem brought about by capitalism, where the need for something(in this case the game) will always outweigh over time the determination for holding out and will result in the real power being with the creators of need rather than with the many.
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Moonlith
Bad-mannered
Supreme Hero
If all else fails, use Fiyah!
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posted July 27, 2010 05:31 PM |
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I seem to be on a roll today when it comes to posting cartoons.
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