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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Should I buy a gun?
Thread: Should I buy a gun? This thread is 11 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT»
JoonasTo
JoonasTo


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted September 18, 2010 01:49 AM

If you've got a house with big rooms shotgun might work, the only bad side is that a shotgun needs to be rather heavy to absorb the recoil from big shots that you'd be using, like a wolf shot or something similar. You can use a lighter shotgun but then you can kiss the feeling from your arm goodbye. Police and army tend to use light shotguns because they are easier to maneuver but they have padding against their shoulder. So if you take a light shotgun at least get some paddings to the shooting range, a sponge works quite well.
Shotguns won't pierce walls either. Shotguns are range from 100$ to 1000$ or even more depending on the kind and quality. You'd be wanting a self loading one, maybe 300-400$? Plus ammo depending on how much you shoot obviously
One thing that might be worth considering is if they sell rubber shots anywhere.

If you want an optimal weapon for defense that would be submachine gun. Small, handy and ridiculous amount of firepower at a close range. Will ruin your house completely. Won't pierce walls.

I find anything above 9mm semi-auto pistol overkill. 9mm is good because they are cheap and the ammunition is cheap. They also do not ruin your house too much if you miss and won't pierce walls.


I am not entirely sure but I believe USA had pretty strong home-defense laws. If someone walks in to your house uninvited you can shoot him. Better ask OD but that's what I recall.


I do not (currently) own a gun due to living in a city where I have no use for it obviously, no hunting areas nearby. I did consider getting a handgun for a hobby but it's way too expensive here. Clubs take ridiculous fares. Cheapest solution would have been the army reserve club, they've got decent prices and it includes shooting once a week. But time, money and practicality said no.
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blizzardboy
blizzardboy


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Legendary Hero
No. You're awesome.
posted September 18, 2010 01:54 AM
Edited by blizzardboy at 01:56, 18 Sep 2010.



Finland has a city??


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Fauch
Fauch


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Undefeatable Hero
posted September 18, 2010 02:31 AM

they say : a kind word and a gun do more than a kind word alone

I wonder how hard it is to pacify a burglar, I read a story of someone attacking a church with a gun, and the priest convinced him to abandon the idea.

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friendofgunnar
friendofgunnar


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able to speed up time
posted September 18, 2010 04:50 AM

@Corribus

If you have children and a gun, the kids *will* eventually find it and its also highly likely that they *will* play with it. This might involve one or all of the following: taking it to school, pointing it at other kids, pulling the trigger, trying to take it apart, trying to figure out how it works, trying to take out the bullets, etc... IMO The tiny chances of using it against an armed intruder would be outweighed by the massive anxieties that come from mixing guns and curious bored kids.

I remember reading somewhere that kids are 43 times more likely to die of gunshot if there's a gun in the house, a number which I find highly plausible.

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Darkshadow
Darkshadow


Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
posted September 18, 2010 08:33 AM

Quote:
I wonder how hard it is to pacify a burglar


A lot easier if you are pointing a 12 gauge shotgun to their head.

Quote:

I do not (currently) own a gun due to living in a city where I have no use for it obviously, no hunting areas nearby. I did consider getting a handgun for a hobby but it's way too expensive here. Clubs take ridiculous fares. Cheapest solution would have been the army reserve club, they've got decent prices and it includes shooting once a week. But time, money and practicality said no.


psst, hey, want to buy this nice looking beretta?


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Binabik
Binabik


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posted September 18, 2010 09:52 AM

Joonas, my problem with a full-length shotgun is the size as well as the weight. How would you use it? Would you try to sneak up quietly on a burglar? I'm not sure if I'd want to try carrying a full-length shotgun through doorways, around corners, or down hallways in the dark without bumping into things and making a racket. A sawed off shotgun is a lot better for handling indoors, but they are illegal.

As for penetration of 9mm, yes they will go through walls. Or do you guys have really thick walls there? I tested them myself when I was building houses. I compared a 45cal to a 9mm. The 45 would not penetrate a 4x4 block of wood (approx 9x9cm). I don't know how deep it penetrated, but I guessed about 2/3 of the way. The 9mm blew right through it and still had enough energy to make a decent sized hole in the dirt and debris behind it. Both were full jacketed bullets.

For laws, they are different everywhere in the US. Every state and most cities have their own laws. It wouldn't surprise me if Connecticut is pretty restrictive. In general the law leans heavily in favor of the homeowner. The wording of the law and the actual practice may not be the same. Basically if you feel threatened then you can shoot. You can't shoot just because someone is in your house. However in practice, a person in your house can always be considered a threat and the courts tend to give the homeowner the benefit of the doubt.

The thing to do is ask around locally. Ask the cops on the beat. Contact the NRA who can not only answer the legal questions but also give info on certified training instructors, safety mechanisms to protect children, etc. You can also ask around at local shooting ranges, gun shops or maybe sporting goods stores.

@FOG, I tend to agree when there is a child around, it changes the whole equation. However I'm working under the assumption that Corribus knows he has a kid. I'm also assuming that he's not one of those idiots who leaves a loaded gun laying around where it's accessible by kids. I don't know anything about the safety mechanisms like trigger locks, so I can't address that.

@William, you are still working with wrong assumptions. You've expressed views several times like you picture a place with shootouts and bullets flying everywhere. That's just not the case. I've already mentioned the demographics where the VAST majority of murders take place. If you live in the other 99.9% of the US the odds of getting murdered are virtually zero. The odds of even running into a criminal with a gun are near zero. The vast majority of Americans will probably live their entire life without ever being in a situation where a gun is used in some kind of crime. They are highly unlikely to even see such a thing.

I'm sure burglars here are the same as burglars in Australia. They are going to pick the easy target. They will pick the unoccupied house over the occupied house. The will pick the house in the dark over the house that's lit up. They will pick the house without a security system. They will NOT pick a house if they think the owner might have a gun. They just wouldn't do it. Nobody, whether they are a criminal, a homeowner, a cop or anyone else will intentionally walk into a situation where they think shots might be fired. A burglar will simply move on and find a better target.

Burglary is a relatively minor crime. A burglar is probably not going to be a hardened criminal. They just want to break into a house that's an easy target, steal some things and get out without getting caught. If they get caught it will probably mean a few months in a local county jail. If they get caught and they have a gun it will suddenly elevate to a much more serious felony with prison time. For a basic burglary the cops might get around to reading the report for a couple minutes. If shots are fired and the burglar manages to get away the entire police department will be after them. They have changed from a fairly minor criminal to being totally screwed for the rest of their life. The average burglar is just not in that kind of category of hardened criminals.

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Mytical
Mytical


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Undefeatable Hero
Chaos seeking Harmony
posted September 18, 2010 10:12 AM
Edited by Mytical at 10:24, 18 Sep 2010.

Even if they are that much of a 'hardened criminal' Binabik it doesn't really change anything.  See, criminals by definition don't tend to play by 'the rules'.  If every law abiding citizen pitched their guns into the incinerator, companies stopped making guns, and even the police decided to go unarmed..it wouldn't change a thing.  If a criminal wants a gun, they will get one.  No 'laws' will stop this.  They will find a way.  You think if they break in they are going to care if you have a bat instead of a gun?

See they break in expecting people to be gone.  As Bin said..look for the easy mark.  When people startle them, and confront them, bad things happen.  I can't count the times I've seen "Little ol grandma" or "Older Gentleman" dead because they interrupted a burglar.  Yes, and the ones that are reported dead didn't have a weapon.  Surprise, surprise.

Criminals don't CARE about playing by your rules.  They have their own rules.

Edit : Now mind you, somebody breaking into a place is more likely then not to flee regardless.  However, the chances of them running I guarantee you increase if you have a gun.  I do not, and will not have a gun personally.  Those that do however, have every right to have one to protect themselves and their family.

I don't have any children to worry about, and I don't worry about myself.  If I had children, however, I would do whatever it took to protect them.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


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Retired Hero
posted September 18, 2010 10:59 AM

I'm not exactly well informed about how do those robberies look, but things to consider:

1. If they are sneaking into people's homes, you better install a good alarm system. What's the use of a gun if you're caught sleeping...
2. If they came busting through the front door when you're awake and aware and don't seem to care, it's better to have something, yeah. However if they have guns and you have just one, it will do nothing anyway unless you're a terminator.


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baklava
baklava


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Mostly harmless
posted September 18, 2010 11:57 AM

Why are sawn-off shotguns illegal?
I remember I always wanted to hang one on the wall since they look so bloody awesome.
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Darkshadow
Darkshadow


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Cerise Princess
posted September 18, 2010 12:03 PM

Quote:
Why are sawn-off shotguns illegal?


Pretty easy to conceal.

Also some of them are rather unsafe.

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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


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Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted September 18, 2010 02:08 PM

Quote:
Joonas, my problem with a full-length shotgun is the size as well as the weight. How would you use it? Would you try to sneak up quietly on a burglar? I'm not sure if I'd want to try carrying a full-length shotgun through doorways, around corners, or down hallways in the dark without bumping into things and making a racket. A sawed off shotgun is a lot better for handling indoors, but they are illegal.

As for penetration of 9mm, yes they will go through walls. Or do you guys have really thick walls there? I tested them myself when I was building houses. I compared a 45cal to a 9mm. The 45 would not penetrate a 4x4 block of wood (approx 9x9cm). I don't know how deep it penetrated, but I guessed about 2/3 of the way. The 9mm blew right through it and still had enough energy to make a decent sized hole in the dirt and debris behind it. Both were full jacketed bullets.


I tried to note the size by talking about if he's got big rooms the shotgun might work.
Sawed-off would be better for the dispersion pattern at close ranges too.

You're right, they will go through a 4x4 when shot from close range. I am used to Finnish housebuilding, it's a cold country so walls are insulated and rather thick. Usually around 20cm.
The used cartridge determines the penetration. You can buy(or make but I doubt Corribus would do that) ones with lower speed. That are still good inside since normal handgun cartridges are made for around 20-25m or so.
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1910
1910


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posted September 18, 2010 03:29 PM

@Bin, I understand. Thanks for the reply.

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The_Gootch
The_Gootch


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Kneel Before Me Sons of HC!!
posted September 18, 2010 04:27 PM
Edited by The_Gootch at 16:28, 18 Sep 2010.

If I was to consider a gun for home defense, it'd have to be a pump action shotgun.

There are few things more fearful sounding than the sound of a shotgun being racked.  And ultimately, I'd rather scare someone off with that threat than to actually have the blood of their life on my hands.
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bixie
bixie


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Legendary Hero
my common sense is tingling!
posted September 18, 2010 07:21 PM

get a crossbow.

it's silent, it's deadly, it looks just as cool as a gun, and almost three times as difficult to commit suicide with.
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Darkshadow
Darkshadow


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Cerise Princess
posted September 18, 2010 07:22 PM

Quote:
get a crossbow.

it's silent, it's deadly, it looks just as cool as a gun, and almost three times as difficult to commit suicide with.


And crappy at close range...

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blizzardboy
blizzardboy


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No. You're awesome.
posted September 18, 2010 07:44 PM

Well I personally prefer the 19-20/x2 crit over the x3.
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Fauch
Fauch


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Undefeatable Hero
posted September 18, 2010 07:46 PM

I suggest a flamethrower.

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Darkshadow
Darkshadow


Legendary Hero
Cerise Princess
posted September 18, 2010 07:53 PM

Quote:
I suggest a flamethrower.


While we are at it, why not a self propelled rocket artillery vehicle?

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Binabik
Binabik


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Legendary Hero
posted September 18, 2010 08:34 PM

Crossbows are illegal in some states. Why would you want something silent anyway? As The Gootch pointed out, just the sound of a pump action shotgun should stop almost any criminal. The same for the cha-chink of a semi-auto chambering a round. Or even the click of the hammer being drawn back on a revolver.

Remember the idea is not to get into some wild west gun fight like on TV. The idea is to stop the crime. When pointing a gun at someone, it's the intimidation factor that stops the crime. I mean if you break into a house and hear a pump action shotgun, you'd immediately freeze on the spot and squeeze your butt cheeks so tight that you don't so much as let out a fart. It's what I said earlier about shotguns, the visual intimidation goes a long way. The sound can have the same effect.

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Salamandre
Salamandre


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posted September 18, 2010 08:38 PM

The best house keeper.

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