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| Thread: Free will vs 'Fate' |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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angelito
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proud father of a princess
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posted December 10, 2010 05:19 PM |
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Quote:
Angelito was a map maker, wasn't he? 
A template maker...not a map maker
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JollyJoker
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Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 10, 2010 07:33 PM |
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I made a couple for Homm3.
I didn't like Homm4
I has no interest anymore for Homm5.
It may change with Homm6 again.
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted December 10, 2010 07:44 PM |
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I made a boatload of maps for H2, and several for H3. For the most part they were very well received and I still do get emails about them.
I didn't make any emails for H4 and H5 because I found the editors to be terrible to work with.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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JollyJoker
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Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 10, 2010 08:26 PM |
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You didn't make any emails for H4 and H5? 
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted December 10, 2010 08:46 PM |
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Quote:
You didn't make any emails for H4 and H5?
Er...um... yeah. 
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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JollyJoker
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posted December 10, 2010 09:19 PM |
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I didn't make any either, strangely enough. I'm inclined to say, that can't be accidental.
Must be fate or something.
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markkur
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Once upon a time
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posted December 11, 2010 01:29 AM |
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Edited by markkur at 11:50, 11 Dec 2010.
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Fauch
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Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 11, 2010 01:48 AM |
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the map editor in H5 seems really aweful indeed. the one in H4 was at least good for creating events from what I remember.
wasn't the best editor the one from shadow of death? unless it was wake of god?
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Mytical
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Chaos seeking Harmony
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posted December 11, 2010 07:21 AM |
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Well, to be honest I don't have a problem with God knowing all the possible outcomes. At all. Imagine a maze with 100 different paths to the middle. Somebody going through the maze might chose any of the path, but regardless they will end up in the middle..eventually.
No my problem is a god that would say "You have free will" and then intrude in any way. Because that is not free will. That is 'fate', and fate and free will can not coexist. So when somebody says "It was God's will" that somebody die or somebody live...that is bunk. God for all intense and purposes should be kicking back playing the Playstation 5 million..drinking a brewsky. He gave humans free will, that should be the end of it.
If there is only one answer, then it is not free will. Either fate or free will, can not be both. You can't have choices when there is only 1 outcome. That is the ILLUSION of free will.
Let me give a real world example.
Two covered dishes. Under each is the same exact thing, but you get to chose which dish. Does it matter which you pick? No. You get the same either way. Since you are not shown the second one, however, you THINK you have free will.
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Message received.
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JollyJoker
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posted December 11, 2010 09:14 AM |
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Yes, I agree.
There is nothing wrong with God knowing all POSSIBLE outcomes - that would fit the all-knowing bill quite well, without determining something.
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DarkLord
Supreme Hero
Fear me..
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posted December 11, 2010 09:57 AM |
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Edited by DarkLord at 09:58, 11 Dec 2010.
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I would say, IMHO, the word "fate" is a good replacement or an excuse
of many circumstances that may happen to you..
Let's say people usually refer to the word fate if something goes wrong or against their will.
inspite of all the plannings it is impossible to predict the final outcome.. So rather than analysing their mistakes and making conclusions, people just say : oh that's fate! just to make things more simple and to find someone or something to blame..in particular "fate"!
That should have been the moment when word "fate" become popular, and was delivered to masses as a perfect explanation of things beyond understanding or things that go against predictions or will.
I personally believe that mostly your life depends on the actions you make.. And of couse circumstances..BUT people have a perfect ability to adopt to different situations ,and then again you pretty much depend on the actions you take..
Let's trust Newton's law: For every action there is a reaction..
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markkur
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Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
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posted December 11, 2010 12:49 PM |
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Quote:
If there is only one answer, then it is not free will. Either fate or free will, can not be both. You can't have choices when there is only 1 outcome. That is the ILLUSION of free will.
Let me give a real world example.
Two covered dishes. Under each is the same exact thing, but you get to chose which dish. Does it matter which you pick? No. You get the same either way. Since you are not shown the second one, however, you THINK you have free will.
Mytical, I think I may see something (yes it's a guess) in all of this concerning how God is 'generally' thought of by most of us and <IMO> that impacts how free-will is considered. To make my case I have to address some problems with the church itself and how it has <IMO> mucked things up and at other times falsely represented the God that is clearly visible by the text. Since you started this thread and also my need to satisfy my position in this debate, it means that I have to sort of dissect church history and show some glaring conflicts that I think are very important when it comes to fate and free-will and how they are perceived. I think I can make a valid argument for a God of love and not the tyrant that has us all penned down. Should I post here or make a seperate thread? Or should I even bother? I won't be offended if you want to move on but I have to say that I think I can make it intersting if nothing else.
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Elodin
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Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted December 11, 2010 01:42 PM |
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Quote:
No my problem is a god that would say "You have free will" and then intrude in any way. Because that is not free will. That is 'fate', and fate and free will can not coexist. So when somebody says "It was God's will" that somebody die or somebody live...that is bunk. God for all intense and purposes should be kicking back playing the Playstation 5 million..drinking a brewsky. He gave humans free will, that should be the end of it.
It does not follow that free will means that God is not involved in our lives. God does have certain plans for certain people. For example, he may call a person to preach. The person can chose to accept or reject the call. We always have the choice to do God's will or not to do God's will.
Free will also does not mean that there are not consequences for our actions.
God knows our lives from beginning to end but we are the one making the choices in our lives.
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JoonasTo
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted December 11, 2010 02:15 PM |
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I shall repeat this one more time.
If god knows what decisions you are going to make doesn't that mean that you have to pick the ones god knows you're going to pick?
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Elodin
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Free Thinker
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posted December 11, 2010 04:01 PM |
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Quote:
I shall repeat this one more time.
If god knows what decisions you are going to make doesn't that mean that you have to pick the ones god knows you're going to pick?
I shall repeat one more time, knowledge is not causation.
No. You don't do something because God knows you are going to do it. You do it becasue you chose to do it. And God knows you are going to do it becuase you are going to do it.
You chose. You do. God knows. God knowing does not cause you to do it.
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Fauch
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posted December 11, 2010 04:24 PM |
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so god is like big brother.
he claims that at the fork you will go left. then you go right, and he claims he always knew you would go right and change the past so that no one notices his mistake
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JoonasTo
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted December 11, 2010 04:24 PM |
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But if god knows what you are going to do, how can you pick any other choice?
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted December 11, 2010 06:24 PM |
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I'll echo JJ and say that Elodin's argument violates its own premise. That's so obvious that I can't believe we are even discussing it. In fact, his posts almost cause me to laugh.
If I am given a choice between taking the red pill and the blue pill, and someone with a crystal ball (anyone) knows with certainty that I will pick the blue pill, then the future is determined and I really have no choice at all - I will take the blue pill because that's what the crystal balls says I will do. Consider: if indeed I have a choice, then it is possible that I will choose the red pill instead. But if I choose the red pill, then the crystal ball is broken and thus the fortune teller is a charlatan. You can't have it both ways: foreknowledge and free choice are incompatible.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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mvassilev
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posted December 11, 2010 08:38 PM |
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Interestingly enough, I agree with Elodin on this. Knowledge is not causation. Suppose you know your wife is going to brush her teeth this morning. She still has free will not to do so.
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Eccentric Opinion
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JoonasTo
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What if Elvin was female?
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posted December 11, 2010 08:44 PM |
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That's just an illusion.
If I know she is going to do it. She will not choose not to do it.
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DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.
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