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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: US Presidential Race 2012
Thread: US Presidential Race 2012 This thread is 59 pages long: 1 ... 5 6 7 8 9 ... 10 20 30 40 50 59 · «PREV / NEXT»
blizzardboy
blizzardboy


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posted August 03, 2011 03:37 AM

They already shut down several special tax exempts and reductions, which is exactly what my accountant said they would do They can say that they didn't raise taxes, while still being able to pull in more revenue now.
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Elodin
Elodin


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posted August 03, 2011 03:53 AM
Edited by Elodin at 03:54, 03 Aug 2011.

The victory was one for the politicians, not for the American people. They get to pretend they did something about the out of control spending and the problem is put off until after the next election, when it still will not be dealt with if the current politicians remain in office.

The only way there will be any significant change to the status quo of out of control spending is if the Tea Party revolution continues and the Republicans are frightened enough to work with them. I'm hoping in the next election for the Republicans gaining the majority in both houses of Congress with quite a few Tea Party members unseating a number of Republicans and Democrats and the President being a Tea Party favorite. Then and only then will fiscal responsibility return to Washington.

There will be a vote on a balanced budget amendment according to the agreement but of course the democrats will vote against it and Obama would veto it if it did pass so that part of the agreement is a sham. As is the bipartisan debt commission. The dems won't agree to anything but defense cuts and according to the agreement there can be no cuts to entitlements paid to individuals and no more than 2% cut to Medicare (with that being limited to such things as payments to doctors and hospitals.)
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blizzardboy
blizzardboy


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posted August 03, 2011 04:05 AM

Setting aside idealistic goals; I very much consider it a victory for everybody. The reality is that there are 3 distinct viewpoints in Congress, and nobody has enough seats to pass what they want. They didn't make the necessary changes in one fell swoop, but it does help until 2012 when somebody is probably going to get a more dominating thumb over Congress.
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friendofgunnar
friendofgunnar


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posted August 03, 2011 09:28 AM

I don't really know why the democrats are so afraid of a balanced budget amendment, it would mean the end of the Republican party.

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The_Gootch
The_Gootch


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posted August 04, 2011 02:33 AM

At best a balanced budget amendment is empty political posturing.  At worst it's prelude to a disaster.  

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Elodin
Elodin


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posted August 04, 2011 05:11 AM

Yes, a balanced budget would indeed be disastrous. Just imagine not continuing to borrow until the interest payments exceed the gross domestic product. Oh, the horror!!!!

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blizzardboy
blizzardboy


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posted August 06, 2011 07:53 AM
Edited by blizzardboy at 08:13, 06 Aug 2011.

Well I guess one of the 3 major rating agencies gave the fed credit rating a downgrade anyway, the deciding factor being the last minute timing of the deal. The upside is that this means the issue won't be put on the backburner for 2012 and hopefully more decisive deals will be struck in the future, as well as less initiative for more borrowing. What lenders often say is "A rating can be for the benefit of both the creditor and the debtor". Here's to hoping there will be less gridlock down the road.

I'm disappointed with the finger pointing as usual; ranging from the legislatures down to the random nobodies. I wish the people in question would try to show a little more dignity and vision. It's apparent it was a result of gridlock and not because of any one faction. There's no need to speculate because S&P said so themselves, so unless you think they're lying about their justifications there's nothing more to discuss on that end.
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shyranis
shyranis


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posted August 06, 2011 09:17 PM

The only problem is that a balanced budget amendment can possibly be a name only act that does the opposite and pushes the country further into the red. Like the clear skies act did for pollution monitoring.
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blizzardboy
blizzardboy


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posted August 07, 2011 02:21 AM
Edited by blizzardboy at 02:44, 07 Aug 2011.

It would be an amendment, not an act. Serious business. A change to the constitution that would in some way enforce how Congress can allocate spending (I have no idea what precisely they have in mind) I don't see how it would make them spend more money unless the amendment was so lax that it didn't actually matter. It would be nice if it incorporated a mechanism that disallowed Congress/the president from playing a game of chicken on budget allocation. Like, if no deal is reached 2 weeks prior to when bills need to go out, a constitutionally-authorized standby SWAT team will run into the building and start punching everybody in the private parts once every hour until they reach an agreement. The Clear Skies act was a deliberate downgrade from the Clean Air Act.

One way or another these gridlocks need to stop. I'm surprised the other two major agencies didn't give the US a downgrade also. The US treasury is emo-raging about it because of the 2 trillion miscalculation that was reported, but I have to agree that the slow, torturous, and dangerously divided policy-making going on in Congress is a far bigger medium-term credit issue than any one deal. Bills being deposited less than 24 hours after a deal was reached is just unacceptable. Out with the dogma, in with the reality.
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Shyranis
Shyranis


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posted August 08, 2011 07:46 PM

TBH I read that more as an amendment to the debt ceiling agreement rather than a constitutional amendment.

Also... DARN IT!

The Canadian Dollar and stock market is going down because the American credit got downgraded! We're being punished althought ours is still AAA

Well, I guess it's like the recession, we get pulled down the drain too.

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Corribus
Corribus

Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
posted August 08, 2011 10:37 PM

It's because no economy exists in a vacuum anymore.
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del_diablo
del_diablo


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posted August 09, 2011 12:50 AM

What I find amusing is that Canada can not bring USA to court for attempts at damaging its valuta.
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OmegaDestroyer
OmegaDestroyer

Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
posted August 09, 2011 06:03 AM

And what exactly would the argument be?
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del_diablo
del_diablo


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posted August 09, 2011 12:44 PM

The same that is used in a lot of civil court cases: One party recklessy harmed the other.
I find it ironic that it would likely stand to court, if there existed a court instance that allowed one nation to sue another for the actual damages caused.
On the privat marked you are fully liable for damage caused, especially if you saw it coming by a long distance.
But I guess I find it even more amusing that the polticans who has not even attempted to solve the debt problem has not been charged with fraud or finacial incompetence.
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OmegaDestroyer
OmegaDestroyer

Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
posted August 09, 2011 02:37 PM
Edited by OmegaDestroyer at 14:45, 09 Aug 2011.

You do realize if nations were allowed to sue one another over the secondary effects their actions have on each other, that the world would come to a grinding halt due to litigation, right?

But we are getting off track.  Back on track, I find it increasingly sad that despite what a poor president President Obama has been, that he will most likely be reelected.  
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shyranis
shyranis


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posted August 09, 2011 03:23 PM

Canada can't sue over things like that. My country sued over things like placing illegal tariffs on lumber despite the US being the one that came up with NAFTA to begin with. It wound up being settled out of court that my country got most of the money back but the US still decided to keep a  sizable chunk of the money that was made illegally against its own agreement, but at least the resolution passed quickly enough. We're also not stupid enough to try and punish the United States economically, because of 4 reasons:

1: We are closely tied to the US. Hurting the American economy has an effect on ours.

2: We're right next to the United States and we always let the American military use our land for training exercises because we've been very close friends for nearly 100 years. With a large chunk of our own military stuck in Afghanistan, we'd be ripe for invasion if we gave the warmongers in congress enough incentive to invade us.

3: A war would bankrupt both of our countries. Canada actually have per capita a rough equivalent of gun ownership to the United States (we have a lot of hunters). Most likely it would be a harsh occupation for everybody and with the two biggest, richest countries bankrupt, Mexico would be the wealthiest country left =p

4: We're not about to throw away nearly 100 years of total co-operation. It's a shame we no longer have the world's longest unguarded border though.


Also Omega, I agree about the Presidential prospects.


Why is it every election the USA is forced to pick the best candidate out of a lot of terrible people? Probably because anybody actually good for the country isn't very good at the petty side of politics. They're all good at selling snake oil and telling people what they want to hear. In most cases, a politician seems to do the opposite of what they say. They say they are for small government and accountability, but they blow up the size of the government and hide all extra expenses. Or they say they are Christian but attack people without good cause. Or they say they are for civil liberties but crack down on the people at home. Or they say they will undo horrible policies of some predecessor and either keep or enhance them.


I think with those kind of precedents the only people left to vote for are people who say they're going to bankrupt the country and oppress everybody because if they do the exact opposite like those before they might actually be satisfactory as president =p


So yes, Obama doesn't deserve to be re-elected, but sadly his competition so far deserves to be elected even less... it's a terrible state for your country to be in and my heart goes out to you poor souls.
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Elodin
Elodin


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posted August 11, 2011 02:50 PM
Edited by Elodin at 14:51, 11 Aug 2011.

Rick Perry, the Texas state governor, is supposed to announce his bid for the White House in a couple of days. He is only a couple of points behind Romney in CNN's latest poll even though Perry only started thinking about running relatively recently and has not announced his candidacy. Perry has been a vocal supporter of state's rights, having told Washington to butt out of state affairs and follow the Tenth Amendment, and is certainly extremely well qualified to be president as the longest serving governor in Texas history and Texas being the largest state in the US if you don't count all the ice in Alaska. Texas is larger than many nations. It is 10% larger than France and almost twice as large as Germany or Japan. It has deserts, swamps, hilly areas, deep forests, and coastal areas.

Houston is the largest city in Texas and the fourth-largest in the United States, while San Antonio is the second largest in the state and seventh largest in the United States. Dallas–Fort Worth and Greater Houston are the fourth and sixth largest United States metropolitan areas, respectively.

Clicky

Quote:

Washington (CNN) - As Rick Perry moves closer and closer to a run for the White House, a new national survey indicates that the longtime Texas governor is close to the top of the pack in the hunt for the Republican presidential nomination.

According to a CNN/ORC International poll, 15 percent of Republicans and independents who lean towards the GOP pick Perry as their first choice for their party's nomination, just two points behind former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney, who's making his second bid for the White House. Romney's two point margin over Perry is within the survey's sampling error.



Meanwhile, Obama continues to decline in popularity.

Quote:

More American voters disapprove than approve of the job President Obama is doing. Likewise, if making a choice today, more voters say they would back someone else for president in 2012 than say they would give Obama a second term. Who would that someone else be?

Former Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney remains Republican primary voters’ preferred candidate. He’s also the GOP contender more voters see as likely to do a good job in the White House.

These are some of the findings from a Fox News poll released Wednesday.

Currently 42 percent of voters approve of Obama’s job performance and 48 percent disapprove. Last month, before the agreement on the nation’s debt limit was finalized, 45 percent approved and 46 percent disapproved (July 17-19, 2011).

The drag on the president’s rating these days is not only lower approval among Democrats, which currently stands at 77 percent, but also a record-low 31 percent approval among independents. Approval among Republicans is 6 percent -- matching a previous record-low in October 2010.

Meanwhile, for the first time, the poll shows a 51-percent majority of voters think Obama is not a strong and decisive leader.

Today 45 percent say he is a strong leader, down from 52 percent earlier this year, and 60 percent in October 2009.

Similarly, 51 percent of voters say if the election were today, they would vote for someone else over President Obama. That’s about the same as the 49 percent who said someone else in June.

Forty-four percent would re-elect Obama, unchanged from two months ago (June 5-7, 2011).



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Elodin
Elodin


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posted August 14, 2011 08:45 AM

Rick Perry threw his hat in the ring today and Bachmann won the Iowo straw poll.

Quote:

Ames, Iowa –  Rep. Michele Bachmann won the Iowa Straw Poll Saturday, affirming her status as a top-tier candidate in the Republican race to challenge President Obama in 2012.

Bachmann received 28 percent of the nearly 17,000 votes cast. Texas Rep. Ron Paul was close behind her with 27 percent. Former Minnesota Gov. Tim Pawlenty came in a distant third with 13 percent of the vote, followed by former Pennsylvania Sen. Rick Santorum with 9 percent and businessman Herman Cain with 8 percent.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/08/13/finally-here-ames-straw-poll-first-test-2012/#ixzz1Uz1KK9Ko


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mvassilev
mvassilev


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posted August 14, 2011 06:45 PM

And Tim Pawlenty drops out.
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redgreen
redgreen

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posted August 14, 2011 11:51 PM

I support Ron Paul although I'm not form the us...
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