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Heroes Community > Heroes 6 - The New Beginning > Thread: Town Screens! Petition!
Thread: Town Screens! Petition! This thread is 57 pages long: 1 ... 9 10 11 12 13 ... 20 30 40 50 57 · «PREV / NEXT»
MrDragon
MrDragon


Supreme Hero
Eats people with Ketchup
posted April 12, 2011 11:50 AM

Quote:
Well, Mr. Dragon tries to pontificate uncalled-for as usual but there is one thing in his post which is partially correct - part of the disappointment from Ubisoft's decisions will be passed to the final version of the town screens and even if it is acceptable, it will not be judged objectively. Who's fault is this though? Ours?

Actually a pretty neat and clean description of what I said admittedly.
Or at least I think it's saying that, the dashes breaking up the sentance are a bit disruptive to the reading.
Is it "pontificate - uncalled for... ... correct - part of the"? because that's how I am reading it.
Anyway yeah I admit, I might have been a bit.... "inflexible" in my wording, but that seems contradictory to my stance on trying to keep an open mind, even if, as I said, I myself am also dissapointed with the town-window in the presumed state.


I'd say the fault lies on both sides, both the fanbase and their PR department.

I guess what I'm trying to say is "it might still surprise you" and "ASDGASGGDDBSH!!!!!!!!!1!11!111!!!!! is probably not the best way to express your dissapointment."

I just think that a lot of rage drowns out constructive discussion and leaves both posters and readers frustrated.
But that's just my hypothesis.

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Zenofex
Zenofex


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted April 12, 2011 11:59 AM

You can't have a constructive discussion without accurate information. And the most accurate information we have so far unambiguously states that the town windows most likely will suck hard. Being open-minded is not the same as playing blind. Nobody here says that the town windows already are worthless but that they are very likely to be once they are finished.

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MrDragon
MrDragon


Supreme Hero
Eats people with Ketchup
posted April 12, 2011 12:03 PM

Exactly, it's ok to have assumptions (pessimistic ones in this case) but try to bear in mind we don't have enough info the lay down a final (condemning) judgement.

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Zenofex
Zenofex


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted April 12, 2011 12:14 PM

All the "whining" so far is aimed at the potential small chance to make Ubihole reverse their decisions, not to bombard the world with your frustration and make it saffaaaa!!! as much as you do. Saving your comments for the final product won't really help the cause you know.

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War-overlord
War-overlord


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
posted April 12, 2011 12:20 PM

Cause ranting, raving, threatening and insulting people sure does. And claiming that: "They raping the gamez forever." always had succes in the past.
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Zenofex
Zenofex


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted April 12, 2011 12:40 PM

Do you really want me to give you THE example when threatening actually changed a lot? Moronic as it could be, it obviously works. Not that I'm advocating something like that or that somebody is really "threatening" and "insulting" the gentle souls at Ubihole who made a hugely controversial decision and didn't expect the outrage that it will generate once the public finds out about it. Don't worry 'bout them, their skin is thicker than you think and this wasn't (and isn't) something surprising for them.

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Brukernavn
Brukernavn

Hero of Order
posted April 12, 2011 01:04 PM

As Cepheus said in the discussion thread:
Quote:
This is one of the situations where I can't in good conscience recommend that you stop complaining and overreacting.

There has been a reaction against the "screens" ever since they first appeared and Ubihole has been well aware of it, as they have admitted several times. But they seem very reluctant to do anything about the biggest concern - that it's a WINDOW. And there is nothing that indicates that they are willing to do anything about it, unless the community as a collective reacts against it.

Now I don't mean that we should just keep repeating "OHHH NOOOOOOO!!! I'm dying... I want town screens.!!!11one". We have been given some good news (some buildings actually show up in the artwork and it's somewhat animated) but the greatest concern (windows) has remained the same since the pre-alpha version. That means that we have to make it really clear that we want full screens!

I'm a very patient guy, I can wait until they finish them...

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MrDragon
MrDragon


Supreme Hero
Eats people with Ketchup
posted April 12, 2011 01:09 PM
Edited by MrDragon at 13:12, 12 Apr 2011.

Quote:
All the "whining" so far is aimed at the potential small chance to make Ubihole reverse their decisions, not to bombard the world with your frustration and make it saffaaaa!!! as much as you do. Saving your comments for the final product won't really help the cause you know.

Wait, I was agreeing with you in my last post, I didn't use the word "whining", true, saving your comments for the final product will basically be too late to change anything, but there's a difference between the rabble rousing, spamming, trolling etc and actually expressing your dissapointment.

Edit: Yeah, basically what Bruk is saying, we should be clear, but be clear without resorting to baser forms of communication.

We do not want town-windows, we want a full-screen town interface complete with beautiful artwork accurately representative of the town's development.

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Synth
Synth


Hired Hero
That's a lady?
posted April 12, 2011 01:28 PM

I think the disappointment can be broken down to one thing we all agree on: Graphics scalable to the screen size. If that problem can be solved the rest just falls into place. The interface can be much the same, only attached to the edge of the screen, etc.

It's a relatively small technical problem for something that everyone holds so dear.

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TwinMatrix
TwinMatrix


Hired Hero
posted April 12, 2011 02:43 PM

Hating the way things look now does not mean that any (sane) person would still hate it if the final product was different. As the town screens are right now, I hate it. If they end up being better, then I'll like them more. If they end up being the same, then I'll still hate them.

If anything, having negative presumptions causes a more positive reaction to the finished product if it turns out to be better. Setting high expectations, on the other hand, and receiving something well below it does create a negative reaction.
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dark-whisperer
dark-whisperer


Famous Hero
Darkness feels no mercy
posted April 12, 2011 02:44 PM
Edited by dark-whisperer at 14:48, 12 Apr 2011.

Its not just the size. Its whole feel (immersion), interactivity and sense of series tradition.
They are fixing something that isn't even broken and on top of it all they are ignoring vast majority of fans that are disgusted with the idea.
I would consider changing my mind if I could get some sensible explanation why are they doing this and actually see any good thing that window brings. All I see now is stubbornness, deafness and any sign of caring for community.
I just get the feel "you are all idiots, we know better what is good for you" from  them and I don't like it.
I thought that input from people who are interested to buy your product is invaluable. We voiced our concerns when something could be done and we hit wall of silence. Information that could be used to make this game better is overlooked in their vanity.

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DarkLord
DarkLord


Supreme Hero
Fear me..
posted April 12, 2011 02:46 PM

i am sorry , but town-windows is just a disgrace!!!

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Synth
Synth


Hired Hero
That's a lady?
posted April 12, 2011 03:04 PM

Quote:
Its not just the size. Its whole feel (immersion), interactivity and sense of series tradition.
They are fixing something that isn't even broken and on top of it all they are ignoring vast majority of fans that are disgusted with the idea.

Yes I know. I'm thinking in terms of why it's a window in the first place. Basically, the town graphics are static 2D in a fixed resolution when the 3D environment of the rest of the game scales to resolution. This is the technical reason for the decision, I'm sure.

I think the game looks pretty damn gorgeous personally and I'm willing to bet that the town art is lovely too. If it can be stored in a scalable format or have graphics for each resolution then the main issue is solved. I have faith that the developers would turn that into the best experience possible from there.

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TwinMatrix
TwinMatrix


Hired Hero
posted April 12, 2011 04:19 PM
Edited by TwinMatrix at 16:23, 12 Apr 2011.

They did say that not all buildings will be visible when you build them, so I wouldn't hold my breath for any better graphics than that gimped Necropolis picture we received a while ago.

If they pulled off something like HoMM 3 or 4, though, that would be amazing. I can understand the window, because resizing 2D would be awful. It's just the fact that from what we've seen and heard, the window will be nowhere near comparable to HoMM 3/4, but is more like a stats window with a graphic on the first page.
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War-overlord
War-overlord


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
posted April 12, 2011 04:30 PM
Edited by War-overlord at 16:31, 12 Apr 2011.

Quote:
They did say that not all buildings will be visible when you build them,


They said not all buildings appear in the current build.
Meaning that in the version of the now, the windows arent done yet and not all features are implemented. The windows only half work.
Seeing how were several months from release and a good week from the suspected release of Beta-testing, I doubt that will stay in the final version.

Edit: for a bunch of game-lovers, most of us sure don't talk the talk.
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Brukernavn
Brukernavn

Hero of Order
posted April 12, 2011 04:32 PM
Edited by Brukernavn at 16:36, 12 Apr 2011.

I agree that the technical reason behind the decision is the main one. The speed-up excuse is only smoke. As I said in the discussion thread:
Quote:

It's much simpler from a technical standpoint. Then you just have to make one town artwork that remains the same with all graphical settings. In full screen you would have to render the artwork according to the settings. And you also have the challenge with 4:3 and 16:9/16:10 resolutions, not making the artwork look stretched or compacted in any of the cases.

Although I understand this aspect I believe it's just lazy to go with the fixed-size solution. And I think they're hoping that the fans won't be too upset so they don't have to change it.
I would easily trade half the spells and artifacts for proper screens!


I believe Ubihole never thought of the screens as an important part of the game immersion in the first place, and that's what allowed them to make this shortcut-decision.

Remember, these are the same guys that were going to implement a skill system similar to the one in Diablo, had it not been for the VIP fans, as Max stated in one of the interviews:
"We showed them [the VIP fans] among other things an early draft of the skill system, which was much simpler and more like the one in Diablo. The feedback we got was that we missed the series's essence, which are many profound choices and flexibility. So we rejected it."

If they missed the series's essence with respect to the skill-system, I don't find it hard to believe that they did the same with respect to the towns as well. After all they don't want us to become city planners

Edit:
Quote:
The windows only half work.
Seeing how were several months from release and a good week from the suspected release of Beta-testing, I doubt that will stay in the final version.

That's the same logic we heard form the optimists regarding the window-issue as well, but that sure stayed the same. Not saying it's impossible this time, but that would be against the odds.

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TwinMatrix
TwinMatrix


Hired Hero
posted April 12, 2011 04:38 PM

Quote:
They said not all buildings appear in the current build.
Meaning that in the version of the now, the windows arent done yet and not all features are implemented. The windows only half work.
Seeing how were several months from release and a good week from the suspected release of Beta-testing, I doubt that will stay in the final version.

Oh, missed that part. One can only hope that it doesn't turn into a FFXIV, though.
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dark-whisperer
dark-whisperer


Famous Hero
Darkness feels no mercy
posted April 12, 2011 04:50 PM
Edited by dark-whisperer at 16:50, 12 Apr 2011.

he said exactly:
Quote:
The town visuals change when you build stuff (although in the current design, not all buildings appear).


So its not current build, its current design, implying that it wont be changed unless complete design is changed.

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War-overlord
War-overlord


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
posted April 12, 2011 04:52 PM

Design and build are interchangeable terms.
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dark-whisperer
dark-whisperer


Famous Hero
Darkness feels no mercy
posted April 12, 2011 05:45 PM

I CBA to explain the difference between build and design but they are not the same thing I assure you.

Quote:
Edit: for a bunch of game-lovers, most of us sure don't talk the talk.


What are you suggesting? To blindly praise every decision developers make because its wrapped in Heroes franchise name? Even if its so clearly wrong one?
You choose not to see big pink elephant in the room but rest of us wont pretend that its not there.

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