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| Thread: Right to Self Defense, Gun Ownership, and Deterence of Crime |  This thread is pages long: 1 10 ... 13 14 15 16 17 ... 20 30 40 50 55 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 30, 2012 04:30 PM |
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I don't quite get that trespassing thing. aren't you supposed to cross the garden anyway to ring or knock to the door? it isn't considered trespassing here. of course, if you do anything else, it might be considered trespassing.
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OmegaDestroyer
Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
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posted July 30, 2012 04:30 PM |
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Even if the salesman was wrong, it will do nothing to mitigate the murder charges pending against the accused.
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The giant has awakened
You drink my blood and drown
Wrath and raving I will not stop
You'll never take me down
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted July 30, 2012 04:54 PM |
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Quote:
I don't quite get that trespassing thing. aren't you supposed to cross the garden anyway to ring or knock to the door? it isn't considered trespassing here. of course, if you do anything else, it might be considered trespassing.
If the owner has posted no tresspassing signs he does not want you on his property without permission. Entering the property without his permission because you want to sell him a new vacuum cleaner or steak/seafood is trespassing.
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Revelation
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted July 30, 2012 04:58 PM |
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Hah Mormons die! Apartment building wall reads inappropriate is prohibited, and the people are waiting at the door with guns. I am the law.
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OmegaDestroyer
Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
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posted July 30, 2012 05:14 PM |
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted July 30, 2012 05:26 PM |
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Edited by Ghost at 17:26, 30 Jul 2012.
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Finland came to pass that a man was thrown out of the restaurant. He came back with a chain saw. But the Finns took care of the naked fist, chair, a barrel of beer on their own. The man was thrown out again.
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Fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted July 30, 2012 06:15 PM |
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Edited by Fauch at 18:16, 30 Jul 2012.
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted July 30, 2012 08:41 PM |
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted July 30, 2012 08:57 PM |
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I don't get it - how arming the citizens will reduce the crime rate if the very reasons for the crimes are not addressed? And what is the police there for? This is an advanced nation leaving in peace, not Iraq in the middle of a civil war, right?
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted July 30, 2012 09:04 PM |
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Quote:
I don't get it - how arming the citizens will reduce the crime rate if the very reasons for the crimes are not addressed?
It wont reduce crime rates. It will prevent some and cause other crimes.
I people at the batman opening were armed, that guy would have been dead.
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And what is the police there for?
Enforce law, not prevent crime.
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This is an advanced nation leaving in peace, not Iraq in the middle of a civil war, right?
You might be surprised.
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted July 30, 2012 09:11 PM |
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Edited by Zenofex at 21:15, 30 Jul 2012.
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It wont reduce crime rates. It will prevent some and cause other crimes.
Then it doesn't have the intended effect, does it?
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Enforce law, not prevent crime.
One of purposes of the police in every state is to prevent crime, that's true even in the deep Balkans where the law is a very relative notion during the last 2 decades. If you need too many policemen to keep a neighbourhood calm, then you are definitely doing something else wrong. The police institution however should guarantee a socially acceptable degree of crime-free environment, otherwise it becomes pretty meaningless. What's to enforce if you can't even keep the lives of the people under your alleged protection?
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You might be surprised.
I'm rarely surprised but I just might be in this case indeed.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted July 30, 2012 09:28 PM |
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Quote:
I people at the batman opening were armed, that guy would have been dead.
It's not easy to aim when you're choking on tear gas.
It's not easy to actually keep your calm being an average Joe when someone is shooting at you.
It's not easy to kill someone and remain psychically well, unless you're Elodin.
It's not easy to put your life on a 50-50 lotto draw "who shoots first" and consider this the best, perfect solution.
It doesn't matter if the murderer is dead when you're dead yourself.
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted July 30, 2012 11:28 PM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 23:32, 30 Jul 2012.
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Then it doesn't have the intended effect, does it?
If it has no effect,why remove it? Its actually good business. Actually,removing guns could cause more issues. Gun control is no real solution based from this excerpt from the links below:
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In addition, criminals are the people least likely to obey gun control laws, meaning that the laws probably have a disproportionate impact on law-abiding individuals. “For the typical gun control law,” Professor Volokh said, “you’ll have very little positive effect but a possible negative effect.”
From:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/29/weekinreview/29liptak.html?pagewanted=all
Another great link:
http://www.fff.org/freedom/fd0210e.asp
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One of purposes of the police in every state is to prevent crime,
A cop cant prevent somebody firing a bullet with an illegal weapon. Crime prevention usually works with deterrence and punishment, not with some sheriffs patrolling your home.
http://www.griffith.edu.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0006/188727/can-police.pdf
I believe that Police are there for law enforcement, and "Further" prevention of crime at the site of crime.
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that's true even in the deep Balkans where the law is a very relative notion during the last 2 decades.
Balkans? The only thing that can prevent crime here is a gang with ak 47's. Unfortunately,gangs rarely adhere to laws.
I dont think you know balkans as much as I do,especially Albania,Serbia,Macedonia,Kosovo etc.
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted July 31, 2012 02:02 AM |
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For people who are gun owners, I am curious if you would be supportive of (or at least, not against) the following federal gun laws:
(1) Gun merchants are required to register anyone who purchases certain combat firearms with the FBI (e.g., assault weapons).
(2) Federal criminalization of any crime committed with a firearm. (e.g., burglary with a weapon becomes a federal crime in addition to a state crime).
I'll just point out that neither of methods place further restrictions on what kind of weapons you can buy or who can buy them.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted July 31, 2012 02:05 AM |
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Quote:
(1) Gun merchants are required to register anyone who purchases certain combat firearms with the FBI (e.g., assault weapons)
Wait, you're permitted to purchase military grade weapons without so much as the transaction being noted? Hahahaha.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted July 31, 2012 02:31 AM |
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Quote:
(1) Gun merchants are required to register anyone who purchases certain combat firearms with the FBI (e.g., assault weapons).
No. The federal government has no need to know how many guns I own or what kinds of guns I own. Guns don't kill people. People kill people. Execute murderers. Keep other predators locked up when you catch them. Funny thing about criminals is they don't obey the law. Imagine that.
You may or may not know that when you buy a gun the dealer is supposed to call the FBI and the FBI clears the purchase. Usually it can be cleared instantly but the purchase can't go through until it does clear if it is not instant.
Clicky
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(2) Federal criminalization of any crime committed with a firearm. (e.g., burglary with a weapon becomes a federal crime in addition to a state crime).
Nah, the states are quite capable of handling such things and don't need the federal government butting into their affairs.
The dems are using the Batman shooting to try to push some gun control legislation through Congress as we speak and the president made comments calling for gun control immediately after the shooting. Course it has no chance of passing because the conservative Republicans and the few Bluedog democrats will vote it down.
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Revelation
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Ghost
Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
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posted July 31, 2012 02:44 AM |
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American criminals are stupid. It gave the world a lot of criminal idea.
America does not stop, because the sale of arms to calculate the amount of American military-related. America wants a permanent mighty state.
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted July 31, 2012 02:59 AM |
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American criminals are stupid. It gave the world a lot of criminal idea.
America does not stop, because the sale of arms to calculate the amount of American military-related. America wants a permanent mighty state.
Arms is the only American good that sells, it's their own comfy little place in our world.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted July 31, 2012 03:35 AM |
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@Elodin
Regarding point 1, I was mosting getting at a special database system, maintained by FBI, of people who own assault rifles. Not handguns, hunting rifles and shotguns - military grade firearms is what I'm talking.
I agree nothing like that will ever get passed - in the US our government can pass a law preventing me from buying a large soda but the hell if anyone's gonna touch my guns! 
By the way, I've never liked the "guns don't kill people; people kill people" argument. I mean, you can say the same thing about sarin nerve gas, but I doubt you'd be all gungho about lifting government restrictions from trafficking that.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted July 31, 2012 03:51 AM |
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I mean, you can say the same thing about sarin nerve gas, but I doubt you'd be all gungho about lifting government restrictions from trafficking that.
Maybe if it was implemented into a neat little booby-trap, you know, kids kicking their footballs over the fence, then when they trespass retrieve it they'd set it off, some nerve gas will teach 'em to obey the law, except they won't, 'cause they'd be dead.
Which would be a point, guns could be used to only disable someone (even by accident) while releasing a lethal nerve gas would certainly kill the intruder and probably the occupants too. And that's if you were planning on using it for protection.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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