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| Thread: Right to Self Defense, Gun Ownership, and Deterence of Crime |  This thread is pages long: 1 10 20 30 40 ... 44 45 46 47 48 ... 50 55 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted May 08, 2013 04:16 AM |
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I'd say early years of teenagers suggest a different danger. People tend to be overemotional, touchy, unstable and arrogant. They already get the habit of shooting around at ten and interiorise it, then you have these school shootings every once in a while. It's a totally unique social phenomenon.
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blizzardboy
Honorable
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Nerf Herder
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posted May 08, 2013 04:35 AM |
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Except, to the best of my knowledge, vitually all the kids that do the school shootings have mental health problems and/or are some variant of a depressed goth/emo/rebel. The random Kansas farmer kid that learned to shoot when he was 7 is not showing up at his high school and killing his classmates due to a bad case of teenage angst. Also, there are children that are familiarized with firearms at very young ages in other countries (such as Canada) where school shootings do not occur. In fact the safest places in the world are places where firearms are fairly common, not places like England. The issue with the US is a gun culture, not guns. A lot of people are under the eccentric impression that keeping a revolver under their bed while they're unconscious is the ultimate safeguard.
And for all the drama that is going on in wake of the Connecticut shooting, the statistics are in that violent crime is continuing to decrease and it has been steadily decreasing since the 90s. The public is experiencing a short-sighted kneejerk reaction.
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"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted May 08, 2013 04:56 AM |
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Quote:
The issue with the US is a gun culture, not guns.
I totally agree. And don't you think this IS indeed part of that cultural problem? Why would a 5 year old need to learn to shoot? Why would a teenager? To protect his home? Please... Let's say 2-3 percent of them are professional sportsmen who shoot... What about the rest? This is not something about owning guns, this is about promoting them beginning at a very early age.
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted May 08, 2013 05:09 AM |
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Eh. I'm not going to go out of my way to defend the NRA. They are overzealous and one-dimensional in their campaign, as almost all single-issue activist groups are.
I'll just leave it to say that I have zero problem if a family teaches a child to shoot at a very young age. I don't consider that to be any significant health hazard. And without any hard numbers in front of me, I'm confident that the percentage that learn for hunting/sporting purposes would be far, far higher than 2-3%.
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"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."
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Seraphim
Supreme Hero
Knowledge Reaper
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posted May 08, 2013 09:41 AM |
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Edited by Seraphim at 15:14, 08 May 2013.
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Quote:
Eh. I'm not going to go out of my way to defend the NRA. They are overzealous and one-dimensional in their campaign, as almost all single-issue activist groups are.
I'll just leave it to say that I have zero problem if a family teaches a child to shoot at a very young age. I don't consider that to be any significant health hazard. And without any hard numbers in front of me, I'm confident that the percentage that learn for hunting/sporting purposes would be far, far higher than 2-3%.
And nobody is against that. Now imagine gun-kid shooting someone, he has afterall a rifle-pistol.
Gun-kidd is a danger not only to himself, but to society aswell because he can not comprehend how much damage he can do with that thing.
There is no excuse for children to bear weapons that dangerous. If a kidd wants to know how to hunt, his daddy should not give him a loaded weapon.
Otherthan that, yes,you nailed it. Its gun culture and the usual american, we love guns more than we love life.
Also, people should not really compare whole of america with other places. Crime might be high in places where there are no guns, but in america, there are many places that are gun fests and the homicide rates are ridiculous like:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_cities_by_crime_rate
If people in america love guns, they should really tax the hell out of them. A valuable source of income.
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Doomforge
Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
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posted May 08, 2013 12:42 PM |
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There's a good reason why kids can't drive and shouldn't shoot people: it was proven like a thousand of times that the majority of kids (ESPECIALLY very young, i.e. 5yo) don't grasp the concept of responsibility. A mind of a typical 5yo isn't developed enough to handle such burden. You can bully them into obedience, or buy their obedience with candies, but a typical 5yo will not be responsible because of his/her own logical assessment.
Hence "mini-shotguns for kids" are a joke. And there's a big difference between shooting a gun while being supervised by a parent (I still wouldn't, but whatever) and buying them their own mini-shotgun with killer ammo "for responsible use".
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours
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OmegaDestroyer
Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
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posted May 08, 2013 02:21 PM |
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Reports show gun homicides down since 1990s.
The article is about gun violence in the USA. Allegedly it is down 39% percent since the 1990s yet 56% of those polled believe it is higher. I imagine a lot of that has to do easier access to information & ratings-hungry media outlets.
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Minion
Legendary Hero
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posted May 08, 2013 03:25 PM |
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Edited by Minion at 15:26, 08 May 2013.
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It is 39% down from gun violence peak year of 1993. I wonder if it has anything to do with the Brady Handgun Violence Prevention Act signed 1993 by Bill Clinton.
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"These friends probably started using condoms after having produced the most optimum amount of offsprings. Kudos to them for showing at least some restraint" - Tsar-ivor
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OmegaDestroyer
Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
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posted May 08, 2013 04:28 PM |
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I do not know. The report states:
Quote:
Though researchers differ over all the reasons why gun violence has declined, many attribute it to the aging of the baby boomers. The crime rate was higher in the 1960s and 1970s when many in that large generation were teenagers, an age when higher proportions of people commit crimes.
Crime rates dropped in the early 1980s as that generation aged, rose in the latter part of that decade as the use of crack cocaine grew, then dropped again in the 1990s as the nation's economy improved, analysts say.
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted May 09, 2013 03:19 AM |
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My guess is that the perception of higher homicide rate has to deal with the media. Information is a lot easier to access than it was in the 1990s. And there has been a lot more highly publicized public shootings than in the past, or at least it seems to be so. Maybe I'm a victim of the media hype as well. 
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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fauch
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted May 09, 2013 06:01 PM |
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I was wondering if the problem with background check is that it might reveal something that some people want to hide?
it probably doesn't fall under that law, but I think of some of the disgusting pictures of american soldiers on war theaters, which suggests they may have no problem arming mentally disturbed guys. maybe they actually need such people to support their bellicist politics?
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted May 09, 2013 07:25 PM |
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Quote:
I was wondering if the problem with background check is that it might reveal something that some people want to hide?
The problem with back-ground check is that it would add a condition unto a civil right, the Government would be committing ultra vires and even if a legislation was passed it would be "struck off" as soon as the first supreme court case shows up. I admire America's consistency and stark defense of their rights.
And yes, the problem with background checks is that it might reveal something that you might want to hide. Afterall for what crimes/misdeeds will the authorities have power to deny you your right? And is every person beyond repent? Isn't prisons supposed to reform the offender? So what does it matter if someone has a criminal record, they're obviously rehabilitated. They're not, but if they're not why the **** did you lock them up for 20 years?!?! (or any amount of time really, not to mention the cost of just "punishing" amounts to £80,000 a year here)
Finally, we live in a democracy, people have the right to choose their way in life, and have the right to defend it.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted May 09, 2013 07:41 PM |
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Remind me to shoot you in the face if we ever meet and you object against my right to shoot you in the face.
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gnomes2169
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Duke of the Glade
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posted May 09, 2013 07:52 PM |
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Quote:
Isn't prisons supposed to reform the offender?
Pft, I was wondering what would make me laugh first today...
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Yeah in the 18th century, two inventions suggested a method of measurement. One won and the other stayed in America.
-Ghost destroying Fred
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted May 09, 2013 08:16 PM |
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Right, so you lock people up and you expect them to change magically, unless of course you believe that someone ought to be simply punished, but if that's the case then what right do you have to complain about atrocities; when you breed monsters they eventually bite you in the ass. Not to mention housing criminals comes at the tax-payer's expense, money for a single prisoner could send a child to private school.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted May 09, 2013 08:20 PM |
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Nobody expect them to change, but they may change because prison conditions are far from club med, so you think twice before backsliding. Prison is what is called: keep the dangers out of society, as long as the trial was set. So far no one came with a better solution for criminals.
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Era II mods and utilities
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted May 09, 2013 08:43 PM |
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Britain did.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted May 09, 2013 08:58 PM |
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And it worked so well that they are now 2nd rank right after US, in criminality rate? Nice example 
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Era II mods and utilities
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Tsar-Ivor
Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
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posted May 09, 2013 09:32 PM |
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I was referring to deportation of criminals, if a person shows themselves to not be fit for society they should be removed from society, and not be a further burden on everybody else.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted May 09, 2013 09:35 PM |
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Quote:
I was referring to deporting criminals to places like Australia, where even criminals have a chance to live a life.
I'll just quote this in case you get the urge to delete it. It's priceless! 
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