Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info mods forum | HOMM4: info CTG forum | HOMM5: info mods forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Other Games Exist Too > Thread: Diablo III....
Thread: Diablo III.... This thread is 28 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 10 20 ... 24 25 26 27 28 · «PREV / NEXT»
RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted March 28, 2014 11:31 AM

Storm-Giant said:
RMZ1989 said:
But now, to be honest, it is the true sequel of Diablo 2. I am enjoying it a lot, playing with friends in adventure mode etc. Removed AH which is big plus in my book. This is all coming from a guy who never was a hardcore fan of hack & slash games, I played Diablo 2 up to 30-40 and couldn't stand it anymore, same happened with Diablo 3, but this time it is different. To bad the first Diablo 3 wasn't this good.

That's....saying a lot. From what I read on a spanish forum, the expansion is a great addition, but not on the level of a Diablo 2 sequel is expected to be...because that would be a lot.

And if you say that you didn't play D2 that much

RMZ1989 said:
Yeah the Act V ending was bad, I didn't think that they would've done it better either.

If it has a bad ending, can't be on D2 level

LoD ending cinematic was so epic...

That is just your opinion, right now it is better than Diablo 2 from my point of view. Sorry, but Diablo 2 had very little variations in it, mostly going for one build. Even though you could bind your spells and abilities and change them, you barely needed to do so, most of the people were using like 1-3 abilities and were doing perfectly fine with them. You couldn't respec at all, and had that talent tree that is overused nowadays by every second game.

Why you people think that Diablo 2 was much better is probably because of nostalgia that I don't have because I've never played Diablo 2 that much. I leveled up two characters(Necromancer and Assassin) to level 40 and played a bit with friends in lan and that is about it, not because I disliked the game but because I find it repetitive and quite boring after certain point.

Diablo 3 was the same, but RoS changed a lot of that, and now you are not playing the same build anymore, the build you play is mostly dictated by the items you have because a lot of Legendary items are changing your abilities and/or buffing them in some way.
____________
Give a man a mask, and he'll
become his true self.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted March 28, 2014 01:33 PM

I don't disagree with you that diablo 2 is repetitive.

RMZ1989 said:

Sorry, but Diablo 2 had very little variations in it, mostly going for one build.

No.
Amazon - Bow: Strafe/Multishot/Exploding Arrow (v.1.09-), even the freezing arrow.. | Poison build / Lightning Fury build.

 The amazon is one of the least varied characters, but since there are more or less four variations that can be combined, you get a total of 6 builds, in the least varied class.

Assassin - Trapper (only lightning really worked well) | Martial Arts, e.g. you could combine Tiger Strike + Dragon Tail for massive amounts of damage, e.g. Tiger Strike would give a factor of 20 and D-Tail a factor of 4 for a total factor of 80 to your kick damage!! With an AoE fire/physical damage attack, able to one shot some act-bosses even. Alternatively one could go for another kick with Dragon Talon, go for speed over power with some leech life (life tap wand) and you could stand in the middle of the nasties packs in hell and be kickin' ass. Finally there's a phoenix striker with high speed, basically firing off 4-5 Meteors pr. second (compared to a Sorceress who'll get 1 off each other second or so due to cooldown), which all can be combined with e.g. a freezing attack for crowd control, but when speaking of crowd control.. | Shadow disciplines, not to mention it allows her to summon a shadow warrior that potentially can summon traps even more powerful than the assassin herself, each trap dealing thousands of damage, her crowd controlling through cloak of shadows is excellent and it's an off-skill meaning on a cheap runeword meaning every class has access to it!

Barbarian - Most people will play a whirlwind build and never look back, and they'll be very frustrated at hell difficulty v.1.10+, because they don't use the native crowd control of the Barbarian, howl, taunt, etc. I mean why should they? They never needed to as they reached level 40... On the other hand, while the Barbarian is the most plain character, in my opinion, as all his combat skills are more or less a swing with a weapon, high levels of leap (knockback radius increases) as well super speedy frenzy or tactical bash/stun combies can outperform whirlwind big time depending on the situation making the Barbarian a lot of fun to play because it's one of the few characters which require some skill to complete the game with (1.10+).

Druid - This is basically a summoner, a shapeshifter and a spell caster all at once with all builds being viable. True the summoner is more like icing on the cake, but the two other skill trees won't really combine.

Necromancer - 3 builds, summons / poison / magic, the easiest character to complete the game with thanks to the most impressive crowd control of all characters. Can be very boring to play.

Paladin - Aura + Combat skill, while I could argue for charge being viable, or smite for that matter, let's just simplify it to 3 builds, zeal / hammer / FoH, each requires their own aura. Heck you could potentially drop FoH arguing it's only viable in pvp and you still have 2 very different builds, one melee relying on skills of the player similar to a Barbarian, but with less options (not much crowd control, does holy freeze count?), while the other is extremely OP.

Sorc - There are basically 3 very capable variations (cold, fire, lightning) of which it's unclear which is better and each variation  have variations within them to different degree depending on the version of the game played. Surely you can't combine all 3 and expect to do well at hell difficulty, so I can't see how this character is ever just one build.

No the build possibilities was never an issue with diablo 2, it was one of their selling points when advertising, I remember.

Quote:
Even though you could bind your spells and abilities and change them, you barely needed to do so, most of the people were using like 1-3 abilities and were doing perfectly fine with them. You couldn't respec at all, and had that talent tree that is overused nowadays by every second game.


What does "bind your spells and abilities" mean?
Amount of abilities used:
Amazon - Secondary, Primary, Melee, Summons, at minimum 4-5.

Assassin - A freaking lot (2 Crowd Control, 1 Summon, 1 Traps, 1 Mind Blast, 1-2 attacks)

Barbarian - A freaking lot again (~3 crowd controls, 2-3 attacks)

Druid - Could potentially use at little as 3

Necromancer - Summons (minimum 2), Curses (minimum 2-3, probably more), if spell caster, remove 1 summon add 2 spells and maybe crowd control in form of bone prison and/or wall.

Paladin - A lot, aura changing is very important when playing in hell, it's the paladin's versatility

Sorceress - Could potentially get off with 2-3 abilities.

So that's certainly not most and more importantly, it's not counting offhand skills, which are skills from other classes any class can use with the right item(s).

Finally, there are respecs and have been since 1.13, e.g. if one wants to play a wind druid, but dislike how slow he's in the early game, go for a fire druid, firestorm all the way until fissure, then fissure all the way, this guy can go a long way without much care and fast at that too (only the assassin and sorc are faster, and the sorc is slower early on), then you'll have plenty of skill points to respec to wind skills and you've a viable wind druid.

Then again, since you never played past level 40, I doubt you ever took the challenges of hell unless you played v.1.08/1.09 (where the game was very very easy, in which case the "only one build" idea doesn't make a lot of sense to me), whereby you'd find that you could use the same 1-3 abilities over and over, but only because you could, not because you had to, like you'd have had to had you continued...
____________
Living time backwards

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted March 28, 2014 01:39 PM

All is fine but all these builds are based around spamming a single attack. So a hammerdin spams hammers, a javazon spams lightning fury, et cetera. All in all I'd rather take Diablo3 system where I have several skills to use (which I can change at will if I get bored with them) rather than Diablo2's minmax builds of spamming a single ability 24/7. Which quickly gets old. The 1.13 patch added respec which is nice but still, if you respec, you're kinda expected to respec into another spam-one-skill build because those are pretty much the only ones effective because of very strong min-maxing possibilities of that game.

Has anyone tried Reaper of Souls? is it an improvement? Out of all of D3's faults, poor itemization is what hurt me the most.
____________
We reached to the stars and everything is now ours

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted March 28, 2014 01:59 PM

That's another way of putting it, sure, but you mention two classes with no crowd controlling (pretty much) and calls it a day.

Amazon - Main lightning fury, but very often charged strike (you don't meet lots of mobs all the time), and when you meet lightning immunes, freezing arrow (which happens a lot on hell diff.).

Assassin - She uses traps and CoS more or less evenly, so I disagree here.

Barbarian - Without heavy use of crowd control he's not manageable in hell unless you're heavily twinked, which I kind of doubt you are if you never reached past level 40, hence I disagree here.

Druid - If we don't count recasting summons, cyclone armor and hurricane, sure..

Necromancer - Minions alone without curses won't cut it, use of curses may be limited, but it's not one skill to spam all the time. To be honest, it's more like 0 than 2 though..

Paladin - Yeah blessed hammer, but if you've teleport, you also gotta change to Concentration all the time, in any case, like with the amazon, there's little crowd control here, so there's really only one way to play this build.

Sorc - Again, little crowd control, so yeah I give you that one too.

So my conclusion is that it has more to do with some classes are heavy hitter without crowd control (Ama, Pala, Sorc), or are only crowd control (Necro), but that only counts for ~50%, the rest still have stuff to cast and there are still builds which are much more dependent on doing stuff different.
Just because these build may not be the best does not mean they're not viable and should be disregarded, though I'm aware and respect your idea of optimizing a strategy for defeating a game.
____________
Living time backwards

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted March 28, 2014 02:07 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 14:09, 28 Mar 2014.

I'm not sure, forfy. A lot of the stuff you mention is either active in the background (like auras), or useable once in a blue moon (when something is immune or something). Twinked chars don't need crowd control, too - they just mutilate everything in their path. In the end it all comes down to spamming a single skill, and the occasional use of something else IMHO doesn't change much. Even when playing untwinked I mostly used single skills, with a (very occasional) backup skills. D2 is very loot based, once you have the right gear it no longer matters really how do you play, you're still pretty much invinvible so why not go all-out offense with a minmaxed skill like blessed hammer? that's what the crowd does, at least.
____________
We reached to the stars and everything is now ours

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted March 28, 2014 02:12 PM

Sure, but if it was much more complex, you'd have people complaining a lot.. If you saw the transition between 1.09 to 1.10 which I experienced, people whose "only-WW" barbarians now couldn't take the punishment anymore and quit the game... But I wouldn't focus on twinked characters or call immunities once in a blue moon on hell diff. Also my main counter was the Barbarian and the Assassin, both of which I believe requires a larger array of active skills. Maybe the Druid too, I never played this guy a lot, but I know the fully twinked Druid is much like the Paladin of teleporting in and spamming non-stop.

Doomforge said:
I'm not sure, forfy. A lot of the stuff you mention is either active in the background (like auras), or useable once in a blue moon (when something is immune or something). Twinked chars don't need crowd control, too - they just mutilate everything in their path. In the end it all comes down to spamming a single skill, and the occasional use of something else IMHO doesn't change much.

____________
Living time backwards

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted March 28, 2014 02:47 PM
Edited by Storm-Giant at 14:54, 28 Mar 2014.

@RMZ: only 2 chars and ONLY to level 40? I'm not disagreeing with the fact that it was kind of repetitive, but it looks like you barely touched the game
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted March 28, 2014 06:02 PM

Storm-Giant said:
@RMZ: only 2 chars and ONLY to level 40? I'm not disagreeing with the fact that it was kind of repetitive, but it looks like you barely touched the game

It may be barely for you, it certainly isn't barely for me. So, in your opinion, how much should have I play it? Until I got my characters to level 99? Or until I got all 7 characters to level 99?

By my standards, two 40 level characters is a lot for a game that bored the hell out of me. You probably got it by now that I didn't really enjoy the game that much after first 5-6 hours.
____________
Give a man a mask, and he'll
become his true self.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted March 28, 2014 06:12 PM

A few chars to lvl 75 and at least 5 or 6 of them at 40 I would say. And trying Inferno with one char

But it seems you simply didn't enjoy it. Too bad, though I still think you should have tried the other characters, they have different skills you know
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
kipshasz
kipshasz


Undefeatable Hero
Elvin's Darkside
posted March 28, 2014 06:23 PM

This means you never went through nightmare difficulty right?

I've gotten LV67 or so on my highest char legit before I got bored and started using a hero editor.

although that cap was reached on Eastern Sun mod on a paladin. basically there an aura called "protection from evil" or something like that will see you through all the way to Nightmare act 4. Such OP crap it's absurd, you just run around collecting loot all the freaking time. Never actually finished Hell mode ,got stuck on that in Act 3 mainly 'cause the dungeons were messed up and I couldn't find one of the quest items there.


In Diablo 3 however I went through the whole game like a breeze, only trouble is Inferno Act 4.
____________
"Kip is the Gavin McInnes of HC" - Salamandre
"Ashan to the Trashcan", "I got PTSD from H7. " - LizardWarrior

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted March 28, 2014 06:23 PM
Edited by RMZ1989 at 18:29, 28 Mar 2014.

Storm-Giant said:
A few chars to lvl 75 and at least 5 or 6 of them at 40 I would say. And trying Inferno with one char

But it seems you simply didn't enjoy it. Too bad, though I still think you should have tried the other characters, they have different skills you know

I know, but I am kind of the guy that likes to try few characters, some of them just deflects me from playing them.

It is not like that I didn't try, I've tried everything except for Amazon(I didn't even touch her). Barbarian and Druid were playable for me, but found Necromancer and Assassin a lot more enjoyable so I continued with them.

kipshasz said:
This means you never went through nightmare difficulty right?

I've gotten LV67 or so on my highest char legit before I got bored and started using a hero editor.

although that cap was reached on Eastern Sun mod on a paladin. basically there an aura called "protection from evil" or something like that will see you through all the way to Nightmare act 4. Such OP crap it's absurd, you just run around collecting loot all the freaking time. Never actually finished Hell mode ,got stuck on that in Act 3 mainly 'cause the dungeons were messed up and I couldn't find one of the quest items there.


In Diablo 3 however I went through the whole game like a breeze, only trouble is Inferno Act 4.

Yeah, I didn't play Nightmare, normal was just enough for me.

As I said, Diablo 3 at the start was terrible, I agree that it was too easy, but if you try it now, I am sure it won't be as easy as you think.

There are different difficulties now, Nightmare, Hell and Inferno no longer exists.

Normal, Hard, Expert, Master and Torment. Torment has 6 levels, if you  are doing fine on Torment 1, Torment 3-4 will already be impossible for you, and you have to grind a lot to get items for Torment 6. You will be changing your skill build a lot until you gear up to the point where you can go relatively easy through Torment 1-3.
____________
Give a man a mask, and he'll
become his true self.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted March 28, 2014 06:36 PM

Storm-Giant said:
And trying Inferno with one char



Inferno got nerfed 1.10+, it may look beautiful, but it isn't very good, sadly. The idea of a breath attack crossing several screens are always fun though, if only the monsters didn't have such a limited spawning range!

Quote:
found Necromancer and Assassin a lot more enjoyable so I continued with them.

Like it has been said, level 40+ means you only got somewhere in nightmare (unless it was v.1.08-1.09), which is only 1/3rd of the game. Level 75 and you would have been around late hell.

Also Necro is known for getting boring. I think most people find sorcs most enjoyable (1-11 charged bolts, 12+ respec, go for fire ball, until you've enough skills for the spell you prefer). Then again, people are very different.
____________
Living time backwards

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted March 28, 2014 07:40 PM

OhforfSake said:
Storm-Giant said:
And trying Inferno with one char



Inferno got nerfed 1.10+, it may look beautiful, but it isn't very good, sadly. The idea of a breath attack crossing several screens are always fun though, if only the monsters didn't have such a limited spawning range!

Did Fred ate my brains? ffs

I was thinking of Hell difficulty, but I got confused since in D3 there's an Inferno diff and in spanish Hell is translated to Infierno :/

OhforfSake said:
Quote:
found Necromancer and Assassin a lot more enjoyable so I continued with them.

Like it has been said, level 40+ means you only got somewhere in nightmare (unless it was v.1.08-1.09), which is only 1/3rd of the game. Level 75 and you would have been around late hell.

Also Necro is known for getting boring. I think most people find sorcs most enjoyable (1-11 charged bolts, 12+ respec, go for fire ball, until you've enough skills for the spell you prefer). Then again, people are very different.

Call me slow noob, but I usually leveled up my chars up to 75 before jumping to hell, Nightmare Act 5 gave a ton of easy experience ^^
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted March 28, 2014 07:52 PM

Storm-Giant said:
OhforfSake said:
Storm-Giant said:
And trying Inferno with one char



Inferno got nerfed 1.10+, it may look beautiful, but it isn't very good, sadly. The idea of a breath attack crossing several screens are always fun though, if only the monsters didn't have such a limited spawning range!

Did Fred ate my brains? ffs

I was thinking of Hell difficulty, but I got confused since in D3 there's an Inferno diff and in spanish Hell is translated to Infierno :/

OhforfSake said:
Quote:
found Necromancer and Assassin a lot more enjoyable so I continued with them.

Like it has been said, level 40+ means you only got somewhere in nightmare (unless it was v.1.08-1.09), which is only 1/3rd of the game. Level 75 and you would have been around late hell.

Also Necro is known for getting boring. I think most people find sorcs most enjoyable (1-11 charged bolts, 12+ respec, go for fire ball, until you've enough skills for the spell you prefer). Then again, people are very different.

Call me slow noob, but I usually leveled up my chars up to 75 before jumping to hell, Nightmare Act 5 gave a ton of easy experience ^^

Yeah I am seeing both of you talking about Inferno and was like "What, I didn't know there was Inferno in Diablo 2, maybe they had added it later?"... lol ^^
____________
Give a man a mask, and he'll
become his true self.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted March 28, 2014 08:13 PM

Storm-Giant said:
I was thinking of Hell difficulty

I know ^^
Storm-Giant said:
but I got confused since in D3 there's an Inferno diff and in spanish Hell is translated to Infierno :/

You're not Spanish anymore. Now you're Dutch.
Storm-Giant said:

Call me slow noob, but I usually leveled up my chars up to 75 before jumping to hell, Nightmare Act 5 gave a ton of easy experience ^^

Ok. Noob Joke aside, I don't remember the levels very well. Some liked to level up a lot by rerunning the same areas, I preferred to go through each item once. Since it's a long time ago I played and I've always had a huge dislike for the linearity, repetitiveness and looting of diablo 2, my memory on what level you're when isn't very good. Also because I usually entered the /players X command at various difficulties depending on the character in question.
I'm pretty sure you can get through the game before level 80 in 1.13+ on /players1 tough. I remember me and 2 other guys took on hell /players8 and we were level 85 at act 4 when we quit.

RMZ1989 said:

Yeah I am seeing both of you talking about Inferno and was like "What, I didn't know there was Inferno in Diablo 2, maybe they had added it later?"... lol ^^

Nope the Sorceress always had Inferno.


____________
Living time backwards

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
kipshasz
kipshasz


Undefeatable Hero
Elvin's Darkside
posted March 28, 2014 08:15 PM

I always felt that sorc's fire tree spells were a bit weak compared to the other two.
____________
"Kip is the Gavin McInnes of HC" - Salamandre
"Ashan to the Trashcan", "I got PTSD from H7. " - LizardWarrior

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted March 28, 2014 08:32 PM
Edited by Storm-Giant at 20:40, 28 Mar 2014.

Yeah, but that Hydra was snowing awesome ^^

(And in solo/offline play it didn't matter that much)
OhforfSake said:
You're not Spanish anymore. Now you're Dutch.

Because you say it.
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
kipshasz
kipshasz


Undefeatable Hero
Elvin's Darkside
posted March 28, 2014 08:59 PM

No forf, Storm_Giant is a chink. just look at his avatar.


I never played online decently except for LAN with friends. It felt a bit weak in SP as well IMO. Ice ruled, until all the ice immune creeps show up.
____________
"Kip is the Gavin McInnes of HC" - Salamandre
"Ashan to the Trashcan", "I got PTSD from H7. " - LizardWarrior

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted March 28, 2014 09:21 PM

I did wonder who that girl was
____________
Living time backwards

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted March 28, 2014 10:55 PM

kipshasz said:
No forf, Storm_Giant is a chink. just look at his avatar.

Racist! I'm gonna tell to a mod the-last-troll-out-there-in-the-wastelands
____________

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread » This thread is 28 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 ... 10 20 ... 24 25 26 27 28 · «PREV / NEXT»
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.1168 seconds