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| Thread: The Male Genital Mutilation Bill.... |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 · «PREV |
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GunFred
Supreme Hero
Sexy Manticore
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posted March 12, 2012 04:42 PM |
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Quote:
Infant dies from ritualistic circumcision.
Note to all aspiring child sex offenders: apparently it is legal for a man to put his mouth on a child's penis if he can prove it is part of a religious ceremony.
Oh my god!(Asha)... That is disgusting level max.
Circumcision is a barbaric and savage practice that I would only expect from a caribbean tribe of self mutilating cannibals. Is this really common in the US? How come parents would do this to their own child without the childs permission but not let the child get a tattoo or piercing of their own free will when they are older?
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted March 14, 2012 01:20 AM |
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Edited by baklava at 01:21, 14 Mar 2012.
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Quote:
a barbaric and savage practice that I would only expect from a caribbean tribe of self mutilating cannibals.
Someone's been reading a little too much Lovecraft.
Meanwhile in Haitian voodoo...
He is usually depicted with a top hat, black tuxedo, dark glasses (...) He is a sexual Loa, frequently represented by phallic symbols and is noted for disruption, obscenity, debauchery, and having a particular fondness for tobacco and rum. (...) He is notorious for his outrageous behavior, swearing continuously and making filthy jokes to the other spirits. He is married to another powerful spirit known as Maman Brigitte, but often chases after mortal women. He loves smoking and drinking and is rarely seen without a cigar in his mouth or a glass of rum in his bony fingers.
We have much to learn from these awesome, awesome people.
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"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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GunFred
Supreme Hero
Sexy Manticore
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posted March 14, 2012 10:12 AM |
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I have never read or cared for any Lovecraft or Cthulhu stuff but I apologise to all the caribbean self mutilating cannibals in this forum for calling your people barbaric and savage.
Funny thing that you would link to the wikipedia page of this Baron Samedi guy when I recently saw most of Live and let die(007). The Baron in the movie laughs so hilariously creepy.
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baklava
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
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posted March 14, 2012 12:59 PM |
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Edited by baklava at 12:59, 14 Mar 2012.
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You've never read Lovecraft? You should. It's a fun read.
No offense taken, by the way, since I'm not from the Caribbean myself. I'm a Serb. We mutilate other people and eat human flesh only on special occasions, such as the opening of the recent historical epic "In the land of blood and honey" and its upcoming sequel, "Serbs hitting babies with other babies in a concentration camp made out of human eyeballs".
I'm getting the feeling that we're straying off topic a bit, though.
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"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted March 14, 2012 01:28 PM |
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Edited by Corribus at 13:28, 14 Mar 2012.
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Yes, please, let's get back on the thread's topic of Male Genital Mutilation.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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GunFred
Supreme Hero
Sexy Manticore
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posted March 14, 2012 02:19 PM |
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Just great, now I have to add more things on my list of worries with solutions.
Old worries:
Global warming. Solution: Self sacrifice and diplomacy, starting with the richest nations
My own future and grades. Solution: Stop playing games.
Not enough time to play all the latest games Solution: Stop going to school.
Mass murdering atheist dictators(with nukes). Solution: Nuclear war.
Fanatical christian american politicians(with nukes). Solution: Pray.
Talibans(nukes coming soon...). Solution: Heads of 10 US presidents on silver plates.
Troublesome immigration management in my homeland. Solution: Even more troublesome racist politicians.
Even more troublesome racist politicians in my homeland. Solution: Remove freedom of speech.
Evil people. Solution: Other evil people.
People so stupid that they are evil. Solution: Knowledge .
Danish Invasion. Solution: Borrow nukes and turn Skåne into a wasteland.
Chinese overlords in the future. Solution: None
Wrong song to Eurovision song contest. Solution: Pray.
Westboro baptist church. Solution: Nukes and violence.
New worries:
Circumcision. Solution: Remove religious tolerance.
Not having read any Lovecraft stuff. Solution: Read Lovecraft stuff(not gonna).
Bloodthirsty Serbs. Solution: Ask Baklava for weaknesses
Writing off topic posts. Solution: Stop writing.
Voodo curses. Solution: Convert
This was the last off topic post, I promise.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted March 14, 2012 03:03 PM |
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Well, then, how does ejaculating on the baby NOW compare?
I mean, if my baby was in the hands of some religious nutcases and I had to pick one of those, I don't think I had a lot to chew about the decision...
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted August 28, 2012 02:38 AM |
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Clicky
Quote:
Scientific evidence shows that the health benefits of circumcising baby boys outweigh the risks, America's top pediatrics group said Monday.
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"Scientific research shows clearer health benefits to the procedure than had previously been demonstrated," said the group, which represents 60,000 pediatricians in the United States and Canada. It also said the health benefits are great enough for insurance coverage.
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"Scientific research shows clearer health benefits to the procedure than had previously been demonstrated. According to a systematic and critical review of the scientific literature, the health benefits of circumcision include lower risks of acquiring HIV, genital herpes, human papilloma virus and syphilis. Circumcision also lowers the risk of penile cancer over a lifetime; reduces the risk of cervical cancer in sexual partners, and lowers the risk of urinary tract infections in the first year of life," the group said.
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friendofgunnar
Honorable
Legendary Hero
able to speed up time
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posted August 28, 2012 06:49 AM |
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Hey Elodin, explain to me why people shouldn't be able to make that choice for themselves when they become adults.
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Steyn
Supreme Hero
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posted July 30, 2014 03:42 PM |
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted July 30, 2014 04:59 PM |
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Edited by artu at 17:01, 30 Jul 2014.
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Well, I've just read the whole thread and it felt like Elodin was back for a day. Loved how he responded to Bak's "freedom of religion is also freedom from religion" by saying "no, freedom OF religion IS NOT freedom FROM religion. Atheists don't have the right to drive down the streets and never see a church or church sign. Atheists don't have the right to walk through the shopping mall and never see someone wearing a religious article." Funny ol' times...
Anyway, I think it would be convenient to copy/paste the related posts from the feminism thread to here, that started out by comparing male and female circumcision:
Sal said:
Quote:
Females are protected by law from genital mutilation. Males are not.
If circumcision removed the head of your burrito, it would be punishable and banned from all modern societies, for sure.
JollyJoker said:
It's a "Religion trumps common sense" law. Actually circumcision is the visible sign of the bond of MALE Jews with Lord Jehovah.
I think, the stalwart Finns got circumcision finally prohibited. Germany made a move, but the Supreme Court said, sorry, religious practice, law is protecting it.
I think it's mutilation, but, who cares what I think.
Lexxan said:
female genital mutilation is different from male genital mutilation though. Usually, the clitoris is SEVERED OFF with a razor blade and then the vaginal lips are sewn shut with twine. FGM is unacceptable in Western Society, so it's always either done in a tribal context or clandestinely.
Meanwhile, male circumcision is MOSTLY done within a medical context and is therefore fairly safe if performed by a skilled physician. There's always a risk, I suppose. Personally, I am strongly opposed to male circumcision except for the few cases where it's actually medically beneficial - such as phimosis and infections. Regardless, you cannot compare MGM to FGM and rule them equal. The execution is different and much more dangerous and painful for women - hence why it's banned in most societies.
artu said:
Male circumcision is way more traditional and considered a routine by Jews and Muslims even if they are not strictly religious, it's kind of like baptism of Catholics. In Turkey, most secular people choose to do it in a hospital while the baby is very small, while religious ones go through with it by having a ceremony when the kid is around 7,8. None of my parents are religious so I was circumcised while I was a week old. All males of Muslim ethnicity I know of are circumcised, while a lot of them are not religious at all. I don't think there is a serious risk (although I'm sure there are exceptional cases) because all through these years I have never heard of anybody getting injured while getting circumcised.
mvassilev said:
Except that circumcision is itself an injury.
artu said:
I don't support it. I couldn't care less if the tradition died out. All I'm saying is, it is not something as dangerous and horrific as you guys imagine. I can relate to how hideous it must appear when you are not culturally used to it, like when I watch those Africans put a bone through their nostrils, I go "uuurgh" but they do it like cutting their finger nails. Or think of it like having your ear pierced, not much of a big deal is it, in terms of physical injury. It's not like they cut your balls off, it's just a very tiny little piece and looking at porn, there is no visually distinguishable difference between a circumcised and an uncircumcised penis.
Lexxan said:
There is. It's just a very subtle one.
veco said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwX5zfC0hgc
JollyJoker said:
Umm, you MIGHT use this as a pro-circumcision point in that sense that 14-year-olds (and older) might be confronted with that, allowing them a conscious decision for or against (and the decision against could be revised at any time), but it makes no sense to use this as a point in justifying circumcision for INFANTS.
Lexxan said:
Anyway, as i noted in the actual genital mutilation thread, research on the matter is streaked with bias and is best left taken with a huge grain of salt. pro-sources will interpret their research in a way so it suits their intentions and opinions and the exact same is true for the anti-sources as well. The actual truth is that the benefits of preventive infant male circ are minimal, and only have a benign effect in a small amount of medical conditions. Otherwise, it has no proven benefit and imo, shouldn't be done. Most intact men have no problems with their foreskins during their entire lifespan, so circ'ing infants as a precaution seems really silly to me. Educating would-be parents and children alike on personal hygene would be more poignant in this case.
Female circumcision on the other hand... no, there's no way to justify it, or even equalize it with male circ. Part of why i know so much about this subject is because I saw a documentary on female circumcision during a high school morals class. The documentary followed an eight-year old girl from a sub-saharan country (i believe it was Niger, but don't quote me on that) as she was going to be circumcised before entering an arranged marriage with a sixty year old man. They censored the procedure itself, but i still remember the screams of the girl as they cut away half her genitalia with a rusty razor. The wailing, my god. It was bone-chilling.
Ever since then, i've looked up why it was necessary and found out it actually has no use. By consequence, I also found out that the usefulness of male circumcision is desputable at best. I don't approve of both and never would circumcise my son UNLESS it would cause him active harm if the procedure wasn't done. Even then, it's not my penis, so I feel I don't have a right on deciding what my son's body should look like.
However, male circ is nowadays done in hospitals and hygenic, medical environments. Even then, the procedure is relatively minor. Female circumcision is another story. First off, it's outlawed because it is ACTUAL MUTILATION THAT CUTS AWAY HALF A WOMAN'S GENITALIA. Secondly, because it's done clandestinely, it's hardly ever done in a medical environment, without a doctor or a physician doing it, which also makes it a lot more hazardous. As i said before, comparing them is simply ludicrous. Female circumcision is nothing short of torture and child-abuse.
artu said:
There is a genital mutilation thread? LOL. Anyway, with male cicumcision, it all comes down to this: Considering there are around 1.6 billion Muslims in the world (+ around 13.5 million Jews), half of them male, if it caused any serious threat in general, we'd know and vice versa for benefits. Both the positive and negative effects of circumcision is not drastic enough to determine anything. It exists because it is a deeply rooted, religion based tradition. On principle, you shouldn't be able to decide such a thing for an infant, hey, I think you shouldn't even impose any dogma itself, until they are around 15 or later but that's me. However, the effects being so insignificant (imagine it was a religious ritual to have your ear pierced) and the tradition being so normative, people will keep on doing it and it wont be outlawed. (Just like, on principle, women should be able to walk around topless but they cant and the laws regarding that wont change because the norm is overwhelmingly built-in). Since, there are no significant negative effects for this norm to be abandoned through social reaction that evolves against it, it will stick around until some centuries later, the religions themselves become obsolete.
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