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Heroes Community > Heroes 7+ Altar of Wishes > Thread: I really hope for a fast patch
Thread: I really hope for a fast patch This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted July 01, 2011 07:20 PM bonus applied by alcibiades on 12 Jul 2011.
Edited by Doomforge at 19:30, 01 Jul 2011.

I really hope for a fast patch

I'm not trying to complain here, but the game is barely playable at the moment. In fact, it isn't. So far the problems are:

- Massive crashfest... crashes when I alt-tab, crashes when I get mail, crashes when somebody sends me a message on a communicator, crashes when I click too fast, crashes when I click at the fraps-induced FPS
count, oh and yeah, crashes randomly too whenever it feels like it.

- I still don't get what destructive magic is for, I'm dry after a few casts, and staying in town didn't refill my mana (wtf?) plus there's no well on broken alliance map anywhere near starting positions of human players -> wee, I have 0/200 mana and a useless hero...

- As we already know, elites suck, and champions are a joke except few. Built 6 sun crusaders and they kill three ravenous ghouls... while my 40 marksmen kills twice that much. Whee.

- Abilities don't work. Upgraded kappa's ability doesn't have the described 3x3 effect and doesn't get stronger depending on distance (like the tooltip hints) - it also does strangely low damage for neutral kappas (bug?). Jousting doesn't work altogether (but the no-retal bonus of Sun Crusaders fortunately applies)

- Wtf is with Sanctuary's racial, +7 DEF and +7 Magic DEF for free every turn? Ain't that a bit too much? it's +14 to attributes, ffs... a relic-class artifact doesn't give that much.

- whee, I always wanted to get 2 extra points of movement from logistics (so, you know, I can get that 1 tile further... -_-)

- I don't like the fact that some factions have awesome healing and other get snow. Inferno can't even heal, not that inferno is good in the first place.

- after killing 15 jaguar warriors with 20 kappas+20 maidens I'm not sure whether santuary is that good in creeping or is the elite tier that gimped.

- What on earth is with the dwellings' costs? Mainly: champions? for that much of gold I can get bajillion cores which will give me like ten times more than a single champion unit.

- External core dwellings: please, Ubi, please, FIX THEM. It shifts the game even further towards core units... as if they aren't OP already. Double population of already dominant tier = lol.

- One more random crash, and I'm throwing my PC out the window.

- Skill balance is a total mess, there's a lot but most sadly SUCK. Similarly, spells.

- A level 30 hero's implosion, assuming no artifacts, does around 1k damage, which kills 28 preatorians. What the hell? By the time your hero gets to equivalent of naked Level 30 hero's spellpower (through artifacts, let's say) you would have like 1000 of them.

- the worst thing that can happen to you while creeping is "horde/throng" of low level creatures. Contrary to previous five games where this was the best thing to see.

- 15-20 elites pose no danger, unless they are kenseis.

- Dreamwalkers will waste like five turns casting their special on you that does nothing if you don't move. Hint: use shooters and slaughter them like pigs for easy exp.

- To get 1st level of blood/tears effect (which boosts your racial and corresponding skills) you'd have to let 50 stacks to run away from you or pursue 100. Great job, Ubi... seriously? I haven't found any other way to boost reputation so far.

- who got the smart idea to make Sanctuary hero like Jesus? Walking on water... yeah sure, balance of water maps just went overboard.

Gee... it shouldn't be called beta, the game is totally alpha ;p



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Mitzah
Mitzah


Promising
Supreme Hero
of the Horadrim
posted July 01, 2011 08:13 PM

So the game's about 9 weeks away from release and still has many problems. Is it possible this isn't the latest build? Cause if not, it'll need several patches until it becomes decent.

You should post this on the official Ubi forums. Maybe they'll take a look.
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LizardWarrior
LizardWarrior


Honorable
Legendary Hero
the reckoning is at hand
posted July 01, 2011 08:14 PM

I haven't played the beta,but from screenshots and other members reports I agree with you,differences between cores hp and elites/champions damage are huge.Also core troops seems to be overpowered compared with elites/champions,in previous heroes a 7th tier could kill dozens of 1st/2nd tiers.

Growth of cores should be halved or elites/champions growth should be doubled.
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mike80d
mike80d


Famous Hero
Map Maker
posted July 01, 2011 08:25 PM

It seems that if they balanced the Core vs Elite vs Champion better it would resolve over 50% of your issues.

And I'm guessing that creature balance is something that's pretty easy to do from a programming standpoint.  It may take a few iterations, but it seems very do-able over the next few weeks.  

Overall scaling is what needs 90% of the fixing.  That's a pretty good sign.

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Zenofex
Zenofex


Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
posted July 01, 2011 08:40 PM

Quote:
Growth of cores should be halved or elites/champions growth should be doubled.
Growth adjustment will not fix the problem. The Elites by no means feel like Elites and the Champions... well, the top tiers have never been so helpless on their own. The stats and the abilities need to me modified - A LOT!

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DIEGIS
DIEGIS


Supreme Hero
power of Zamolxis
posted July 01, 2011 08:44 PM
Edited by DIEGIS at 20:44, 01 Jul 2011.

+ some spells aint work at all, or the game crash when use them
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SwampLord
SwampLord


Supreme Hero
Lord of the Swamp
posted July 01, 2011 08:46 PM

Quote:
Quote:
Growth of cores should be halved or elites/champions growth should be doubled.
Growth adjustment will not fix the problem. The Elites by no means feel like Elites and the Champions... well, the top tiers have never been so helpless on their own. The stats and the abilities need to me modified - A LOT!


Agreed. It seems they corrected the wrong areas in attempting to make lower-level units relevant at all points throughout the game.

This should be done by dint of abilities, and not by sheer raw HP. For example, take Crossbowmen, Wind Dancers or Goblin Witch Doctors in HV. All managed to play a useful role even in late-game mass battles, due to the way their abilities worked.

Cores don't need their (currently absurd) HP pools to be relevant, just give them good abilities and they will be used.
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Fauch
Fauch


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted July 01, 2011 11:04 PM

goblins witch doctor? by allowing the enemy hero to cast a 2nd spell on them for free?

maybe it is the new attack / defense system. before, a weekly growth of tier 7 didn't necessarily had more HPs or more damage than a weekly growth of tier 1, but they had much higher attack and defense.

now the percentage of reduction is fixed, while it should be higher, the lower the level (or the attack) of the attacker is.

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MrDragon
MrDragon


Supreme Hero
Eats people with Ketchup
posted July 01, 2011 11:29 PM

Wait sacntuary heroes can walk on water?!

Dude.... the Broken Alliance map has a extremely easily rushable town in the bottom right of the map only reachable by water, if there's no AI in that slot it's a free champion dwelling, town, 2 goldmines, a crystal mine and various other goodies.

There's also no ore/lumber on that island, so unless the AI cheats it's ore and lumber at has no easy way to build more then a handful of buildings early, and as you mentioned, champions aren't that threatening.
First Human player to reach and claim it gets a rediculous lead.

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted July 02, 2011 12:34 PM

Quote:
Wait sacntuary heroes can walk on water?!


If your army is composed of Sanctuary creatures, yes. Which means "water maps" with little islands will be seeing Sanctuary only.

Since my friend and I are testing, and not playing to win, we're not abusing the benefits of capturing a powerful town or too many external dwellings to have a balanced background, though
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Mitzah
Mitzah


Promising
Supreme Hero
of the Horadrim
posted July 02, 2011 12:41 PM

Tell me at least that Sanctuary heroes who walk on water have reduced movement or something.
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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted July 02, 2011 12:45 PM

I'm afraid not. They made quite a big focus on this feature in Sanctuary campaign, too.
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Fauch
Fauch


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted July 02, 2011 01:20 PM

lol? what next, a hero who can fly? a hero who starts the game with dimension door?

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Nirual
Nirual


Famous Hero
Imbued Ballista
posted July 02, 2011 01:30 PM

Yeah I didnt get that either. It's fine for campaigns, but for multiplayer its a pretty huge advantage no other faction seems to get.
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alcibiades
alcibiades


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
of Gold Dragons
posted July 02, 2011 02:05 PM

Yeah, the water walking Sanctuary heroes reek imba. If at least the hero could not end his turn on water, it would only have limited (albeit still good) usage, but as it is, it just seems imbalanced - particularly since this "feature" comes only to this faction - i.e. the other factions have no "special mount features" that I noticed.

Quote:
Quote:
Growth of cores should be halved or elites/champions growth should be doubled.
Growth adjustment will not fix the problem. The Elites by no means feel like Elites and the Champions... well, the top tiers have never been so helpless on their own. The stats and the abilities need to me modified - A LOT!

Ironically, the tier system sort of succeeded itself to death. The idea looks good on paper, but in reality what we have now is not level 1-2-3-4-5-6-7 but more like level 3-3-3-5-5-7. Even without the Champions being way underpowered, having that many decent low-level units necessarily means you won't have the same incentive to go for high levels.

Cores should be more similar to old level 2 creatures, whereas in beta they are more like level 3 or even level 3.5. Compare Marksman health in H5 (10) to H6 (30) and Squire H5 (26) to Praetorian H6 (35) or Skeleton H5 (5) to H6 (24) and Spectre H5 (19) to H6 (28) to see the massive shift.

In contrary, Elite health (which ranges from 70-100) is only slightly higher than old level 5 creatures and lower than the majority of level 6 creatures.
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conqr
conqr


Adventuring Hero
posted July 02, 2011 08:07 PM

Hi to all!

"Growth of cores should be halved or elites/champions growth should be doubled."

Can someone tell me the growth of the champion units in the public beta (in a fully upgraded town). Are they the same as in the closed one?

If i remember well u could get for example 6 Kirins, and 4 Seraphs in a week.. is this the same in the public beta?


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Warmonger
Warmonger


Promising
Legendary Hero
fallen artist
posted July 02, 2011 08:55 PM

Sometimes I can watch computer opponents fighthing neutrals in towns or arenas. Moreover, arenas can be visited any numbe rof times so I'm just waiting for the AI to finish farming 30+ might attack with no casualities at all.
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Lichking012
Lichking012


Known Hero
posted July 02, 2011 09:12 PM
Edited by Lichking012 at 21:28, 02 Jul 2011.

It seems to me that most of the issues are simple number balancing issues, slightly lower growth hear, up states there, lower or raise cost here or there. Side note, anyone try any modding of basic stat values yet?

Except Sanctuary's mounts. Although, if boats don't have a turn penalty to get in and out of, i.e., you can move, build a boat, get in it, and be on your merry way all in the same turn, I don't see this as hugely game breaking.

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MrDragon
MrDragon


Supreme Hero
Eats people with Ketchup
posted July 02, 2011 11:58 PM

Quote:
It seems to me that most of the issues are simple number balancing issues, slightly lower growth hear, up states there, lower or raise cost here or there. Side note, anyone try any modding of basic stat values yet?

Except Sanctuary's mounts. Although, if boats don't have a turn penalty to get in and out of, i.e., you can move, build a boat, get in it, and be on your merry way all in the same turn, I don't see this as hugely game breaking.


The issue is that Shipyards are usually guarded by mid-game strength stacks, non-sanctuary heroes get a major mobility advantage and early access to water treaure chests, debris and other water features, not to mention islands laden with resources.

Also, imagine the following scenario, your hero (non sanctuary army), you picked up logistics and boots of travel, so your powerful hero can catch enemy heroes.
Provided there is a body of water of at least 3X3 nearby, a Sanctuary army can just flee to the water, and unless you happen to have a shipyard or boat nearby, you cannot catch him.
Heck, on Broken Alliances, you could just place a sanctuary hero off shore from a town, ready to jump it within two turns when nobody is around, or mines etc.
If an enemy comes along, and he's stronger, just flee to sea.
Worse yet, the rush distance for a Sanctuary hero on maps with water (like Broken Alliances) is both shorter and only usable by you.

I can keep going, the amount of scenario's where this would be beyond broken is endless.
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Citadel: 7/7 creatures, 2/2 hero base classes. (complete, for now)

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Brukernavn
Brukernavn

Hero of Order
posted July 03, 2011 12:22 AM

Sanctuary's water walk is just ridiculous. But I'm totally baffled that it's an important part of their campaign. That means it's not just a stupid mistake, but it's a planned stupid mistake...

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