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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 14, 2012 11:59 PM |
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Edited by salubri at 14:28, 15 Dec 2012.
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Is it possible to add one new artifact? Ive always dreamed of having Sword of Frost. Remembered that H4 intro and thought if its possible to add new creatures or artifacts so why not add the original one that never saw the daylight. Two most devastating artifacts in game should be more than enough to drive Forge forces back to Deyia.
Campaign: forces of Deyia invade Erathia and Tularean forest (they are weakened, because of conflict between) Erathia is in ruins. Little groups from Forge faction and technology is too strong for its massive army. Numbers are nothing before its might and Roland with his wife are fleeing. Tularean forest survives the siege because of Gelu's Armageddons Blade. Forces of Deyia advance to south. Krewlod is in danger. Kilgor sets of to Vori for legendary Sword of Frost. Gelu's forces retreat to Avlee (forces of Deyia after long siege take over Tularean forest). After a long search Kilgor finds the sword and sends a messenger to Avlee. Kastore continues to make weapons with heavenly forge. Army numbers aren't great, but they use fallen soldiers in the battlefields to produce more. Now from little groups they grow into average army and Dark Shade invades Avlee. Krewlod is being ravaged by advancing Deyia's army. Roland tries to rally the remaining barbarian forces and flee to Bracada while Caterine rushes there to seek aid. There Caterine meets up with Dracon and they start building forces (training Enchanters, making Crystal dragons). Meanwhile a messenger arrives to Avlee and informs Gelu and Adrienne of Kilgor's plan to survive until he gets there with his sword (together 3 legendary heroes armed with legendary artifacts and a Fire Magic expetise can win this battle). The battle starts. Together Gelu and Adrienne unleash twice as many armageddons because AB protects their armies from harm. None of the faction is winning and none is losing, but then at the peak of the battle Kilgor arrives and casts snowstorms which damage and freeze enemies. Seeing this weak point Gelu cast's armageddon which is shattering frozen enemies while Adrienne is finishing them with infernos and fireballs. Dark Shade dies in a duel with Kilgor. There is almost no enemy survivors so the remaining flee to Deyia to report this situation. After the fierce battle the 3 heroes rest and rally the remaining forces. Meanwhile Roland, Caterine and Dracon prepare for battle. Maximus is expert with new creatures and technologies so he unleashes hell on combined barbarian and wizzards armies. Enchanters and Crystal dragons are the only ones who can hold out, but it seems like the good guys are loosing this battle and there will be no enemies left for Forge faction in south after this. Looks like lady luck shines for our heroes today. A messenger arrives and informs Maximus about tragic battle in Avlee and he is forced by Kastore's command to retreat. While lying seriously injured by Maximus in a duel Dracon hears what the messenger says and after battle uses lloyd's beacon with Caterine and Roland to Avlee. All 6 heroes meet and arrange a strategy to destroy the Forge. Kastore makes the best defences that technology can offer, recalls armies from north and south and builds forces for Deyia's siege. After few weeks all 7 heroes meet at the borders of Deyia. Why 7? Roland asks for his brother to help in this epic battle. And so it starts. It seems only armies with Gelu and Kilgor combined are able to do damage, but the rest are falling to the supreme tactics that Maximus has prepared and the power that his units offer. Armies split. Caterine, Roland, Dracon and Archibald are fighting Maximus and Gelu with Kilgor are aiming for Kastore. Only Archibalds necromancy keeps this part of battle running (as he rises falled soldiers back for fight) so Maximus atacks him. Deadly wounded by Maximus blaster Archibald charges into his chainsaw.
Maximus : ha ha youre dead
Archibald penetrated by chainsaw : u forget that im a master necromancer (and casts sharp metal, since its minimal distance all shards pierce through Maximus body killing him)
Roland rushes to his brother.
Roland : why brother why so recklesly?
Archibald dying : well i was dying anyway and i thought and im not dying alone.
He takes out a lich jar and some scroll. gives it to Roland.
Archibald : after this battle is over ask my friend what to do with the jar and take this scroll to Adrienne just in case. We will meet again (and dies with a smile)
Without hero Maximus armies lose control and the tide of battle changes. Meawhile Armageddons Blade and The Sword of Frost cut through Kastores defences. Seeing that this is only a matter of time Kastore sets Heavenly Forge for self-destruct. Gelu and Kilgor invade his lair.
Kastore : my plan was perfect, but since im new to this world i never knew that a second sword of legendary power egxisted.
Kilgor : this is the end. many of my people died because of you now the time has come to pay the price.
Kastore : i wanted to make this world a better place. all your people are so primitive. i wanted to introduce new technology to the world to advance from this primitive barbaric state to unite this world into one so that there would be be no wars or conflicts. one world one king.
Gelu : yeah one tyrant. and to make everyone into abominations... the undead were freaks, but these new creatures are beyond discusting.
The rest of the heroes arrive.
Caterine : its over Kastore your armies are now no match without their leaders and are shaterred.
Kastore : well all are in one place. armies of my enemies and their leaders. soon Heavenly Force will detonate and destroy everything in a very big radius. Ha ha ha...
Adrienne : and wrong again. Archibald gave me this scroll its callled The Ritual of the Void. before battle he told me the story of how the whole planet was saved from explosion that Kreegan spaceship caused.
he knew that with this technology everything is possible so he made this scroll just in case.
Adrienne starts casting a spell. Kastore shots his blaster riffle. Roland uses his body to protect her and wounded falls to the ground. Heroes defend Adrienne while she casts a spell with their bodies cause its impossible to parry very fast shots. Lastly Gelu falls seriously wounded.
Kastore : bye bye witch (aiming for her heart) ZAP
Adrienne falls bleeding.
Kastore : i win ha ha ha...
Adrienne while lying on the ground : and wrong again (casts The Ritual of The Void. Heavenly Forge with Kastore explodes somwhere in space)
Adrienne : u forgot that im Master of Fire and flames protect me.
Wounded Caterine : oh and i thought it was all over.
Adrienne : me too but the flame barrier and shield protected me from lethal wound.
Wounded Roland : hey Dracon i hope u know a good healing spell.
Wounded Dracon : just a 100 gold for u friend
All Heroes : YOU B A S T A R D HA HA HA
The End.
P.S. its not like im saying to make that kind of campaign its just that i wanted to write this story. got an inspiration. hope u enjoy or maybe not? just wanted to share a story. ignore the mistakes if there are any.
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Ivan
Known Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 12:02 AM |
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Edited by Ivan at 00:05, 15 Dec 2012.
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You're right, though, at first glance, it's almost identical to the color of their skin. Nevertheless, the point regarding hipocrisy still stands 
In regards to the new lineup, the reason for the change is truly beyond me, but, as I said, their work with Cove has made them worthy of trust, regardless of the changes some of us might disagree with.
It's only sad that the Cove 1.2 version is being worked on, while there's still no mention of an English version and it's not like translating an already existing version could possibly be harder than making a new one. Not all of us speak Russian 
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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 12:07 AM |
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what does this have to do with the Tanks? They're level 6
They're not. HotA Crew decided to have line up something like this:
1.Pyros
2.Goblins
3.Cyborgs
4.Ogres
5.something (I'm not sure if it has been revealed or not)
6.Minotaurs
7."Tanks" (or whatever it will be)
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The H3 Medusae were also naked
They weren't. They had some kind of "bra".
I dont mind if u change looks a bit but WHY? WHY the F... change the order HUH? Mother F.... this is BullSh... Leave the F... order original. Changing units a bit (mmm ok i can swallow that) adding new buildings (well they dont change town screen much so its ok) concept art blacksmith thats a  but changing lvs of units thats heresy.
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Hobbit
Supreme Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 01:36 AM |
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WHY the F... change the order HUH?
Because calling someone motherf***er isn't going to change his concept.
____________
Horn of the
Abyss on AcidCave
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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 11:46 AM |
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Edited by salubri at 12:28, 15 Dec 2012.
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Quote:
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WHY the F... change the order HUH?
Because calling someone motherf***er isn't going to change his concept.
Im not calling someone motherf... its just a curse word because im angry. this stuff destroys forge. im not complaining about Cove. cause its totally new town so everything is possible, but we know so much about the forge and this remaking of so many things is herecy. I want it to be as original as it can be according to the data that 3do left (we have town screen files and the only thing left to add is oil pump. and there u have it. minimum work with towncreen. there are numerous websites who show what and which lv creature is in the town. there are even images of low lv creatures showing how they look. so that makes it much easier and less work. just add siege screen, and think of a few creatures which arent shown anywhere and have only descriptions how they are suppost to look.) but no, lets work work work and remake everything cause we like to work a lot. i want u guys to have less work cause its time consuming. anyway changing the order of units is bad. ill say it again. i want it to be as original as it can be from the data scraps that we have. man this town is like 50% or more already made and just finish it. u dont need to think (maybe add this or maybe add that) no. u have that data the information just add it and its done. why waste time on many new things? dude its time consuming.
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don_komandorr
Known Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 12:19 PM |
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We know almost nothing about Forge.
only in-game look (probably just drafts) of first 3 creatures (and our versions are very close to them. Pyro and goblin are perfect examples)
We have Stingers being pretty close to the concept too.
THEN jump-troopers. Nothing is known apart it's minos on jetpacks. Well, they will be.
Tank - the artwork was never accepted as final. So there was a chance that even original Forge will not have Tank in it's lineup.
7th tier creature - nothing known about.
So our lineup follows original idea in a scale of well-known information.
and finally, goblins are lvl 2 instead of 1, cyborgs are 3 instead of 2 and minos are 6 instead of 5 simply because it makes "arrow vs rocket" paradox disappear. You can't now say "WTF Why goblin with melee weapon and goblin with blaster are of the same strength?!". Forge-upgraded creatures of other castles are all level-upped.
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hobbit
Supreme Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 12:55 PM |
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Im not calling someone motherf... its just a curse word because im angry.
It's stupid to put such word with no explanation whatsoever in a f***in' Forge topic, you know?
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this remaking of so many things is herecy.
Yeah, and it also is unnatural, takes away our jobs and prays Satan.
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minimum work with towncreen.
For me, this leaked alpha townscreen is ugly. And so for KomandoRR, I believe. And that's the reason to upgrade it. Of course you can think it's pretty, but since you're not modmaker, I'm afraid there's nothinf you can change.
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there are numerous websites who show what and which lv creature is in the town
About websites.. Tell me: how do you know these aren't just some thoughts about how would it PROBABLY look if NWC released Forge? As KomandoRR stated, there's nothing much about final things. Hell, even NWC members said a lot of different things about Forge. So why these websites are some kind of Oracles?
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anyway changing the order of units is bad.
Why? Is there any reason other than "I want"?
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dude its time consuming
Quality over... uhh... "speedity".
____________
Horn of the
Abyss on AcidCave
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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 01:27 PM |
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Quote:
We know almost nothing about Forge.
only in-game look (probably just drafts) of first 3 creatures (and our versions are very close to them. Pyro and goblin are perfect examples)
We have Stingers being pretty close to the concept too.
THEN jump-troopers. Nothing is known apart it's minos on jetpacks. Well, they will be.
Tank - the artwork was never accepted as final. So there was a chance that even original Forge will not have Tank in it's lineup.
7th tier creature - nothing known about.
So our lineup follows original idea in a scale of well-known information.
and finally, goblins are lvl 2 instead of 1, cyborgs are 3 instead of 2 and minos are 6 instead of 5 simply because it makes "arrow vs rocket" paradox disappear. You can't now say "WTF Why goblin with melee weapon and goblin with blaster are of the same strength?!". Forge-upgraded creatures of other castles are all level-upped.
How do we know almost nothing about the forge? we know the buildings and their functions except tesla coil and oil pump. we know that forge creatures are strongest in game and produced in very low numbers for very big price. forge was suppost to be campaign only town with very powerful creatures like naga tanks as strong as archangels, but since u are making it normal town so their power will decrease. but still i want it to have most powerfull creatures (lets say naga queen and dread knight are most powerful lv 6 creatures and that orge shaman that barbarians have is way too strong for its lv. so what im saying make it a little bit stronger a little bit more hp or defence than other same lv creatures but just a little. the balance is the price and growth. someone says: oh they have the power and mage guild lv5? i say : dude youre playing with FORGE, they are more advanced that u barbarians.
ok lets have a look at creatures.
WTF Why goblin with melee weapon and goblin with blaster are of the same strength? who said they have the same strength? barbarian goblins are produced in very high numbers its like those pixies in conflux (damn their growth is huge) while forge goblins are produced in low numbers for balance. (think about it. produce barbarian goblin. give him a mace and he is ready to go. produce forge goblin. make him armor, make him that backpack, give him a dagger, make a blaster, make a helmet. makes sence right? upgraded version. barbarian goblin. give him a helmet and some chest protection and a mace. forge goblin. same as before but make even better armor, better helmet, better backpack and take away dagger and blaster, give blaster riffle.)
well tank artwork was never accepted as final because of CANCEL. some said that dwarf in concept art had a sword. in game he has axe. well? weapon changed but its still a melee weapon. so naga tank instead of smg go for blasters its still ranged weapon.
arrow vs rocket paradox? what is that? u mean same lv creatures different weapons but same dmg? NAH. rocket dmg is better but there are much less dudes with rockets. ill say it again. forge creatures are stronger but are produced in LOWER NUMBERS for a HUGE PRICE. making them as strong as other town creatures doesnt make any sence. dude they have the technology. u played MM7? man i was killing wawes of titans with blaster riffles. im not saying making creatures that strong but just a little stronger than others.
Lv 7 creature nothing known? Pure mechanical, huge, melee and it is flying. why flying? http://mightandmagic.wikia.com/wiki/Forge_(town) look at the runway and minotaur generator. in town files minotaur generator is named as juggernaut dweling but here its the oposite. my point is that both buildings are for flying units. either juggernauts fly from the roof that opens or fly away from Runway. well thats a little bit of information for u 
more information. at least we know 3 forge heroes. Kastore, Maximus, Dark Shade. Boragus was suppost to be forge hero but since they cancelled town he was made into barbarian. so u can add him. ignoring AB campaign or resurecting him as half machine
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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 01:38 PM |
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For me, this leaked alpha townscreen is ugly. And so for KomandoRR, I believe. And that's the reason to upgrade it.
Its forge its suppost to be ugly all the toxins and garbage and chaos nobody cares there about the beauty only about the effectivness if its ugly change the Dungeon town screen cause that one is ugly.
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hobbit
Supreme Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 03:03 PM |
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we know that forge creatures are strongest in game and produced in very low numbers for very big price
[...]
Lv 7 creature nothing known? Pure mechanical, huge, melee
From WHERE do you know that?
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oh they have the power and mage guild lv5?
Mage guild had 3 levels and NOTHING will change it, even leaked defs. It looks like it has 3 levels and it makes much sense while it's rather technological town where these all Heavenly Forge inventions have the same effect as magic. Also, level 4 and 5 mage guild upgrades make no sense at all.
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who said they have the same strength?
Two creatures on the same level are rather similar strength. While you said that blasters are superstrong, goblin witb blaster fits 2nd level units (like gogs) better.
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well tank artwork was never accepted as final because of CANCEL
There were many cancelled Forge concepts. One of them, e.g., is a town based on Verne's books. They were thinking about it just before cancelling the project. So no, there's no reason to stubborn with one concept art.
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some said that dwarf in concept art had a sword. in game he has axe. well? weapon changed but its still a melee weapon.
Behemoth a.k.a. scorpion from early Stronghold concepts.
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making them as strong as other town creatures doesnt make any sence.
Yes it does. And that's where you fail at understanding Kastore's power and the meaning of MM7 bad ending.
Forge isn't all about super power. It's about giving regular troops a technology so that they would be better - as these more elite units. While doing so, these blasters cost NONE. Well, almost. Just look how many did Kastore produce "just like that". So I think Forge's power was supposed to be opposite to what you're saying - it could make these more common creatures (like minotaurs) as strong as these less common with little price.
Imagine how terrifying is the picture of common naga as strong as dragons, yet pretty cheap. Scary, huh?
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if its ugly change the Dungeon town screen cause that one is ugly.
While I think Dungeon could have some improvements (like blacksmith), I think you misunderstood two things:
1. Nobody wants to make Forge look completely different
2. Dungeon IS in the final release of the game, while Forge ISN'T.
Quote:
I want
They don't want. And they won't change it because you want. Get it?
____________
Horn of the
Abyss on AcidCave
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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 03:59 PM |
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Edited by salubri at 16:42, 15 Dec 2012.
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Oh just read this
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com/heroes3ab/forgetown.shtml
and this
http://mightandmagic.wikia.com/wiki/Forge_(town)
both sites say forge units are much more powerful than any other factions. but produced in low numbers. forge can make cheap blasters but its not the only thing this town needs. units are wired with technology and it takes time to construct it. remember there is only one heavenly forge and it cant satisfy needs of the whole army instantly. we are talking here middle ages vs modern times. someone compared fireball to a rocket blast. gogs arent mages and fireball is a spell so it pretty weak. look at the grail screen. its obvious that Mutare Drake was suppost to lead armies of dragons against the forge because of its might.
According to a New World Computing representative, Forge units were to be, individually, the strongest in the game - though highly overpowered (with units stronger than Archangels), would be produced in low numbers and cost far more materials (even some non-7th tiers apparently costing precious resources) im not saying to make them that strong but just a little stronger.
From WHERE do you know that? 7v creature. look at the both websites. and because of buildings that i said earlier it is a flyer. If Kastore knows how to pilot a spaceship and how to build technology for forge then why not to have a huge mechanical flying unit?
lets compare lv1 units. sprite is the worst of worst while halberdier is the best. in terms of power he is 3 times stronger. but they cost more and are produced in lower numbers. and no one is talking about them being 3 times stronger. so what im saying do the same with forge. take the strongest creature of all factions. see his stats and give the new forge creature a little bit higher stats for higher price and growth reduction. so if he has 6 atack 5 defence 2-3 dmg 10 hp and 5 speed. u can give goblin 12 atack (blasters kick a s s) 7 defence 3-5 dmg 18 hp and 4 speed because of his inventory he is slow.
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Hobbit
Supreme Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 04:39 PM |
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Quote:
Oh just read this
http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com/heroes3ab/forgetown.shtml
and this
http://mightandmagic.wikia.com/wiki/Forge_(town)
Both of these sites use the same source, which is this very old site. Acid Dragon, author of this article, stated that these facts were actually more or less guesses while the Forge wasn't really finished.
But ok, Might and Magic Wiki had some sources. Let's find out what they say:
Quote:
The advanced units will all be built in the newest city type, the Forge, and accompanied by two new hero classes: the Technician and the Cyborg. However, the representative I spoke with said that these units will be far from first level units. Instead they will be the toughest units in the game, with the highest level units being tougher than the Archangel. However, once all of the play balancing is in place, the cost of building and maintaining these units will insure that they don't completely dominate the battlefield.
While it's not very a good proof due to lack of details and the fact that the author was talking with "some 3DO representative", I guess it can be taken as a good point. But read carefully - what does it really mean: "the cost of building and maintaining these units". It doesn't really fits with the game mechanics and even if it can be interpreted as "the cost of buildings and the cost of units will be high", I believe it's rather about building the city itself, not about units. Besides - the MM story, as I said earlier, doesn't really fit in this statement.
Besides - "the highest level units being tougher than the Archangel" don't mean that every unit would be better from the rest.
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forge can make cheap blasters but its not the only thing this town needs. units are wired with technology and it takes time to construct it.
Exactly! And that's what I think it's about - the town takes much time to build, but once you have it, you don't have to be worried of costs anymore.
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remember there is only one heavenly forge and it cant satisfy needs of the whole army instantly.
Not instantly, but if Kastore can make one blaster in a second, then does it really take so long to create anything else from the Forge?
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look at the grail screen. its obvious that Mutare Drake was suppost to lead armies of dragons against the forge because of its might.
...what? Where did you find such an info?
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look at the both websites.
There's nothing about 7 lvl being pure mechanical, huge and melee.
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If Kastore knows how to pilot a spaceship and how to build technology for forge then why not to have a huge mechanical flying unit?
"Why not" is not really a good point in such discussion, you know that? 
And there's one main thing about your complaints which I think you do not understand, so I will say you again:
This is fans' work.
They want to change something because they think it would just look better and the gameplay would be better. They want Forge to be just a playable town, fitting to the Heroes 3 spirit. And that's ok, there's no need to be arguing about it. Especially if you're saying "I want it such and such". Believe me - it doesn't work like that.
____________
Horn of the
Abyss on AcidCave
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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 04:48 PM |
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Edited by salubri at 17:04, 15 Dec 2012.
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http://mightandmagic.wikia.com/wiki/Forge_(town)
just go here at. look down. puzze map. dragons destroying the forge.
The advanced units will all be built in the newest city type, the Forge, and accompanied by two new hero classes: the Technician and the Cyborg. However, the representative I spoke with said that these units will be far from first level units. Instead they will be the toughest units in the game, with the highest level units being tougher than the Archangel. However, once all of the play balancing is in place, the cost of building and maintaining these units will insure that they don't completely dominate the battlefield.
ive never read this but its interesting. 4 ways to balance very powerful units. 1 cost of structures. 2 low growth. 3 high cost of units. 4 maintain. word MAINTAIN is an interesting idea. i think thats where oil pump comes in. they need oil to work and thats the maintain. it brings totally new gameplay like in H5 orcs with their RAGE (god i love that faction). intead of ammo cart there are a oil barrels. its like orcs they are powerful when in rage so maybe forge powerful too when there is enough oil but if they ran out of it maybe heroes move slower, units get debuffs and lose morale, not respond or something. that word MAINTAIN could bring the whole new gameplay. its like: yes ive finaly have one juggenaut now thats a beast but dear god it costs so much to maintain. that MAINTAIN thingy could make this town very interesting to play because of its unique economy.
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OxFEA
Promising
Famous Hero
feanor on DF2.ru
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posted December 15, 2012 05:02 PM |
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Edited by OxFEA at 17:05, 15 Dec 2012.
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Anyway, all debates about Forge are debates of IMHO's. But our opinion is stronger because we do something.
Quote:
http://mightandmagic.wikia.com/wiki/Forge_(town)
just go here at. look down. puzze map. dragons destroying the forge.
This puzzle map shows new AB features (forge, dragons, boars etc). It's not only-Forge puzzle, I think.
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that word MAINTAIN could bring the whole new gameplay.
use Occam's Razor.
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don_komandorr
Known Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 05:09 PM |
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And I clearly remember that the offical NWC statement was something like "all forge creatures are as strong as any other units on their tiers".
And in leaked town screen files there was a doc which says that pyros are Magogs with flamethrowers and there's a "rhino" on 7th tier, so what=?
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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 05:21 PM |
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there is so much info. so what will u do with the forge? what about units strengths? how many arhers, melee, flying? what will they look like? what will unique buildings like tesla coil and oil pump do?
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Hobbit
Supreme Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 05:24 PM |
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Edited by Hobbit at 17:24, 15 Dec 2012.
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all forge creatures are as strong as any other units on their tiers
Well, it's clearly stated here (translated version from Acid Cave). But there's a bad translation in "Forge with his power, would be a very strong castle". In original it's not about power - "uniwersalność" means rather "all-purpose".
____________
Horn of the
Abyss on AcidCave
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salubri
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 05:34 PM |
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Quote:
Quote:
all forge creatures are as strong as any other units on their tiers
Well, it's clearly stated here (translated version from Acid Cave). But there's a bad translation in "Forge with his power, would be a very strong castle". In original it's not about power - "uniwersalność" means rather "all-purpose".
YES even here it is stated that Juggernaut and Dreadnough could fly. it says MAYBE. but look at the dwellings. both Runway and Minotaur generator (in town files generator is named as juggenaut dwelling) clearly are made for flying units. Runway is like airport. i think there is more than we need evidence that lv 7 units are flying. it either flies from minotaur generator when roof opens or flies of the Runway.
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Hobbit
Supreme Hero
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posted December 15, 2012 05:41 PM |
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Yes, I undestand! I never said they couldn't fly - it really was a possibility! You don't have to say it in every post...
____________
Horn of the
Abyss on AcidCave
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Vade_Parvis
Known Hero
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posted December 16, 2012 02:06 AM |
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6 humanoids and 1 beast. (bear rider = tank)
 
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This thread is pages long: 
