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Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Favorite TV series
Thread: Favorite TV series This thread is 69 pages long: 1 10 ... 15 16 17 18 19 ... 20 30 40 50 60 69 · «PREV / NEXT»
OmegaDestroyer
OmegaDestroyer

Hero of Order
Fox or Chicken?
posted June 20, 2013 02:07 AM

Sad news for those of you who are fans of The Sopranos.

James Gandolfini dead at 51.
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The giant has awakened
You drink my blood and drown
Wrath and raving I will not stop
You'll never take me down

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 20, 2013 02:19 AM

Hmmm, it is sad to see a talented person die so young. Last I watched him in The Incredible Burt Wonderstone, it was an awful, stupid movie but he was doing his job fine as usual. What can you say, may he rest in peace.

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markkur
markkur


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted June 21, 2013 04:36 PM
Edited by markkur at 16:40, 21 Jun 2013.

@JJ

Quote:
Just watching, by the way, Simon Schama's A History of Britain


Just saw this. I've had this set for a few years and <imo>it's one of the best docs ever made however, last year, I read something a little disturbing about Schama and a new trend in teaching.

A history professor wrote a book about today's methods of teaching history and stated that professors have been adding opinion and "fancy" in and around historical-events, in an effort to make them more palatable.  Schama was listed as one of the professors that had started doing the same in his newer books.

That series was done on 2000 & 2001 so maybe the money and fame has got in the way since then.

Btw, @ all

Shaun the Sheep is the best series in history  

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted June 21, 2013 11:57 PM

Not that much fancy in the series. I thought it was rather accurate.

I'm not ashamed to admit, I've started to watch Spartacus: Blood and Sands.
Um, yeah, I think it's fun, mainly because it's  actually the way I imagine the time. It transports a lot and it's basically "fancy history".

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 22, 2013 12:20 AM
Edited by artu at 03:36, 22 Jun 2013.

I'd say treat it as pure fantasy to be able to enjoy it. Spartacus series has to do with history as much as the Ents has to do with botanics.

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markkur
markkur


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted June 22, 2013 03:27 AM
Edited by markkur at 15:40, 22 Jun 2013.

Quote:
Not that much fancy in the series. I thought it was rather accurate.


I agree, I've intensely studied UK history for about a decade now;  but there are a couple of spots where he does embellish a wee-bit for the "likely" drama that effect. As I said the book I read talks about a few of his later works.

On a side note: speaking of guesswork; I will guess that he and David Starkey may have had some argument about the famous quote from Henry the II concerning Thomas Beckett. In 2000 Schama says "and he does not say "will someone rid me of this turbulent priest but something much more sinister..." In 2005 Starkey covers the same thing topic on his Monarchy and still uses that accepted quote "will someone rid me of this turbulent priest" but adds..."or words to that effect".

@artu

Quote:
I'd say treat it as pure fantasy to be able to enjoy it.


So true, I have to make myself think that way 1st  or there will be zero  entertainment
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"Do your own research"

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Corribus
Corribus

Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
posted June 22, 2013 03:42 AM

Quote:
I'm not ashamed to admit, I've started to watch Spartacus: Blood and Sands.
Um, yeah, I think it's fun, mainly because it's  actually the way I imagine the time. It transports a lot and it's basically "fancy history".

I watched it all and I'm not ashamed either.  I loved the series, although the first season was the most superior.  It was surprisingly well done (minus the first episode).  Although, I didn't need to see so much sausage...
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted June 22, 2013 01:40 PM

I actually think that - what I've seen so far - the series is transporting a lot more real history than fantasy, because it does a lot to show how fundamentally different things were - had to be, actually.

In my mind, the "normal" way today is, you have an idea for a show, and then it's somewhat pimped up with "sex and violence".
With that show it would seem to have been different: "Can we make a show that doesn't need to be pimped up with s+v, but is s+v in the first place?"

The answer is obviously a resounding YES.

Now, the acting PERSONS, albeit some of them are "historical" are NOT what makes this interesting or accurate. You could have called the show just as well "Blood and Sands", give the main character a different name, change the city and so on, that wouldn't have made any difference at all.
No, it's the portraying of society, of the way people live, how natural nakedness and sex are dealt with, how brutally direct LANGUAGE is; how "real" wounds look. All that fits. It's not a "sandals" show; it's not "costumed Western tradition". It's ... carnal, mean, and absolutely brutal. In this regard it's REALISTIC.

And on top of it, if you do it on Blue-Ray, it's fantastic to watch.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 22, 2013 02:12 PM
Edited by artu at 14:15, 22 Jun 2013.

First of all the gore is not realistic, it is intentionally grotesque. People bleed like fountains even in the slightest scratch and the blood does not spill, it comes off like it's hosed.

But put aside the  special effects, the kind of realism I talk about isn't events and personalities following real history quintessentially either. I like historical drama, I liked the Tudors, I still follow the Borgias. In both shows, writers also use poetic license: Some characters are older or younger than they should be, king's sister marries to a Portuguese king instead of France, in the Borgias, Cem Sultan is killed in the palace which is not so in reality etc etc. No, these details don't matter, and if some modification is done for creative purposes, I'm totally fine with it. What I care about is remaining loyal to the spirit of that time, the zeitgeist if you will. Yes, Spartacus started an uprising against Rome but I'm sure neither he nor his men had an ideal of individuality and freedom for every man in the modern sense, nor do I think they gave rhetorical sermons about that kind of freedom. Probably, almost all of them were illiterate and there was no way they could debate such matters as if they were scholars. Also, I can understand the royalty women acting a little bossy but there was no way the common women acted like they were equal to men and fought like amazons all the time. Their slave husbands/lovers would consider that as an insult to their masculinity in the first place. Another huge ambiance breaker is everybody looking like super-models which is especially unrealistic in historical times due to matters of nutrition and health problems. In short, the show is anachronical in every way imaginable.

Now the Tudors or The Borgias are not perfect examples of mirroring the period they base their story on either, and yes this is TV and it's all commercial and so on, but the level of anachronical detail in Spartacus, both in character development and in setting is so high, I can not relate the story to Ancient Rome. The piece that achieved that wonderfully, yet still kept the action and fun with success also, was again the show by the Brits: Rome  

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markkur
markkur


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted June 22, 2013 03:39 PM

Quote:
Another huge ambiance breaker is everybody looking like super-models which is especially unrealistic in historical times due to matters of nutrition and health problems.


This is a very good point; <imo> I don't watch shows anymore due the fact that its all about the sex and most  media is locked on presenting models; the average looking person can only work behind the scenes these days.  I detest the fact that a Flora Robson would likely not be Queen Elizabeth today and she was brilliant in the role...twice. Producers don't need to show me beauty pageants, sex scenes or "hanged, drawn and quartered" in 3D for me to enjoy well written stories but alas, this is the true age of the Voyeur and the roman-like mob must be pleased.

Rome's 1st season was done very well and needed little editing for family viewing. The Brits have always done historical things well, going back to I Claudius.



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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted June 22, 2013 04:24 PM

I think you are dead wrong, artu.

1)
Quote:

What I care about is remaining loyal to the spirit of that time, the zeitgeist if you will. Yes, Spartacus started an uprising against Rome but I'm sure neither he nor his men had an ideal of individuality and freedom for every man in the modern sense, nor do I think they gave rhetorical sermons about that kind of freedom.

Here you likely err. Appian tells, Spartacus told his comrades in the ludum, "You must not risk your life for "panem", but you have to risk it for your freedom."
In Spartacus's army, the loot was divided EQUALLY between all of them, something unheard of. Plutarch wrote, Spartacus was very educated and intelligent, and concluded origins with a lot of culture. All that explains why the Romans dealt a lot harsher with the rioters as they used to do (there were many riots in that time), because it was a bit more than just running away from slavery.
The army was very organized and disciplined as well.
You CAN talk about these things without being a scholar. People understand the simple truths behind all of these things.

Quote:
Also, I can understand the royalty women acting a little bossy but there was no way the common women acted like they were equal to men and fought like amazons all the time. Their slave husbands/lovers would consider that as an insult to their masculinity in the first place.
That's something I haven't seen (I've in the beginning stages of the show), except for Spartacus's wife. In Rome women in general were more equal than in other societies of the time and also in our times up to the end of the 19th century. How "equal" a woman in reality was, depended on the social status of her family, although women had no political rights.
"Common women" I have yet to see.

Quote:
Another huge ambiance breaker is everybody looking like super-models which is especially unrealistic in historical times due to matters of nutrition and health problems.
That was an ambience breaker in the Tudors, (partly because it made a couple of things hard to understand) but, sorry, I don't see supermodels in Spartacus. It's fairly obvious that the Gladiators would get a healthy diet, because they would need it in order to fight. It was also a question of earning money with them, so it wouldn't do for them to starve. We are not talking about the Middle Ages here, we talk about ROME.
The same is true for slaves - think cars. Slaces cost money, and you have to invest a minimum into them when  you want to keep their worth. The "better" a slave is (the more abilities and positive features they have, the more expensive they are, so even with the slaves you'd have the cheap ones who'd die fast, and the expensive ones - who might look like super models.

Quote:
In short, the show is anachronical in every way imaginable.
In short - I don't see even ONE anachronical way in the points you mentioned, not to mention in EVERY IMAGINABLE one, especially since you actually didn't contradict even one of the points I made.

ROME is a different beast; I'd consider it in the midth between the Tudors and Spartacus - but the production did cost a fortune as well. Lots of s+v. But the focus is different. It's on "powerful-people/events"-history, changing of times and so on. That's not meant in a negative way, though. I do not say anything against Rome either.

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Corribus
Corribus

Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
posted June 22, 2013 04:34 PM

LOL, can't a TV show just be a TV show?

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted June 22, 2013 05:34 PM

Quote:

Rome's 1st season was done very well and needed little editing for family viewing. The Brits have always done historical things well, going back to I Claudius.

Rome got in fact ALOT of editing. The uncut version is rated 18 in both Britain and Germamy.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 22, 2013 07:42 PM
Edited by artu at 20:13, 22 Jun 2013.

Quote:
LOL, can't a TV show just be a TV show?


Of, course not. Next, we're debating your breakfast diet. I don't think its healthy but JJ says feeling good about what you eat on breakfast is an important part of health, especially since you're starting the day.

(Well, my first post was suggesting exactly that, to treat it as fantasy to enjoy the show. )


@JJ

1)People may understand and object to those things at a level of intuition but the way Spartacus theorizes everything is totally something else. He's not even like a Roman scholar, he talks as if he read the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. I don't want to give you spoilers and ruin the show for you so all I'll say here is, just notice the dialogues and "debates" between gladiators in the episodes to come. Btw, from Wiki:
The gladiator rebellion, interpreted by some as an example of oppressed people fighting for their freedom against a slave-owning oligarchy, has been an inspiration to many political thinkers, and has been featured in literature, television, and film. Although not contradicted by classical historians, no historical account mentions that the goal of the rebels was to end slavery in the Roman Republic, nor do any of the actions of rebel leaders, who themselves committed numerous atrocities, seem specifically aimed at ending slavery
2)For common women, again, wait and see.
3) A healthy diet is something else, everybody looking like super-models is something else and it's definitely not realistic. And the Gladiators would look more like the wrestlers in the Olympics not like body builders from 21st century. Just think pictures of early 20th century athletes and even then there is a huge difference.

Again, only one or two of these things would have slide away. It's all of them combined that underlines the anachronism. Since the only specific points you made was the portrayal of the society and the show not being in Western costume tradition (bloody, brutal and nude doesn't necessarily mean realistic, I already told you the gore is grotesque) and I mentioned why I don't find those aspects of the show realistic already, I don't see the point in your closing. However, if you have anything to object, I suggest we wait till you also finish the show cause right now, I'm making my points in a minefield of spoilers.

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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted June 22, 2013 08:25 PM

Ok, but I still think you are wrong about the "supermodels". What do you think they did in those gladiator schools EXCEPT to train?
For diet, wiki says:

Quote:
Despite the harsh discipline, gladiators represented a substantial investment for their lanista and were otherwise well cared for. Their high-energy, vegetarian diet combined barley, boiled beans, oatmeal, ash (believed to help fortify the body) and dried fruit. Compared to modern athletes, they were probably overweight, but this may have "protected their vital organs from the cutting blows of their opponents". The same research suggests they may have fought barefoot.
Regular massage and high quality medical care helped mitigate an otherwise very severe training regime. Part of Galen's medical training was at a gladiator school in Pergamum where he saw (and would later criticise) the training, diet, and long term health prospects of the gladiators.


That's exactly what I saw until now.

This aspect is a lot more disturbing in The Tudors, where everyone is looking GREAT. Especially Henry VIII. himself. That has certain consequences for the believability of the plot: if you look at Henry's fifth wife, it's pretty inconceivable why that girl would risk her status and life in that case considering that her husband is quite a good-looking guy (which he was definitely NOT), or why he has such an aversion against his fourth wife who isn't looking bad at all. And of course that's only the tip of the iceberg.

The gladiators look believable uder the circumstances - they are supposed to be the best, mind you. What would they do except caring for their body?

For the rest, I'll wait and watch.

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Corribus
Corribus

Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
posted June 22, 2013 08:40 PM

Just finished the 3rd season of Breaking Bad.  I have to say, they've handled the transition of the main character from protagonist to antagonist very well so far.  The show is also dripping with symbolism and well-timed but brief flash backs.

I am eagerly starting the 4th season tomorrow.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg

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Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted June 22, 2013 09:39 PM

I liked Spartacus very much. About the sausage festival, can't say I was disturbed much, as when there is sausage, bush is coming, so keep watching.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 23, 2013 01:33 AM

Quote:
I have to say, they've handled the transition of the main character from protagonist to antagonist very well so far.


Yep, Breaking Bad reaches the level of art when it comes to character development, and not just with Walter, others go through a deep transition too.

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted June 23, 2013 10:08 AM

Quote:
I detest the fact that a Flora Robson would likely not be Queen Elizabeth today and she was brilliant in the role...twice. Producers don't need to show me beauty pageants, sex scenes or "hanged, drawn and quartered" in 3D for me to enjoy well written stories but alas, this is the true age of the Voyeur and the roman-like mob must be pleased


This reminded me of an interview I watched some time ago, couldn't remember what it was instantly, but now it came back. It's Alec Baldwin talking about what was expected of an actor and how it changes according to social norm. He has great sense of humor but more importantly sharp observation and it's interesting to listen how he analyzes the industry of film making from inside, touching the complaint above.
Watch 3:51 to 4:35

Inside the Actors Studio  

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markkur
markkur


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted June 23, 2013 03:49 PM

It's funny, he's one actor that "at times" has been the most offensive to me, not because he thinks differently than I, has different values or has spoke out; it was when he sounded exactly like what he attacked.

Now that I'm older, I know I've done the very same thing; it seems to be it's a human-nature thing, that we each have to grow past.

Anyway, I watched the actor and he was spot-on about what I've noticed and ofc shared other insights/struggles that I didn't know.

Since you like this stuff, see If you can find the 1966 BBC interview with Laurence Olivier by Kenneth Tynan entitled "Great Acting: Laurence Olivier." I doubt there will ever be a better insight into the art of acting. I saw a few links at about 10 minutes but I think it lasts longer and it's all good.

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