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| Thread: H6 Lore and Trivia *Spoilers!* |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Avonu
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Embracing light and darkness
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posted September 18, 2012 09:57 PM |
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Edited by Avonu at 22:32, 18 Sep 2012.
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@ War-overlord And you did not tell us a thing.. shame on you..
But he told... read his post in Quiz topic.
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Which meant that the Faceless fought alongside the Demons and this is the reason Angels hate, fear and distrust the Faceless.
As Azkaal said:
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The Faceless once created an illusion in Sheogh, to make us think we had already destroyed the world. Or at least I think they did. My memories aren't clear.
I don't know, but maybe that was their goal - to side with demons and spell illusion on them to end this fight once and for all.
Also, after Wars of Creations Malassa helped clear Asha's wounds and mind from Urgash's influence and thus created Mother Namtaru (as Staff of Cleansing bio says). So her alliance with Urgash wasn't true or was only temporary.
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War-overlord
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Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 18, 2012 10:28 PM |
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It only says that Malassa sided with Urgash for her own unknown reasons, which are still subject to debate and speculation.
Also, during the healing of Asha, Malassa aided Shalassa in secret.
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Avonu
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Embracing light and darkness
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posted September 18, 2012 10:34 PM |
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Anynew info about Kha-Beleth and HOW he become Demon Sovereign after 2nd Eclipse or just information what we know already?
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War-overlord
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Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 18, 2012 10:38 PM |
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Anynew info about Kha-Beleth and HOW he become Demon Sovereign after 2nd Eclipse or just information what we know already?
Nope, only that after the First Eclipse the Demons started a civil war as the Overlords blamed eachother for the failure. And that after the Second Eclipse, when the ash and dust settled, only the Sovereign known as Kha-Beleth was left standing.
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Avonu
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Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted September 18, 2012 10:41 PM |
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So we need to wait for Ashan Compendium ver. 123, where all informaton will be given. Thanks
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War-overlord
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posted September 18, 2012 10:43 PM |
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Or they haven't come up with it yet. Or they plan on doing something with this in the future.
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War-overlord
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posted September 24, 2012 01:05 PM |
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Harpies, Mermaids, Sharkmen, Lamasu, Minotaurs & Centaurs. Then there are Gremlins, which are a mixture of Lizard and Goblin.(I believe Elvin gave points for this). There are Lizardmen,(of which we assume by name that they are a mixture of Lizard and Human), which are only mentioned in the bio of Falagar and Agar. Both of which are heroes present in PotSS. (Again, I believe Elvin awarded points to this knowledge) And lastly, the Ashan Compendium has retconned Rakshasas as being beastmen.
I just wonder, what about Manticores from Lamasu bio and from HV?
Manticores have been rectonned in the Compendium, insofar as there was info on them to begin with. If you read the description from Heroes V, there is no talk of beastmanity. In many respects, Ashanian Manticores are like Griffins. They are creatures that have been mutated from natural exposure to Dragonveins. In this case, Shadowdragonveins, making them naturally linked and appreciated by the worshippers of Malassa. Lamasus are, as we know, the fusion of Human and Manticore.
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And about Rakshasa:
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Vengeful spirits from a forgotten age, the Rakshasas have lingered on the fringes of Ashan for millennia. Thirsty for revenge, these creatures have been rediscovered by Wizard travellers who - after many unsuccessful attempts - managed to summon and control them efficiently.
Are they beastmen created by Crimson Mages or by someone else long ago?
As I have said, the Compendium retconns the Rakshasa. The Rakshasa are beastmen as any other, the fusion of big cats(lions presumably) and Humans. Originally intended as hunters and bodyguards, the Rakshasa's martial prowess, spirit and attitude outshone that of other beastmen. So they were made the officerclass among the beastmen, to lord over them as secondants of the Wizards. The Wizards rewarded the Rakshasas generously for their service, gifting them with magical artifacts, granting them extra limbs and fusing them with minor Air-spirits. Lending them an even greater edge in battle. Because of their privilege, Rakshasas remained loyal to the Wizards, when other beastmen revolted.
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Avonu
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Embracing light and darkness
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posted September 24, 2012 01:07 PM |
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Edited by Avonu at 13:16, 24 Sep 2012.
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Liches do not "evolve" into Vampires simply over time. But you are correct that Vampire Lords actually age backwards.
- What is the distinct difference between Liches and Vampires, where age is concerned?
Several Quotes from the descriptions of Liches, Archliches, Vampires and Vampire Lords respectively:
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Higher ranking Necromancers are given a life-prolonging elixir that is "milked from the venom of the Goddess's sacred spiders, and that they must mix with their food.
This "treatment" turns them into Asakkus, or "Liches", their bodies desiccated but now freed from the passions of the flesh. They keep aging however, until they look little more than walking mummies… The venom mixture also colors their whole eyes bright green.
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An Archlich is given that title when he has continued "living" beyond what his mortal shell would have normally permitted. Though this passage may seem arbitrary, it is not, for a Lich feels the moment pass when death should have come. As they journey beyond the Cylce of Life and Death...
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As they grow in power, Liches may earn the right to be embraced by the Spider Goddess herself to die and be reborn as Akhkharus, or "Vampires".
They undergo an excruciating ritual but gain a rejuvenated body, cleansed from all defects. Vampires don't need to eat, drink, sleep or breathe anymore as all their organs are "petrified," and it is not blood, but the sacred spider's venom, that now flows in their veins.
However, they need to drink human blood on a regular basis to thin this venom down, and prevent it from dissolving their body from the inside.
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When a Vampire reaches complete mastery of his new powers, he starts to age backwards, looking one year younger for every new century of unlife. He is now greeted as a Vampire Lord...
Ergo, Liches continue aging, despite having reached a state of Undeath. This is due to their consumation of the Venom of Namtaru (or possibly other spiders sacred to Asha). When they continue aging beyond their "expiration date", they become Archliches. Vampires are reborn and continue in a petrified state of being, I.E. they stop aging. Vampire Lords even grow younger over time, or in other words age backwards.
I think we can say, that liches "evolve" into vampires. Yes, they need to die first to be reborn as vampires but, unless you are stupid enough to use some powerful artifacts to reanimate your lover as vampire lord, vampire are "born" from remains of liches.
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To become a lord of the Necromancers is the ideal of all who have chosen this path, though there are many other forms of unlife that have relatively more or less importance. In fact a Necromancer is not necessarily one of the non-living; in particular those who go on embassies to foreign lands are often still in human form. As they gain power, however, they inevitably choose to pass through the portal of death, becoming one of the undead. Little is known of this rite of passage to outsiders, as it involves the bite of the sacred spiders, the Namtaru, who dwell in the catacombs deep beneath the capital of Nar-Heresh.
Those who make this passage first become Asakkus, or "Liches", their bodies desiccated but intact, freed from the passions of the flesh to meditate undistracted.
As the decades pass, and they grow in power, they may earn the right to become Akhkharus, or "Vampires". For a Vampire is the most potent incarnation of a once-human form, one of the unliving lords of Heresh who hold sway over both the dead and undead.
Once a Lich ascends to take the form of a Vampire he ages backwards. The longer a Necromancer is undead, the younger and healthier he looks. The ruling council of the Lords of Heresh all appear to be in their mid-twenties, beautiful and unchanging.
As you can see, Liches ascends to form of Vampires - so basicly they becomes them.
But it all depends of point of view. Anyway Necromacers first becomes Liches and then Vampires.
And about Necromancy itself:
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Lucretia: Master, I have a question. You told me Belketh created the Spider Cult. Yet seeing these statues and motifs, the ancient Shantiris already venerated Asha in her spider form.
Sandro: Indeed, my disciple. When the Shantiris were destroyed during the Elder Wars, much was forgotten about their culture. Belketh succesfully deduced the "spider woman" seen in Shantiri art was Asha herself. Thus Belketh did not create this belief, he merely resurrected it.
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted September 24, 2012 01:12 PM |
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Edited by Avonu at 13:19, 24 Sep 2012.
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Manticores have been rectonned in the Compendium, insofar as there was info on them to begin with. If you read the description from Heroes V, there is no talk of beastmanity. In many respects, Ashanian Manticores are like Griffins. They are creatures that have been mutated from natural exposure to Dragonveins. In this case, Shadowdragonveins, making them naturally linked and appreciated by the worshippers of Malassa. Lamasus are, as we know, the fusion of Human and Manticore.
From what I read from compednium scans (it is readable), all beatsmen are like that - they are fusion of humans and animals near dragonveins.
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As I have said, the Compendium retconns the Rakshasa. The Rakshasa are beastmen as any other, the fusion of big cats(lions presumably) and Humans. Originally intended as hunters and bodyguards, the Rakshasa's martial prowess, spirit and attitude outshone that of other beastmen. So they were made the officerclass among the beastmen, to lord over them as secondants of the Wizards. The Wizards rewarded the Rakshasas generously for their service, gifting them with magical artifacts, granting them extra limbs and fusing them with minor Air-spirits. Lending them an even greater edge in battle. Because of their privilege, Rakshasas remained loyal to the Wizards, when other beastmen revolted.
I just "love" retcons. Djinns were too retconned (they suppose to be from another plane or something like that - now they probably are jsut spirits/elementals from Spirit Realm)?
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Anynew info about Kha-Beleth and HOW he become Demon Sovereign after 2nd Eclipse or just information what we know already?
Nope, only that after the First Eclipse the Demons started a civil war as the Overlords blamed eachother for the failure. And that after the Second Eclipse, when the ash and dust settled, only the Sovereign known as Kha-Beleth was left standing.
(...)
Or they haven't come up with it yet. Or they plan on doing something with this in the future.
The second - I asked this question long ago and the answer was something like "we know how he becomes only ruler of demons and we like to tell this story someday".
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War-overlord
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Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 24, 2012 01:30 PM |
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In your answer in the quiz you asserted that if a lich becomes powerfull and/or old enough he "simply" becomes a Vampire:
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When lich (un)live long enough and gain more power, he become vampire and regain his young. And later he can become vampire lord and be one of Heresh ruler council.
This is simply not true, as you can read in the descriptions. Liches may be selected to undergo the ritual that lets them be reborn in a rejuvinated body and make them a Vampire. This makes this an active descision and one that is not for the Lich to make. This also makes that Archliches may unlive in their state for eternity, simply because they are not allowed, or even refuse(however unlikely) to partake in the ritual.
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From what I read from compednium scans (it is readable), all beatsmen are like that - they are fusion of humans and animals near dragonveins.
That is indeed the case. However, where Manticores, like Griffins, are concerned, there is no human in the process. Not in the fusion, and not to guide/force the fusion. Griffins are the result of a natural-borne fusion of lions and eagles. Likewise, Manticores are the fusion of some cave-cat, a bat and a scorpion presumably.(It is not stated which animals were fused). They are classed, again like Griffins, as Magical Beasts.
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I just "love" retcons. Djinns were too retconned (they suppose to be from another plane or something like that - now they probably are jsut spirits/elementals from Spirit Realm)?
No, not entirely. Djinni(which is the correct plural, I believe) are still from another plane. Djinni are beings from the Spirit Realm, which is a different plane of existance and the one where the Gods dwell. Djinni can be summoned or harnessed into the Physical Realm, by Wizards. But they are not affiliated to any element, simply with the pure magic that is the Spirit Plane. One could argue that they are the Physical Gestalt of Magic, making them Magic Elementals. But this is not an assertion that the Compendium makes.
Edit: Avonu, make note that Necromancy and the worshipping of the Spider Aspect of Asha are not the same thing. Yes, the Shantiri may have worshipped/depicted the Spider Aspect of Asha. But that does not make them Necromancers by default.
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Dave_Jame
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I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted September 24, 2012 01:51 PM |
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Manticores have been rectonned in the Compendium, insofar as there was info on them to begin with. If you read the description from Heroes V, there is no talk of beastmanity. In many respects, Ashanian Manticores are like Griffins. They are creatures that have been mutated from natural exposure to Dragonveins. In this case, Shadowdragonveins, making them naturally linked and appreciated by the worshippers of Malassa. Lamasus are, as we know, the fusion of Human and Manticore.
I did never understood who came up whit the idea that Maticoras are Beastman in the first place. I do not know, but ever since they came out, I have taken for granted that they are something like Gryphons, natural Magicaly combined creatures.
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From what I read from compednium scans (it is readable), all beatsmen are like that - they are fusion of humans and animals near dragonveins.
The basic difference is naturul versus controled experiment and also. and also the fact that humans are used. Not animals with animals.
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I just "love" retcons. Djinns were too retconned (they suppose to be from another plane or something like that - now they probably are jsut spirits/elementals from Spirit Realm)?
Well I think the word plane of magic and Spirit realm can be seen as very cloase. so not really a retcom IMHo. just text specification.
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I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
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War-overlord
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Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 24, 2012 01:53 PM |
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The Plane of Magic and the Spirit Realm are in fact the same thing. However, it is not stated that the "Dream World" is the Spirit Realm and it may be another plane of existance alltogether.
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Sandro400
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Shadow of Death
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posted September 24, 2012 03:11 PM |
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Hm, question for those who have Compendium.
Who founded the Falcon Empire (not Holy Empire) and who was the first Griffin Emperor by the book?
Ask because in chapter given on official site there're some misunderstanding with former canon.
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War-overlord
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Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 24, 2012 03:28 PM |
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The founder of the Falcon Empire is Ronan the Great in 3YSD. Sar Elam prophasises that when the Falcon Line ceases to exist, the world will end. Ronan's Grandson, Brian I converted the Empire to the worship of Elrath, making it the Holy Falcon Empire in 48 YSD.
The First Griffin Emperor was Ivan I, who usurped the throne 834 YSD. Though Brendan Falcon was said to be the only of the Falcon Line who survived the massacre of the Royal Family by the Demons who sought to end the world via the prophecy. He had gone into hiding and it is assumed that the line lives on through him in secret, since the world has not ended yet.
(The line of the Stag Duchy is an offshoot line of the Falcon line, so arguments can be made that the Stags have continued the line of Falcon.)
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Sandro400
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posted September 24, 2012 03:33 PM |
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Huge thanks. And maybe two last questions - was the system of six dukes and Imperial Province implemented by Brian and what is a new date of Beastman creation?
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War-overlord
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Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 24, 2012 03:37 PM |
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More or less. The six Duchies were the territories of the Human Clans that were united into the Empire. I.E. the Unicorn Duchy is the former territory of the Unicorn Clan ect.
The Stag Duchy is located in the lands of the Falcon Clan, who moved to the Imperial Province, which is of lands in the center of the Empire at the intersection of the Clan territories and were taken by/given to the Emperor. The Stag line is an Offshoot/ sidebranch of the Falcon one, as I said before. When the Griffins moved into the Imperial Province, the former Griffin lands were given to an Offshoot/Sidebranch of the Griffins and the lands were renamed the Raven Duchy.
The Beastmen were created between 340-350 YSD, after the enslavement of the Orcs in 337 YSD.
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Resto
Tavern Dweller
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posted September 24, 2012 08:23 PM |
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Edited by Resto at 20:27, 24 Sep 2012.
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Can someone who have Compendium ask: is there any new info about Elves (both kinds)? Does they have any new creatures? Is there something about Mageblades and Titans?
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Dave_Jame
Promising
Legendary Hero
I'm Faceless, not Brainless.
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posted September 24, 2012 08:24 PM |
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How much new info about Elves (both kinds) and does they have any new creatures?
Basic info. there are 3 kinds of Elves.
Forest (Sylvan)
Dark¨
Sea
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I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
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War-overlord
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Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted September 24, 2012 08:31 PM |
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Actually, Sea Elves aren't a different species of Elves. Not so much as Dark Elves are, certainly whose life underground and worship of Malassa changes their physique.
Basically Sea Elves are Elven gypsies. They live with their whole family/crew on a boat that resembles a floating Elf Village. They wander whereever the sea or the wind takes them. Sea Elves are Sylvan Elves that simply choose not to live in Irollan. Sea Elves are not a faction and no units represent them in game. And it is doubtfull that there will be in the future other than perhaps a neutral or a battlesite.
There is plenty news on Dark Elves and Sylvan Elves as well, but I do not intend to start transcribing the book onto the forum. If you need to know that badly, go buy it.
Mageblades may(will likely) be the Might Heroes of Academy. They are Wizard who use their talent to enhance their martial prowess and enhance their weapons.
Titans are still a lot like they were in heroes 5. There is some info on their origins in the Shantiri Empire and how Titans nowadays are merely lesser construct copies of the older and much larger originals.
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Dave_Jame
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posted September 24, 2012 08:34 PM |
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@War-Overlord
That would actually make them a prefect RPG material.
And btw. so they are basicaly the same to elves as the free cities are to the holy empire?
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I'm just a Mirror of your self.
We see, we look, we gather, we store, we teach.
We are many, and you can be one of us.
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