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Heroes Community > Library of Enlightenment > Thread: Best Level 4 Creature?
Thread: Best Level 4 Creature? This thread is 2 pages long: 1 2 · NEXT»
KingCrimson
KingCrimson


Hired Hero
posted July 16, 2012 11:24 PM

Best Level 4 Creature?

Looked for a thread on this, couldn't find it.

In the same vein as the other threads, rank the lvl 4s from best to worst.

The main reason why I posted this is because lvl 4 is one that, for me, is a little difficult to sort out. Vampire Lord is the best, yes, and Crusaders are up there as well, but as for the rest? I feel as though it's pretty close.

I am a n00b, though, so I'll gladly be proven wrong!
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OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted July 16, 2012 11:35 PM

Vampire Lords are best in terms of raw 1vs1 strength and are marvelous for easy cleaning up the map. However I don't find them that superb when it comes to end fights. Here I like Sharpshooters much more. Arch Magi are very good too, but I recall them being somewhat expensive. The real advantage of Sharpshooters lies in their extreme offensive powers. Which brings to a funny point. Sharpshooters gets molested by Dragon Fly's which are inferior in every way against Zealots, but Zealots are chanceless against Sharpshooters. Notice the levels of the creatures mentioned, btw.

I generally dislike slow troops and damage through magic isn't even that much applied anyway, which makes the gold golems somewhat inferior. Same goes for Ogre Magi, despite their massive hit point total. The energy elements are by far the worst, though they've about the same brute strength as silver pegassi, they don't have that very important speed. They've fire immunity, which is of course a great ability, but it should be an added bonus, not the only feature.

Crusaders are really nice, due to their raw offensive strength, like Basilisks are great while defending from the seige, because they can make your own troops block you, but when it comes to it, both units aren't worth that much, in my opinion. I think Crusaders are good to have in an end fight, because in high numbers they can much faster than anything at their own power level destroy an opposing, non-retaliating, stack. This means they add a threat no other unit of their tier, except the ranged units, can do. That's all they're good for though.

Horned demons are by themselves a really poor unit, slow, bad stats, nothing special. But like the skeleton unit, their power lies in their use in the game, which comes from the Pit Lords. I'd rather call the Pit Lords the best level 5 unit, than the Horned Demon the best level 4 unit, but when you're adding 400 extra demons to your army at the end of second month, you can't help, but start to like those otherwise worthless beasts. Finally there's the medusa queen, which is a unit I personally tend to underestimate. I don't like my shooters being slow and fat, but the medusa queens is still a very capable unit. They can take down those slow level 5 units, despite being the weakest ranged unit among the level 4 units and despite being a shooter, the medusa queen will generally take down most of the level 4 tier opposing it. Though I believe, unlike the arch magi, the medusa queen does lose to the silver pegasi. However I think that's more a testiment to the power of the arch magi, that they can in hand to hand defeat a unit of their own power level, designed to take down shooters.

So all in all, I think the sharpshooter is the best level 4 unit, but the vampire lords are the safest and easiest to apply.
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Star_King
Star_King


Known Hero
posted July 17, 2012 03:26 AM
Edited by Star_King at 03:27, 17 Jul 2012.

Vampire Lords are the best.

Greater Basilisks are the most underrated.

And I don't think the Pit Lord demon-summoning ability should be factored in.

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PlokiteWolf
PlokiteWolf


Hired Hero
posted July 17, 2012 09:52 AM

Vampire Lords, Greater Basilisks, Crusaders. Pretty much what everyone said.

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NoobX
NoobX


Undefeatable Hero
Now, this is a paradox...
posted July 17, 2012 10:51 AM

Vamps are the best. They are a bit expensive, but they are the best.

If you know how to play with them, you might be able to crush any living being on the map. Unliving ones, not so much.


As for the Sharpshooters:
They are good, but rare.
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heroes_player
heroes_player


Known Hero
posted July 17, 2012 01:53 PM
Edited by heroes_player at 13:57, 17 Jul 2012.

Good Evening

1.Vampire lords - They just can take nearly everything in the map! plus their speed is excellent
2.Sharpshooters - health is a big problem but if you are able to keep them alive they are killers! just imagine lvl 20 Orrin with them...
3.Crusaders - Double attack makes difference winning and losing. They are tough enough but quite slow...
4.Ogre Mage - great dmg dealer and expert bloodlust for a creature is plus bless is useful with them. But their speed is pity
5.Arch Mage - average shooter which health is problem but the spell cost reduction is very nice especially in the beginning. just imagine magic arrow with 2sp and ice bolt with 4sp
6.Great Basilisks - in theory they can wipe anything in 1vs1! But it is pity that their ability is quite rare
7. Horned Demons - no ability and speed might be a problem. But in huge numbers they are real threat
8. Medusa queen - OK shooters. Low ammo has rarely been a problem for me
9.Silver pegagus - speed is excellent but after all weak spell costing can be annoying sometimes though
10.Energy elemental - well the weakest in comparison with other lvl4s in my opinion. Armageddon tactic can work with them but thats why you have faster creatures like phoenixes etc...

hope that was informative for you all

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angelito
angelito


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
proud father of a princess
posted July 17, 2012 07:35 PM

Quote:
Looked for a thread on this, couldn't find it...


How about this one?

You could find even more similar threads by reading this thread
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Better judged by 12 than carried by 6.

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KingCrimson
KingCrimson


Hired Hero
posted July 17, 2012 10:59 PM

*slaps forehead*

Stupid me. I just glanced back a few pages, didn't see anything, and called it a day. Thanks!
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KingCrimson
KingCrimson


Hired Hero
posted July 19, 2012 01:21 AM

That being the case then, perhaps we can turn this discussion to the happily pointless topic of:

Does Demon raising make the Demon a good unit, or the Pit Lord a good unit?

My vote is for both. The two creatures' power is really dependent upon one another, so it's hard to separate them. Pit Lords raising Demons without a stack already there isn't that amazing, and Demons without Pit Lords to bolster their ranks are horribly underwhelming (it's almost worse than Skellies without Necromancy). But the two together form a solid force.
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c0ldshadow
c0ldshadow


Known Hero
ig chr0meice91
posted July 19, 2012 01:57 AM

i would say demon farming doesn't make demons good

similar to how wyverns aren't good b/c of hives... the hives are good -- not the wyverns -- like someone else said in another thread.

if vampire lords had a weekly growth of 1 per week, would that make them the worst level 4? they would still be the best level 4 - the growth would be the worst - not the creature


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Peterlerock
Peterlerock


Adventuring Hero
posted July 19, 2012 08:06 AM

I think both points of view are legit.

You can do a comparison between the units themselves ("1 Demon is not as good as 1 Vampire Lord"), or you can judge them in their whole environment.

300 Demons farmed in 3 weeks buy some maniacs are obviously better than the 4+8+8 Vampires that grow in a Necropolis at the same time.

Phoenixes are considered overpowered not because of their raw strength (they suck 1v1), but because you get twice as much phoenixes without them being only half as strong.

So there's enough reason to consider growth and other possibilities to acquire the troop type.

You get some sort of a result out of both ways, and both results have the same problem of not being very useful at all...

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KingCrimson
KingCrimson


Hired Hero
posted July 19, 2012 05:18 PM

Quote:

if vampire lords had a weekly growth of 1 per week, would that make them the worst level 4? they would still be the best level 4 - the growth would be the worst - not the creature




That doesn't make any sense, though. The growth is an integral aspect of the creature. If VLs had a weekly growth of 1, then yes they would be the worst level 4. I don't care how great life drain is, if you're only getting 2 of them per week with a castle, they would be terrible.

You can't compartmentalize everything into independent factors. It's like determining who would win in a 1v1 fight - that means very little, if anything at all. Just about everything in the game is dependent on something else, and so to take into account only a few factors doesn't really work.

To me, when determining best creatures per level, it's about a lot more than just stats and skills. You've gotta ask: How useful is this to the town that it's from? At what points in the game is it useful? How does it fare against units of higher levels? Lower levels? Is it good/bad against certain creatures? Towns?

If all you use to determine the "best" is to pit them against each other 1v1, that doesn't solve anything.
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Star_King
Star_King


Known Hero
posted July 19, 2012 06:54 PM

I think you should consider only the numbers you get from a single town. So no demon-raising or hives, but Phoenixes having double growth rate DOES make them better in my eyes. If you count hives or Necromancy then yeah Wyverns and Skeletons are obviously the best unit for their level, but I don't think that's a fair comparison because you're gaining extra numbers from an outside source - you could easily say "Ghost Dragons are the best level 7 if you have 8 external dwellings so that you get 10 per week". The amount of outside sources are variable (as well as the number of demons or skeletons raised), and to me that's showing that the outside source is good, not the creature. So you can only really compare using numbers from a single castle.

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iliecostin
iliecostin

Tavern Dweller
posted September 03, 2012 09:36 PM

My fav are crusaders. Probably the best upgrade in the game for lvl 4.

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master_learn
master_learn


Legendary Hero
walking to the library
posted September 03, 2012 09:58 PM
Edited by master_learn at 22:00, 03 Sep 2012.

The upgrade thread is here.
I also find the vampire lords the best,not only for the life drain,but for their speed.Not sure how to put the others though,so I read and learn.
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Ghost
Ghost


Undefeatable Hero
Therefore I am
posted September 03, 2012 11:19 PM

RoE for vampires, AB for crusaders. 3DO & JVC has taught. The case is brought in the H4. What? Vampires and Crusaders are hard. But I like a crusader in H3.
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Fight MWMs - stand teach

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fockewulf
fockewulf

Tavern Dweller
posted September 10, 2012 03:39 PM

Crusaders!
The Holy Order of Crusaders

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Thunderbird
Thunderbird


Hired Hero
The Caller of Lightning
posted February 07, 2013 02:57 PM

Ogre Mage maybe the best 4th lv creature in heroes 3

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fram
fram

Tavern Dweller
posted February 07, 2013 07:31 PM

Quote:
Ogre Mage maybe the best 4th lv creature in heroes 3



Ogre magi actually better than some lvl5 creatures
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Thunderbird
Thunderbird


Hired Hero
The Caller of Lightning
posted February 08, 2013 01:56 AM

Yes,I think Ogre Magi is stronger than lich

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