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Heroes Community > Turban Tribunal > Thread: A survey and a lament
Thread: A survey and a lament This thread is 8 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 · NEXT»
JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 22, 2012 12:13 PM

A survey and a lament

Question to everyone:

Does it make sense to post in a community forum that has an uncanny tendency to swallow up posts and even whole threads? What does everyone think about this?

The simple disappearance of the written word, especially when it is used for a critical examination of mod actions, is a kind of censorship that couldn't be more contemptously.

Is this a kind of internet-China where you can do everything as long as it's not against the CoC OR you don't speak a word against the powers that rule?

As sad as it may seem - it's just not worth it. Not for me, at least.


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Lexxan
Lexxan


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Unimpressed by your logic
posted August 22, 2012 01:18 PM

prepare to have this thread deleted as well, brah.
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Tsar-Ivor
Tsar-Ivor


Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
posted August 22, 2012 01:33 PM
Edited by Tsar-Ivor at 13:50, 22 Aug 2012.

We all knew what this was when we signed up. HC is a sinking ship, mods took absolute power to maintain this place, questioning what they do and causing grief is not helping, though other individuals in our history and past would've wanted one to think the same.

A while ago Forfy tested whether the mods adhere solely to the CoC or common sense, the latter prevailed. Though I personally prefer mods to act on their personal judgement (they wouldn't be mods if they couldn't handle it right?) and personal interpretation of the CoC, suppressing outcries will only make things worse, regardless whether they think that they are in the right, and in doing so, they may damage this place more than any amount of time could ever do.



Rectifying the mistakes of the past seems as simple (or as complicated depending on the way you look at it) as dropping the subject.
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny

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master_learn
master_learn


Legendary Hero
walking to the library
posted August 22, 2012 01:51 PM
Edited by master_learn at 13:52, 22 Aug 2012.

Since this is the Turban Tribunal,I may write down my observations.

A HC member posts his(serious?)concerns according to the rules of the Tribunal.
An hour later the first answer occurs...(Whole hour?)

Now the author of this thread is GONE somewhere-so unable to answer questions,maybe not willing to explain what he propose and I get the impression that something is fishy here.
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Adrius
Adrius


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
posted August 22, 2012 01:54 PM

I think calling HC a sinking ship is a bit pessimistic. We're going as steady as we did years ago imo. Nothing's really changed.

The CoC is is very general and very open to interpretation, it's up to every mod. Common sense is where it's at as you said.

As long as a member doesn't make himself overly annoying then he/she is gonna be fine.

@Learn: What?
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Tsar-Ivor
Tsar-Ivor


Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
posted August 22, 2012 01:55 PM
Edited by Tsar-Ivor at 14:02, 22 Aug 2012.

Imagine ME if you'd get smacked every time you opened your mouth, whether you said something worthwhile or garbage is irrelevant if the one hitting you thinks otherwise, so after awhile you learn to keep your mouth, firmly shut.

Edit: @AD I based on a post made by corribus

Heroes games are only getting worse, and the community is starting to fragment, only a matter of time now. (And that's still if we had an admin)
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"No laughs were had. There is only shame and sadness." Jenny

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Adrius
Adrius


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
posted August 22, 2012 02:04 PM
Edited by Adrius at 14:07, 22 Aug 2012.

Bet there was some similar discussion when HoMM IV was released in 2002. Death of Heroes and all that.

Would take 4 years after that for HoMM V to be released but here we are.

EDIT:

But yeah if we had an active admin we could maybe have a Heroes 6 section on AoH and other ****.

Would help a lot.

I remember some moderator having offered Val to hire a programmer on his own money to improve HC but apparently Val denied it (or didn't answer, don't remember.)
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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 22, 2012 02:29 PM

I think that erasing threads is simply unacceptable.
It's a very contemptous way to deal with stuff you don't like - maybe that's how it works in China, but in a US web forum?

It's bad enough, if the powers that are ignore justified pleas. Erasing them is like stomping on you.

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william
william


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
posted August 22, 2012 02:32 PM

This forum is a sinking ship. It isn't as good as it was a couple of years ago. There's only really a handful of members that are really active. A lot of the long standing members have gone and it's gotten rather boring. You can't deny it, Ad, this place isn'tas active as it was a couple of years ago.

As for deleting threads, I agree. It's crap. It's as if every issue you might have is swept under the carpet and you're made to shut up and deal with it. That's fantastic...not.
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~Ticking away the moments that
make up a dull day, Fritter and
waste the hours in an off-hand
way~

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Adrius
Adrius


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Stand and fight!
posted August 22, 2012 02:43 PM
Edited by Adrius at 14:44, 22 Aug 2012.

Well maybe I'm just not veteran enough.

Only been here 5 years so, when people talk about the old days it's often like, 2001.

Personally I haven't really noticed any change. I come here every day, talk a bit in the random thoughts thread... yeah. I never got really active until a few years in though.
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Elvin
Elvin


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Endless Revival
posted August 22, 2012 02:47 PM
Edited by Elvin at 14:49, 22 Aug 2012.

Hehe some have not been around enough to see that HC is moving in cycles just like the economy

I can only admit that toasting forfy's thread without warning was rather drastic but let's face it, the thread had it coming. Forfy has believed that this place is a tyranny since I made it clear that his perverted humour about rape, penises and fingering his anus would not be tolerated. And now he goes on a crusade to revert a three year penalty, do you see a pattern there? But the penalty itself is irrelevant isn't it. The issue is abrupt mod action mixed with bad blood that has been going on for a few years now. You must realize that the feedback thread is for feedback but after it has been considered there is nothing more to be done - that's why there are mods, for a decision to be taken. So you don't like the decision, do you plan to keep discussing it forever? You voiced it, it was considered but eventually it is not up to you, that's just how it is. If you were a mod you would have to make a decision too, whether some posters liked it or not. And goodness, it's not about silencing different opinions, the discussion has simply reached a point where further talk cannot help the situation. You've done your part and life goes on.
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JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted August 22, 2012 02:57 PM

It's not up to you to decide that. People have a right to discuss things as long as they wish - you don't delete or even close threads usually because you think everything has been said. That's sheer arrogance.

And speaking of it - another thing that strikes me very odd and makes me frown is the moderational TONE. It's arrogant, unfriendly, disrespectful and basically against what the CoC promotes.
It's somehow like an alarm signal, that something is WRONG. If people abuse their position and power to do things they wouldn't and shouldn't as the ordinary guy, it's not a good sign at all.

Just because a poster may make it necessary for a mod to become active, it's no reason to talk to them like they were crap.

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Lexxan
Lexxan


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Unimpressed by your logic
posted August 22, 2012 03:13 PM
Edited by Lexxan at 15:17, 22 Aug 2012.

Quote:
This forum is a sinking ship. It isn't as good as it was a couple of years ago. There's only really a handful of members that are really active. A lot of the long standing members have gone and it's gotten rather boring. You can't deny it, Ad, this place isn't as active as it was a couple of years ago.

As for deleting threads, I agree. It's crap. It's as if every issue you might have is swept under the carpet and you're made to shut up and deal with it. That's fantastic...not.


I agree with this. W/r/T the first paragraph: the banter in the past few months rly bores me so  I'm mostly left to lurking and not posting. I don't know why, but I don't feel many topics I'm interested in are topics HC wants to talk about, so I'm not rly motivated to start new topics either, since most people will ignore it anyway.

Again, why are people outraged at angelito's behaviour *now*, while has been consistently self-righteous, patronizing and judgemental ever since he started posting here?

I mean whine about it all you want, but let's face it: he's never gonna change his behaviour, he's never gonna own up to his BS and will silence anyone who is against him. Why wouldn't he? In his mind, he is ALWAYS in the right, after all.
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Lexxan
Lexxan


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Unimpressed by your logic
posted August 22, 2012 03:23 PM

Quote:
Hehe some have not been around enough to see that HC is moving in cycles just like the economy

I can only admit that toasting forfy's thread without warning was rather drastic but let's face it, the thread had it coming. Forfy has believed that this place is a tyranny since I made it clear that his perverted humour about rape, penises and fingering his anus would not be tolerated. And now he goes on a crusade to revert a three year penalty, do you see a pattern there? But the penalty itself is irrelevant isn't it. The issue is abrupt mod action mixed with bad blood that has been going on for a few years now. You must realize that the feedback thread is for feedback but after it has been considered there is nothing more to be done - that's why there are mods, for a decision to be taken. So you don't like the decision, do you plan to keep discussing it forever? You voiced it, it was considered but eventually it is not up to you, that's just how it is. If you were a mod you would have to make a decision too, whether some posters liked it or not. And goodness, it's not about silencing different opinions, the discussion has simply reached a point where further talk cannot help the situation. You've done your part and life goes on.


Forf just wants attention and I don't think his motives were as sincere as "sticking up for injustice".

Nevertheless, deleting that thread was a sign of sheer self-righteous behaviour. People WERE starting to care, with Xerox, Mvass, Tzar all starting reasonable arguments and wanting an answer. REGARDLESS of who started that thread, isn't it normal that a moderator replies to those three at least, rather than deleting the topic and raising questions.

I'm sorry, but deleting the thread was MORONIC and if it ignites the place it's totally well-deserved.
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Coincidence? I think not!!!!

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william
william


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
posted August 22, 2012 03:31 PM

Quote:


I agree with this. W/r/T the first paragraph: the banter in the past few months rly bores me so  I'm mostly left to lurking and not posting. I don't know why, but I don't feel many topics I'm interested in are topics HC wants to talk about, so I'm not rly motivated to start new topics either, since most people will ignore it anyway.

Again, why are people outraged at angelito's behaviour *now*, while has been consistently self-righteous, patronizing and judgemental ever since he started posting here?

I mean whine about it all you want, but let's face it: he's never gonna change his behaviour, he's never gonna own up to his BS and will silence anyone who is against him. Why wouldn't he? In his mind, he is ALWAYS in the right, after all.


I have to agree with everything said in this post 100%. I'm sure you've noticed, but even I'm not posting that much in here anymore. I just think, like Lex said, the banter here is crap. Most of my good friends have gone from this place or aren't as active as they used to be. It's just not as good as it used to be.
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~Ticking away the moments that
make up a dull day, Fritter and
waste the hours in an off-hand
way~

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted August 22, 2012 04:00 PM

Does every forum have to go through this ridiculous cycle?

1. Forum prospers
2. Headadmin leaves
3. Mods go inactive
4. Trolls invade boards
5. People cry for new mods
6. People cry that the chosen mods "abuse power"
7. Regular users can't stand the crying/unfriendly atmosphere and start leaving
8. Forum dies

On countless forums I've been to, it has ALWAYS been the same 8 golden steps, every time. Since this topic was made, I'm guessing we're pretty close to point 7, aren't we?

Just look at you people, spamming the forum in defense of a pathetic 3-year old post of a member who was regularly trolling back then. Don't you have better things in life to do?

Disgusting.
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master_learn
master_learn


Legendary Hero
walking to the library
posted August 22, 2012 04:07 PM

Quote:
Does every forum have to go through this ridiculous cycle?



Doomforge,I think there are people who have nothing better to do,instead of seeking and destroying forums.
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"I heard the latest HD version disables playing Heroes. Please reconsider."-Salamandre

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Tsar-Ivor
Tsar-Ivor


Promising
Legendary Hero
Scourge of God
posted August 22, 2012 04:16 PM
Edited by Tsar-Ivor at 16:21, 22 Aug 2012.

There's no arguing with deluded tyrants. Solution was so simple from the start, but admitting a mistake is so above you that you'd see this place destroyed rather than to admit that you've made a bad call, and that's what I find "disgusting". We chose to draw the line here, if you can't rectify something so petty and unjust, how can any of us expect more in the future?

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william
william


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
LummoxLewis
posted August 22, 2012 04:17 PM
Edited by william at 16:18, 22 Aug 2012.

We're not destroying the bloody forum but we do have the right to say something. So if we disagree with something then we should all shut up and just accept it?
____________
~Ticking away the moments that
make up a dull day, Fritter and
waste the hours in an off-hand
way~

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Doomforge
Doomforge


Admirable
Undefeatable Hero
Retired Hero
posted August 22, 2012 04:22 PM
Edited by Doomforge at 16:26, 22 Aug 2012.

@Tsar: Will you get some sort of satisfaction of someone's "I've been wrong" over the internet, from a random stranger, no less? Don't you really have nothing else to do?

You are defending a troll who has been on rampage for a year and when he finally got penalties, he improved into a fine member he is today. No, the penalty won't go away because he improved. How hard is it to understand? Seriously...

This petty crusade is making me sad.

As for angelito's moderation, if you don't like it, why don't you write to Val about it instead of posting walls of text here? Val may not be around here, but his e-mail is working and he will respond to multiple complaints, of that I'm sure. That's way better than starting an online riot because somebody has been penalized for trolling three years ago.

@William

I'd recommend e-mailing Val if you guys feel someone is doing a bad mod job the reason is simple: Val's not here. The tribunal was made when Val was active and posting here made sense. Right now it doesn't when it concerns something only Val can take care of.
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We reached to the stars and everything is now ours

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