|
| Thread: Wandering creatures attacking your town?! | |
|
space3999
Hired Hero
|
posted May 03, 2001 06:35 AM |
|
|
Wandering creatures attacking your town?!
Here's another idea (which I hope hasn't already been posted). What if wandering creatures on the adventure map could walk around and attack you and your towns? In past Heroes games, the creatures would just stand guaridng a mine or guaridng a passage with a little animation here and there. But I think it would be cool creatures could walk around the map and fight you. Like, after each time you end your turn (or maybe even while you're still taking your turn), creautres would be slowly advancing towards you. And they can attack you in your castle if they want to? Could you imagine a pack of angry Crusaders or Nomads or Dendroid Soldiers coming to the doorstep of your town and trying to take over your town--complete with catapults and ballistas and all? I think this would be cool! Also, the wandering creatures DON'T ALL have to attack. Some just walk around the map. But the idea is that the creautres aren't just standing someplace waiting to be defeated. Some could be aggressive, some nice and friendly and eager to join your army, etc.
Space3999
"The Greatest Druid in the universe needs some sleep....."
____________
|
|
malkia
Promising
Famous Hero
|
|
posted May 03, 2001 08:11 AM |
|
|
How they'll move?
I mean game is Turn Based?
When is their turn? and how they move?
Are they moving by one turn?
Or.. how it's done.. Proably some magic on the LAND - called ANIMATE (not-dead) - and will make creatures to move one cell/turn and go to some castle.
this comes to another idea - to SUMMON creatures on the map - with good DIPLOMACY you can get'em. But this will mess up with balanced game. I often needed some creatures around me to gain experience, make skeletons, get em or just make a proxy TOWN magic - i fight one of my heroes with them - he runs from the battle - and I can take it it again. Humm...
On other side - H4 should be by now up&running -don't think they gonna change anything - as 15 September is only 4-5 months to go - they'll not put anything new.
|
|
TheBlackDragon
Promising
Famous Hero
Dungeon Defender/ Dragon Lord
|
|
posted May 21, 2001 10:00 PM |
|
|
Why would creatures attack your town? What would they do with it? Like a dwarf attacking your castle and creating his own army no logic!
____________
* Dragons Lovers are Friends Of Mine*
|
|
El_Diablo
Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
Lord of Terror
|
posted May 28, 2001 02:31 AM |
|
|
that idea aint as bad as i thought
it would be pretty intresting and harder and possibly more fun to not only have to worry about ur enemies, but also them wandering monsters, i think that would be a not bad idea, and i always like having challenges, and what the monsters would do with it, well it would be like each other colour was invading their home land, and they want to rid everyone from their land, so they would want to attack all intruders, right
____________
*Welcome to Hell*
~~*El Diablo*~~
|
|
malkia
Promising
Famous Hero
|
|
posted May 28, 2001 04:35 AM |
|
|
wandering monsters
If the game was RPG (i mean you have only one hero and that's all) i agree that this will be OK.
But defining what WANDERING CREATURES should do is little bit undefined.. like - each TURN they move one position down/up/left-bottom? Also how can you trace all the creatures wandering around? What is the goal of these creatures - or they are just going random?
It's like - i WANT to be an BOOK WRITER but i don't know what i have to write.
Please define us - what exactly means WANDERING MONSTERS - define their AI, their intentions - rules and such.
____________
|
|
El_Diablo
Bad-mannered
Famous Hero
Lord of Terror
|
posted May 28, 2001 05:39 AM |
|
|
i thought of another reason of y it would be a BAD idea and thats because on maps, about 90% of wandering monsters are placed to guard something, and if they move u could get to alot of free stuff, and would be bad (lol)
____________
*Welcome to Hell*
~~*El Diablo*~~
|
|
arachnid
Promising
Famous Hero
|
posted August 02, 2001 06:42 PM |
|
|
Now heres an idea thats being used and will make a big change to how the game works.
I wonder if space3999 was the first to come up with this idea and if he knows its being used
"On other side - H4 should be by now up&running -don't think they gonna change anything - as 15 September is only 4-5 months to go - they'll not put anything new. "
looks like they did 
____________
|
|
Thunder
Responsible
Famous Hero
|
|
posted August 02, 2001 07:57 PM |
|
|
If I remember right wandering monster will move around a bit in Heroes4.... but I don`t know if they attack towns. That would be great!
____________
|
|
Still
Famous Hero
Your Ultimate Slayer
|
posted August 02, 2001 08:16 PM |
|
|
Well
I hope they don't coz it would be really hard... Like if you were starting the game and there's a pack of dragons, close to your castle. They would easily make your town a nesting ground.
That would be a very bad idea! 
____________
Slayin' all evil for good!
|
|
Harukaba
Tavern Dweller
Wandering Fighter of Justice
|
|
posted August 02, 2001 09:44 PM |
|
|
Only if they think they can win
I remember from the Gamespot interview that the wandering creatures would only attack you if they think they could win. While no mention was made of creatures attacking towns, it is logical that if a town isn't inhabited by any hero or creature and a wandering stack is within range, they could attack the town. However, this is all hypothetical and would be a very good question to ask someone in charge.
____________
If the maneuverings of dark
powers can't be exposed and
defeated by the pure of heart,
then there's no point in
anything. I can't believe that.
|
|
IceDragon
Adventuring Hero
endangered species
|
|
posted August 03, 2001 04:05 AM |
|
|
So what happens if, say, a few black dragons attack a nonaligned castle/town and turn it into their nesting ground? Do they just start living there and making that particular town a bit harder to overtake? And what if 2 groups of creatures moving around just happen to land in the same spot, do they fight each other without a "commanding creature" (boy I can see the dragons having a munchfest on the gremlins) or join up?
As Still said, it would be a bit frustrating to have a group of (insert 7th level critter here) 3 spaces from your town when the game starts so that 3 turns later Godzilla is banging down your village door. I like the idea, though...
Maybe there will be an option to make some creatures stationary and some move around in a small territorial area... like the "grow" option for groups of creatures in the map editor, at least that would allow a certain degree of control.
____________
|
|
UnkaHaakon
Responsible
Famous Hero
happily tilting at windmills
|
|
posted August 03, 2001 04:41 AM |
|
|
Quote:
Maybe there will be an option to make some creatures stationary and some move around in a small territorial area... like the "grow" option for groups of creatures in the map editor, at least that would allow a certain degree of control.
I get the impression from the gamespot interview that this will be the case. Neutral stacks (and neutral heroes) will have a patrol radius. Some stacks will not move (presumably the patrol radius is set to '0').
____________
Some people say the glass is half full..Some people say it's half empty... I say "What're you asking me to drink?"
|
|
malkia
Promising
Famous Hero
|
posted August 03, 2001 06:16 AM |
|
|
Wandering creatures are not so good as idea at all.
1. First they have uncontrolled population (of course NWC can remove ability to populate if is moving - but this sounds to me as deus-ex-machina).
2. When you play against computer or player - you always see how he moves and you try to remmember his moves (not to go to replay last turn) - now you must remmember and this moving creatures. When you play realtime strategy this becomes to you part of your reaction, but in turn-based games you are supposed to think better than react to something near comming.
3. How AI will work on these ones (computer playing agaist wandering creatures)? this will make AI harder to write. AI has to precisely weight which things are more important. AI will be more stupid.
4. What will happen if wandering creatures meet another wandering ones? They gonna fight or combine their powers? (of course - we have to see that).
Summary i think that we don't need so much extra things - a heroes map represents scaled version of very large area - in all history/fantasy books you can read about tribes - they are most of the time dwelling one and same region. They don't move. When they become organized then they start moving - they've started being civilized. But this is what KINGDOMS are for.
hmm.. just my opinion...
____________
|
|
UnkaHaakon
Responsible
Famous Hero
happily tilting at windmills
|
|
posted August 03, 2001 06:59 AM |
|
|
Ok, here's a stab at it:
Quote:
1. First they have uncontrolled population (of course NWC can remove ability to populate if is moving - but this sounds to me as deus-ex-machina).
2. When you play against computer or player - you always see how he moves and you try to remmember his moves (not to go to replay last turn) - now you must remmember and this moving creatures. When you play realtime strategy this becomes to you part of your reaction, but in turn-based games you are supposed to think better than react to something near comming.
3. How AI will work on these ones (computer playing agaist wandering creatures)? this will make AI harder to write. AI has to precisely weight which things are more important. AI will be more stupid.
4. What will happen if wandering creatures meet another wandering ones? They gonna fight or combine their powers? (of course - we have to see that).
Quote:
1. I don't think creature growth will happen the same way in Heroes 4. Remember, a stack may not be composed of one creature type, but can have up to 7, just like any other army. Growth would be difficult to program into this sort of stack. Having all types grow would be a bit much in this case.
2. Neutrals will move in their own turn, just like any other player. This will happen after all other players move (Gamespot preview). In effect (assuming 8 players per game like H3), they'll be a 9th player that is strictly controlled by the AI, that may not have any towns. Just think of neutrals as another player.
3. Why would the AI playing against wandering stacks be any harder to write than say, a Heroes 3 map that has multiple, non-allied computer controlled sides? One of the recent interviews (which one I can't recall) said they're tweaking the AI. Among other things, it'll supposedly make combat decisions based on the damage potential of opponents.
4. I don't think there'll be any swapping of armies between neutrals. That would do horrible things to game balance. I think neutral stacks will probably be programmed to ignore each other. Otherwise, they'd soon wipe each other out in an area.
As you said ..just opinions here.
____________
Some people say the glass is half full..Some people say it's half empty... I say "What're you asking me to drink?"
|
|
malkia
Promising
Famous Hero
|
posted August 03, 2001 07:08 AM |
|
|
if wandering creatures have their turn, then they cannot be thought of wandering creatures - but as it was said in GS review - NEUTRAL ARMY (like in Age of Wonders). But we have already that... in heroes3... It was just an kingdom with status of builder and not in alliance with the others.
In AOW things were different - cause there were impossible to mix different races. Though you can have elfes and neutral elfs - then it makes sense. But you can't have elfes against elfes (non-neutral)? (or at least I can't remmeber that).
I think 3DO/NWC are trying to get ideas from Disciples/AOW which are not so good, but they've always had the sense of mixign things very well - so I hope it will work anyway
Moderator's note:This topic has been closed, as it refers to an older version of the game. To discuss Heroes 3, please go to Library Of Enlightenment, to discuss Heroes 4, please go to War Room Of Axeoth.
____________
|
|
|
|
