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Heroes Community > Other Games Exist Too > Thread: Age of Wonders III
Thread: Age of Wonders III This thread is 36 pages long: 1 10 ... 13 14 15 16 17 ... 20 30 36 · «PREV / NEXT»
Naze
Naze


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 05:12 PM

RMZ1989 said:
Just because of the flanking addition, there isn't a single unit that is useless.


Maybe for majority of the classes, where Tier 4 is summonable (or absent as with Rogue) and it takes some time to summon a single tier 4 unit.
However, when playing Warlord, mass manticore riders is the best strategy (if it can be called strategy). The are stronger than any other unit in your lineup and every metropolis can produce them in 2 days. I mean... that is just  a bit f*cked-up. Sorry for the language.

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RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted April 07, 2014 08:16 PM

Naze said:
RMZ1989 said:
Just because of the flanking addition, there isn't a single unit that is useless.


Maybe for majority of the classes, where Tier 4 is summonable (or absent as with Rogue) and it takes some time to summon a single tier 4 unit.
However, when playing Warlord, mass manticore riders is the best strategy (if it can be called strategy). The are stronger than any other unit in your lineup and every metropolis can produce them in 2 days. I mean... that is just  a bit f*cked-up. Sorry for the language.

Manticore Riders are great, but try Juggernauts.

Also, I didn't mean in late game, of course in late game it is better to make higher tier units, but my point is that there is no unit in the battle that will do absolutely nothing.

Unlike that, lower tier units in AoW2 couldn't even hit higher tier because of no flanking and high defense that end-game units had, but since there is no miss chance in AoW3, I think that every unit has its purpose. Even if their usefulness is small, it is still there.

I remember that I could win 5-6 lower tier units in AoW2 with my single champion unit(be it Dread Ripper, Kharagh or something else), but here even 4 t1 units could kill t4 just because of flanking(it also depends on which t4 unit we are talking about of course, but still).
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Aron
Aron


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 08:42 PM

Sorry for bumping my own question but since Joonas complained about AI doesn't anyone know how the multiplayer works? Are people happy with it? Can a good game be completed in one day (say 4-5 of gameplay?), etc?


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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


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Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 07, 2014 08:50 PM

Simult turns medium maps and under are easily finishable in one evening, large maps not so.

You can speed it up by certain settings, like forced auto-combat, no empire building, faster start, etc.

Of course epics can still happen and even a medium map you can be sitting there till morning in the best possible scenario ^^
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Aron
Aron


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 08:54 PM

Simult turns with tactical combat! O_O Does it paus the turn or wait for all movement to be done and then run combats?

Simult-turns, anyone who has played Civ III or IV know how abusive this can be, people waiting until last second to make rush-moves towards towns, etc. How is this adressed?
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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


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Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 07, 2014 09:00 PM

Don't play with jackasses.
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Aron
Aron


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 09:03 PM
Edited by Aron at 21:06, 07 Apr 2014.

Haha jackasses? I played in top tourneys in Civ III. It was the norm.
Thing was it sorta worked in Civ III because you had so many units that moving all of them at once was impossible. So imagine this: A turn is a few min long.

People build, get production going, get some workers working.


Then the last 30 sec everyone are on their toes and massive army shifts suddenly start happening. Entire fronts collapsing, frontal assults to breach defenses, scout moves using roads and horses or tanks cut off supplies...and then calm again.

(The most abusive tactic consisted of naval invasions. You move your units at the last second and then at the first second next turn. Capturing coastal cities before he can send troops to them. You got paranoid about every city you had at the coast in late-game since ships had huge movement points).

But obviously it was highly abusive and anyone who lagged was at a huge disadvantage. It's not about being a jackass, the one doing the first move is at a disadvantage to the one doing the second move and so on.

So you don't experience this? Is there any turn-based mode?
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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


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Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 07, 2014 09:15 PM
Edited by JoonasTo at 21:18, 07 Apr 2014.

Of course, classic turns are still in and naturally you can use them if you want.

Hardly an issue if you scout and move your units properly. You can't miracle defend your cities anyway. Armies don't move across vast distances in a turn or two like in Civ.

You don't have commando tanks here like in Civ, commando panzers were the most ridiculous OP thing ever.
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Aron
Aron


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 09:18 PM
Edited by Aron at 21:20, 07 Apr 2014.

Ah, that's good.

So how does scouting work. Can a weaker hero be dual-turn rushed from out of fog of war or not?  


Anyway if multiplayer is stabile I guess I'll give it a try. It looks so damn sexy.



edit: Ah. You know about Commando Panzers so you did play Civ!
Yes. Those were very very funneh, no?




My capital ------*Bloody everything*----- Your capital
Number of turns: 2.
Number of seconds: 10.
Smashed Keyboard: Priceless.
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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


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Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 07, 2014 09:24 PM

Sadly, it isn't stable.
There are some issues but they are working on it.


If you just blind move hero into hostile territory it doesn't have to be even one turn rushed.  

Late game flyer armies have around 10 hex moves on the map. So even with double rush you can just move 20 at best and with flyers at that. A city is 3 hex wide so 7 cities in two turns to give you some perspective.

Remember that the death of a hero is not the end of the game, they abandoned assasination as game rule after the original age of wonders. Your main will just return to void and be reborn in a few turns time at your capitol.
You can resurrect your other heroes with magic later in the game too.
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Aron
Aron


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 09:29 PM

But is there any fog of war after land is explored or not?
Cause if there is what I am wonder is if line of sight exceeds the maximum movement speed x 2 so say 20 hexes or not.


If there isn't any fog of war then I guess it's not a big issue.


Oh yeah, I asked this before too: Is there any DC protection? If I crash and leave can I rejoin the game? Is it in the lobby? can it be easily saved and re-started?
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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


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Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 07, 2014 10:34 PM
Edited by JoonasTo at 22:36, 07 Apr 2014.

Yeah, autosaves plus load from save, simple as that.

Of course there is fog of war. It's instant and regular field of view is just three hexes. If you don't scout, you're just waiting to get sneaked upon.

A quick 20 minute game on a small map(land and no underground) against an Emperor AI looks like this btw. All things average in map setting. Just to give you a bit of an image of the scope.




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Aron
Aron


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 10:50 PM

Can't see how you can avoid abuse then. And obviously HoMM doesn't have Fog of War so why should it be an obvious fact ? ; )


But it looks great, I like the zoomed out map there. Reminds me of Elemental!

Three hexes seems to small for fog of war. I can barely remember AoW 2 but wasn't it much larger?
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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


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Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 07, 2014 11:09 PM

It doesn't let you zoom out fully in the aftermath scene, there's about ten hexes more to the west on that map but that's all unexplored since the westmost city was AI capitol. This also shows that at average distance settings the towns are 20-25 hexes apart, that means 4 turns for normal units and 3 turns for fast flying units.

All AoWs have had fog of war so it's a given this one has too. You can see that cities have vision some hexes outside of their domain too.

You're supposed to scout properly, three hexes is more than enough for regular units. It's not like the enemy can see you anymore than you can.
Besides, what's he going to take out with that? A city on the border? Who gives a crap really? If you have an undefended border city you're either on attack yourself or that city is useless.

I am kinda sad that mountains don't affect vision at all. You shouldn't be able to see over them with ground troops from the other side without climbing on one. It would add more depth to the game. Perhaps even give extra vision to ground units on mountains.
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RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted April 07, 2014 11:12 PM
Edited by RMZ1989 at 23:13, 07 Apr 2014.

Aron said:
Can't see how you can avoid abuse then. And obviously HoMM doesn't have Fog of War so why should it be an obvious fact ? ; )


But it looks great, I like the zoomed out map there. Reminds me of Elemental!

Three hexes seems to small for fog of war. I can barely remember AoW 2 but wasn't it much larger?

HoMM has Fog of War, what are you talking about?

EDIT: Oh you mean the map didn't get hidden after you leave it, yeah I guess it didn't work that way in HoMM.
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Aron
Aron


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 11:19 PM
Edited by Aron at 23:20, 07 Apr 2014.

Meh 3 hexes when I can double move 20 is ridicilous. You can't scout that unless you can capture outposts or something.

I assume you can strip your hero of units and move them without a hero? But even then! Now fog of war is obviously even more punishing in Civ but then you have borders, fighter jets and you have hundreds of units.

It can be interesting but it is sure punishing.

Yeah I would also like to see mountains limiting sight, adds some dynamic.
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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


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Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 07, 2014 11:41 PM

Who's saying you don't have hundreds of units in AoW?

You need to realise that six flyers can hardly do anything alone in the late game other than get butchered horribly. Nothing worth killing at that part of the game is moving in small enough numbers to be taken out like that.

Another thing you need to recognise that it's exactly because there isn't ridiculous field of view for units that rushing at the end doesn't work that well. You simply don't know where to go without scouting.

Players can also un-end their turn any time they wish so when they see you rushing somewhere(because they scout, if they're half-decent at the game) they will just un-end their turn and lightning storm your rushers, rendering them worthless, or in the case of sorcerers with age of magic, dead. ^^
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Aron
Aron


Known Hero
posted April 07, 2014 11:45 PM

Cool, alright.

I don't get how un-ending a turn helps if you've moved all units you've got tho.
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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted April 14, 2014 11:45 PM

There was a patch a couple of days ago.

Mostly concentrated on fixing the performance issues and crashes but some other good things came from it too.

Quote:
‘Shadow stalker’ now does cold damage. This fixes an issue where rogues had limited options vs. blight immune troops.
Increased the research costs of skills to slow down progression through the skill tree.
Increased cost of racial tier 3 unit building to 300 gold and 100 mana.
Decreased the base production of cities.

These should take care of some balance issues.

Quote:
Campaign: Heroes being mind controlled no longer causes you to instantly lose a campaign map if you rescue them by the end of combat.

Campaign: Heroes which are protected by the ‘resurgence’ effect – e.g. the theocrat’s ‘rebirth’ spell – can now die in tactical combat without causing you to lose the campaign map, as long as you win the battle that they die in.

This was really annoying in campaign, so you who have not yet finished it can now take advantage of these.

There were also some AI improvements but not nearly enough to make it a viable opponent past first games.
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Naze
Naze


Known Hero
posted April 30, 2014 07:28 PM

Do you remember, how a lot of people complained about H6, and for months there were no updates? Well, this is a professional approach:

Age of Wonders III, update 1.1 one month after release

P.S.: I don't want to flame/hate post on H6, it was a good game and I spent a lot of time playing it. I just wish, Ubi chose its developers more carefully.

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