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| Thread: The Unexplained Thread |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 · «PREV |
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted August 27, 2016 08:04 AM |
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@Maurice
Well, guardian spirits projecting us the future is just as improbable (to the point of non-existent). It didn't even cross my mind a sane person would consider it as a serious possibility.
Rest of your post is not possible because tiniest detail going this way or that way has ever-expanding consequences in the future, chaos theory, butterflies, hurricanes and all that stuff...
@Fred
It did happen to me, it happens to everybody. The neurological explanation is sufficient, so I see no reason to disregard it.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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Celfious
Promising
Legendary Hero
From earth
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posted August 27, 2016 11:08 AM |
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted August 27, 2016 03:35 PM |
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artu said:
@Maurice
Well, guardian spirits projecting us the future is just as improbable (to the point of non-existent). It didn't even cross my mind a sane person would consider it as a serious possibility.
It's just as sane as people believing in omnipotent and omniscient beings or heaven and hell  . There are billions of people in the world who take that as a truth just as well.
In any case, I think time is non-linear in nature, it's just us perceiving it in a linear fashion.
As an interesting side note, if an entity exists that's omniscient, that entity knows the start and end of time and everything in between and hence, is essentially outside the boundaries of time due to having knowledge of the future. Furthermore, this means that either everything is already set in stone and we come back to the fact that time can evolve in only one way, or everything is possible and anything goes, which means we're basically all omniscient, since whatever we can think of is somewhere, someplace, sometime a reality.
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Rest of your post is not possible because tiniest detail going this way or that way has ever-expanding consequences in the future, chaos theory, butterflies, hurricanes and all that stuff...
And I guess you missed the concept I sketched of the smallest infinitessimal detail and evolution of the universe? Basically, something happens because every condition required to make it happen, has been met. If a state transition as I sketched has multiple different outcomes, the set of conditions as captured in the snapshot isn't complete - which might indicate the horizon to capture all conditions has to be expanded, possibly beyond the (dimensional) boundaries of the universe, which immediately implies that in order to understand the universe and all the seemingly random events we have to accept the fact that there's "something" outside our universe that influences what happens inside it. Something of which we have no clue or concept yet - maybe we'll never have, since we're locked inside this very universe and subject to its conditions.
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@Fred
It did happen to me, it happens to everybody. The neurological explanation is sufficient, so I see no reason to disregard it.
It doesn't explain what happened during that phone call. The memory triggered before it happened, unlike what's usual the case with deja-vu experiences. I knew what was going to happen just before it happened. I can't explain that one with multi-threading brain functions. In fact, I can't explain it at all, other than that my brain somehow, someway managed to perceive a very short glimpse of the future.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted August 27, 2016 04:19 PM |
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Edited by artu at 16:32, 27 Aug 2016.
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First of all, it does explain what happens during that phone call since it happens within a matter of seconds and deja vu mostly happens as you go along the experience. Feeling like you are predicting/just about to predict the next few moments is mostly part of the illusion. If you had sat down in the morning, predicted a phone call that was going to occur in the evening with every tiny detail and hours later it did, that would be different. Our perception of time is not perfect and it can create such momentary glitches.
Secondly, a personal guardian spirit calling out details of every day life is not identical to the typical characterization of God. In most monotheistic beliefs, there is a free will and you are responsible for your actions, you are rewarded or punished for them. But in both cases, you can't be both omniscient AND omnipotent, anyway. It's a logical paradox since omniscience requires everything to be predetermined while omnipotence requires nothing to be, the opposite. In other words, if everything is "set in stone" than what is "the guardian" protecting you from? (A regular phone call it seems while he must have been preventing all those car accidents.) And if everything is not set in stone, then the whole concept is out.
I think all this logic is not necessary to begin with anyway though, since there is already a much more simpler and natural explanation (which includes what happened to you). Some super natural persona(s) outside this universe taking the time to protect billions of individuals of billions of generations from tiny miny details of everyday life in quite an unpractical fashion by sending them blur visions moments before things occur, does not sound like something we can't imagine, on the contrary, it sounds just like the type of thing we would traditionally imagine. Try picturing bacteria with a similar set of beliefs, that each one has its life being watched over by guardian spirits and they intervene when the bacteria is about to get in trouble, does it make sense to you.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted August 27, 2016 07:18 PM |
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artu said:
@Fred
It did happen to me, it happens to everybody. The neurological explanation is sufficient, so I see no reason to disregard it.
okeedokee.  you DO know that it makes no difference what you believe, right? because belief doesn't change fact. theory certainly doesn't, either. and like maurice said, that explanation doesn't even apply. if you can predict an event unfolding because you dreamed it, then the explanation you provided(by whatever source) is moot at best, and self-deceptive at worst.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted August 27, 2016 07:23 PM |
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The foresight (dreamt or felt) is the illusion itself.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted August 27, 2016 07:23 PM |
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Edited by Maurice at 19:26, 27 Aug 2016.
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artu said:
Feeling like you are predicting/just about to predict the next few moments is mostly part of the illusion.
But that's the whole point. I recalled the dream and the conversation part that was in it, not as it happened, but way before that. The memory didn't pop up as the call unfolded, it popped up about 10-15 seconds before it happened. I realised it was a very peculiar and special moment, because unlike most deja-vu's, the memory surfaced so long before the actual event. And because I noticed this rather odd situation, my mind forked into two separate thought streams: one that tried to focus on the conversation and the other one on the memory, its anticipation when it would come in the call and the very weird feeling that I already knew something that was yet (about) to happen. I vividly and actively realised it.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted August 27, 2016 07:35 PM |
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Well, my guess is, retrospectively, you remember that "15 seconds" longer now and the whole foresight more lucid than they actually were. I understand, it may not "feel" like that at all when you look back but people are very capable of self-deception in such matters and we reconstruct our memories in ways much more radical than your example. Look at how you describe the situation in the first place as an outsider:
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Mind you, the time frame between realisation and recollection of the predicting dream and the actual question was maybe a handful of seconds, where I was trying to focus on the conversation too, so I just didn't have much time if at all to think this through.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted September 01, 2016 11:06 PM |
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EnergyZ
Legendary Hero
President of MM Wiki
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posted September 01, 2016 11:09 PM |
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Maybe it is the light coming from the guns or something.
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