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| Thread: I need some help beating a particular battle | |
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hollow
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 13, 2013 11:42 PM |
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I need some help beating a particular battle
Well, Hello, as you can easily notice, I am a newly registred user, I have been stalking the HC for quite some time and finaly decided to reg my self. Ok onto the subject
I started playing the famous map "Unleashing the Bloodthirsty" , a very good map indeed. I've had some trouble with the fortress, but I overcame it and proceeded. I ended up beating the Tower, Rampart, Necropolis and Inferno with little losses. Currently I have to beat the castle guy and I am about to give a load of information about my army size and his.
It is in the end of month 14. I started at knight difficulty - 100%
My army consists of:
727 titans
1562 chaos hydras
4360 mighty gorgons
1604 behemoths
3530 wyvern monarchs
15 rust dragons
-empty slot-
My enemy's army is:
4777 zealots
5999 crusaders
9887 marksmen
8724 royal griffins
3555 champions
1222 archangels
9999 halbardiers
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I have tried several strategies:
Strategy I
Since I have the speed advantage, I start first and blind the archangels, then place the rust dragons in front of the castle door, then shoot with the titans and usualy 6800-7300 marksmen perish. Sometimes I get moral bonus and kill all of the marksmen. The I position the rest of my troops guarding the titans. The enemy would respond with casting mass prayer, defending with all of his troops and shooting at my wyverns usualy around 1400 perish.Next round I cast forgetfulness and wait with the rust dragon, then finish of marksmen (if not finished) or start shooting the crusaders. To this the AI responds with mass slow and kills my rust dragons with his griffins, I instantly kill his griffins with my behemoths (since they are positioned in a way that they will reach anything attacking the rust dragon. He defends his troops. next round he has the speed advantage (due to prayer + mass slow on my units) He casts cure unblinding all his troops.Zealots shoot at wyverns around 400 perish,Attacks hydras with archangel around 600-700 perish, countering for ~200 archangels. Attacks Behemoths with Champions - they all perish. Crusaders double strike my hydras all hydras perish, leaving me with roughly said 2000 wyverns, 727 titans and 4360 mighty gorgons. I'd try to get rid of his archangels, blinding champions and then I strike with the titans - ~250 archangels perish, Wyverns strike 400 archangels persih, counter attacking for 600 wyverns, mighty gorgons finish of archangels. Next round crusader's speed is still superior, blind on mighty gorgons, double strike titans - 380~400 titans perish per hit, Halbardiers are in range hitting wyverns usualy leaving me with a misserably low numbers. Battle is pretty much over. Since mighty gorgons are blinded, I skip my turn. AI cures champions and strikes with all units at mighty gorgons killing them before i get my turn.
I managed to beat the him with my 3rd strategy (I will write the other 2 down tommorow since it is getting too late), but again taking too much casualties leaving me with
727 titans
2600 wyvern monarchs
3900 mighty gorgons
500 chaos hydras
I find this quite unacceptable. Please suggest me what should I try in order to suffer less losses. What creatures should I bring (I got plenty of creatures in reserve except Naga Queens, cause I lost around 800-900 in previous large battles. )
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master_learn
Legendary Hero
walking to the library
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posted October 14, 2013 01:30 PM |
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@hollow,my respect to your detailed post.
I wish I could help you with a straight answer,but I haven't played the map.
But I know that if you visit the MapHavenGuild you will see the thread dedicated to the map you ask for.
The discussion about the map is located here .
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"I heard the latest HD version disables playing Heroes. Please reconsider."-Salamandre
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hollow
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 14, 2013 06:30 PM |
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Well thanks for the link (and the replay) master_learn. I had already seen this topic. I spended around half an hour to read all the comments till 10th page (8-9 pages left). Most of the comments are solutions to earlier battles or later battles. I found this video in one of the comments-
"http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJUezWiFqVM"
Strategy there will not help me since the player played at start difficulty 200% and the AI acts differently. Looks dumber to me though since my AI will usualy cast cure or clone on his archangels which leads to my defeat or Pyrrhic victory.
Sorry I didnot mention I have already seen this thread
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hollow
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 14, 2013 07:57 PM |
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Strategy II
Well since blinding the archangels was not successful, I tried spliting my Rust dragons into two 1st stack 14 and 1 stack of 1 rust dragon. The battle will strat wih me berserking his archangels. Placing first stack of 14 Rust Draogons in front of the door (a must for every battle), then destroying the first aid tent next to the archangel with the single rust dragon. Archangels strike Champions with resulting in the death of over 1100 champions and 170 archangels. Since titans are faster than his units (Aangels lost a turn) I strike down his marksmen. And defending with my remaining troops. AI will always cast prayer and then kill the single rust dragon with his griffins, and the 14 stack with his marksmen. Zealots will most probably pick wyverns as a target. He will move champions in the moat and wait with troops he can't move. The death of all my rust dragons leaves me with fastest creature - the titan (11 speed + 4 from artefacts) The second round starts with a mass slow casted by the AI. Marksmen get ressurected by the Archangels, Royal Griffins attack hydras 400 hydras perish and also 1000 griffins perish, Champions strike the behemoths. Since champions are not at their full strenght, behemoths will be left half dead from 16004 to 140-150, Zealots and marksmen will shoot hydras and crusaders will enter the moat. When my turn comes I have almost lost the battle having only my mighty gorgons at their start value, titans at their starting value around 2k wyverns and half of my hydras. I blind archangels (1090 archangels) and try to beat his champions with all my forces. Next round champions are still allive they move to destroy catapult. My mighty gorgons get blinded, Crusaders double strike annihilate hydras. Sometimes moral helps crusaders to double strike the titan too. Shooters massacre the wyverns with zealots killing ~1k per hit and marksmen (resurrected) killing ~450 per hit. I skip my turn since gorgons are blinded. Pretty much the end of the battle.
Note: After replaying a few times with the third strategy (that I never wrote down) I managed to get the losses to only 3530 wyverns. I wonder if someone can do it with even lesser casualties 
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markmasters
Famous Hero
Dragon of justice
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posted October 15, 2013 11:58 AM |
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Hello,
I did not play the map myself, but i can see your problem. I do not know about your magic schools but here might be a plan:
Split the rust dragons like you did befre, let a single 1 attack the archangels, let the second group block the castle door.
Use as first spell mirror image on one of your units (preferable titans?) im pretty sure the AI will send his AA to destroy the mirror image, and since it has reteliated already you can pick it off quite easily.
Im not sure if it works for you, but if i want to lure an opponent unit out i usualy try something like this :. The remainder of the battle can be like you did before
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Nebuka
Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
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posted October 15, 2013 12:27 PM |
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Edited by Nebuka at 12:30, 15 Oct 2013.
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Was just at the same place, same battle. Replayed it couple of times until finally managed to beat it without losses. Well, don't count here 1111 hobgoblins that were there for Sacrifice use only.
My army, and what I did in the first few turns...
I just had to blind archies in the first turn, nothing else that I've tried worked for me. And while I blocked the gate with my devils, attacked zealots with monarchs to block them and entertain griffins too. Titans and elves almost killed archers in the mean time, and then surrounded elves with hydras and gorgons.
Now, in battle before I blinded then griffins, but that turned out to be slightly worse move, as AI then teleported his champions and wreak havok to my hydras. In that battle I did win, but couldn't bring back around 1500 monarchs.
In the last battle I now blinded champions rather. Rather to leave griffins free with their much lower damage input. Then it was a matter of blinding the crusaders and halbeiders (who soon after fell). Griffins fell against fortress troops.
With lots of spell points, managed to bring all of my troops, and with bless-prayer-slow combo, with blind in between, easily killed all of blinded troops.
Btw, those 1111 hobgoblins managed to bring back 1400 monarchs! Sacrifice is outstanding.
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hollow
Tavern Dweller
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posted October 15, 2013 03:08 PM |
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markmasters, your strategy would probably work, but I at that time I didnot have the clone spell. A good suggestion though.
Nebuka, thanks for the screenshots, I tried it an it turned out a very good strategy helped me reduce the number of casualties to only 1600 wyverns since I didnot bring a sacrafical stack. With a sacrafical stack of 1600 gnolls did the trick and battle ran smoothly.
Thanks again to everyone for the quick responses.
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revolut1oN
Famous Hero
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posted October 15, 2013 03:13 PM |
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First thing, always play this map on Impossible. You don't have any resources at start regardless of difficulty, lower settings just increase chance for getting bugged game (AI acts differently)
Second thing, haven't played the map in a quite long time, but isnt 14 months EXTREMELY late for a Castle fight?
Basically I always kill Fortress around week 5, then can be some troubles vs Tower, but if you outmicro his heroes to get ressurection it gets quite easy.
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Nebuka
Promising
Supreme Hero
Save me Jebus!
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posted October 16, 2013 09:12 AM |
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Edited by Nebuka at 13:06, 16 Oct 2013.
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Anyone have some advice for Dragonmaster? At the moment looks absolutely unbeatable, but then again, Freakenstein and Bullhead did too for some time, and then found the way to beat them without losses (save for sacrificial stacks, of course).
Thought about secondary heroes berserk him up a bit, but can't reach tavern as have 86 knowledge (with arties).
My army (think I have lots of spare titans I couldn't buy before, don't think it matters much though).
EDIT: There's some promise with just ancients and devils, with few gold dragons. Have to get both of them behind forcefield, but still those 6000+ minotaurs x2 and 9000 medusas destroy most of my ancients before I could clone them and slowly kill Dragonmaster's troops.
EDIT2: Definitely a way to go. Brought Dragonmaster just to 1000 blacks, and needed just one strike from ancients to finish him, but was in the process of resurrecting them, and while doing that (1000 spell points for around 900 ancients? 15 raised, 24 spell points force field/resurrection combo...think around 200-300 will be lost forever) my hard drive failed. But as said, seems to be the way to go.
EDIT3: Now looking, feels easy as hell. Around 300 archangels for quicker resurrection, 4xGold Dragon, 5000+ ancients and around 600 archdevils. First turn, one gold in front of gate, others move just a bit not to get 2 killed by the same dragon stack, blinded medusas. AI's blacks went for archies, red dragons and manticores/septicores went for couple of golds and ammo cart/catapult. Second turn, force field to cover ancients and devils, AI does nothing much, save to kill remaining goldies. Now in third turn, it blinds my archies, but I just counter with anti-magic. And from that point on, it's just a matter of force field/clone ancients combo.AI usually does nothing, that is, if you concentrate first on his black dragons. Couple of times, if I tried to get rid of mantis or septicores, or red dragons, AI might cast cure, and that brings its medusas in play again. So, first blacks, then reds. I managed to completely destroy reds in two cloned ancients strikes, and luckily manticore landed on reds corpse to get rid of my clone. Now could've started on decimating mantis/scorpicores, and AI usually brings them back by sacrificing medusas and minotaurs. At the end just blind the last stack, resurrect some things if had some losses (in my last battle, AI actually teleported minotaurs to attack my ancients - not too many casaulities though).
Had the similar tactic for azures near obelisks, and all I'm left with is final battle, where I'll probably use the same tactic - with prolly titans in place of archdevils. Too bad my 2000+ archangels which I got for 180,000 of each resource will not see the battle.
Immense map, looking forward to playing it again in 3-4-5 years, when my love for Heroes comes biting back.
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Aegisdivine
Adventuring Hero
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posted October 25, 2013 01:46 AM |
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How does the map play is it linear?
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DieDevil
Adventuring Hero
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posted October 27, 2013 05:32 PM |
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Haven't played that map, but have you considered Mind control or frenzy? those spells just stand out to me as you can really wreak havoc on them with it.
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted October 27, 2013 05:36 PM |
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It's just to be sure, but you're not confusing them with their heroes 5 counterparts, right?
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DieDevil
Adventuring Hero
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posted October 27, 2013 05:50 PM |
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Aren't they the same? I'm not confusing them for spells in H5, but they do work the same way, correct?
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OhforfSake
Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
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posted October 27, 2013 06:17 PM |
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I always thought frenzy in heroes 5 was the equivalent of berserk in heroes 3, but I've only ever read about heroes 5.
To clarify, in heroes 3, frenzy drops your units defense stat and adds it to its attack stat (at higher rates for higher fire magic mastery).
I thought you might have mistaken them, because I don't think frenzy is usually put under the category of mind magic.
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted October 27, 2013 07:42 PM |
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OhforfSake said:
I always thought frenzy in heroes 5 was the equivalent of berserk in heroes 3, but I've only ever read about heroes 5.
Yes it is, you are right forfy
(ofc there are some minor differences, like dealing extra damage and 2 attacks if Expert Dark Magic)
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