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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Announcements, Questions, Features
Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Announcements, Questions, Features This Super Thread is 548 pages long: 1 ... 27 28 29 30 31 ... 70 140 210 280 350 420 490 548 · «PREV / NEXT»
SolidCyrus
SolidCyrus


Hired Hero
aka Cyrus Annihilator
posted January 16, 2014 10:05 PM

Macron1 said:
PS There is a lot of Forges now, so I like it ideas, but think that HOTA could focus on Cathedral, then repeat Forge another time.


Well, I don't know if HotA team is accepting suggestions, but if I could vote, I prefer the Cathedral town too.
Their Forge town is great, but the Cathedral is totally badass!
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[url=http://cyrusannihilator.blogspot.com/]Cyrus Annihilator[/url]

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Stevie
Stevie


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted January 16, 2014 10:28 PM

I haven't seen any Cathedral, where's that?

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Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted January 16, 2014 10:36 PM

Stevie said:
I haven't seen any Cathedral, where's that?

It was in the old announcement, as well as Kronverk (snow dwarf town). See:



Units animations


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fred79
fred79


Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
posted January 16, 2014 10:47 PM
Edited by fred79 at 00:10, 17 Jan 2014.

blob2 said:
H.R. Giger meets Cthulhu. The idea is "nice" but definately not Heroes III material


giger? lol. try dali. giger's darker, more visceral, sexual, and machine-like. come to think of it, hodi comes to mind, as well.

btw, Forge kicks ass.

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fred79
fred79


Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
posted January 16, 2014 10:57 PM

Hobbit said:

Elements of this style are still present in HoMM3. Just look at Beholders, Imps' big noses, Armageddon's icon (nuclear bomb ftw) or many artifacts. It's not serious fantasy, like HoMM5-6, LotR, Elder Scrolls etc. - people who were creating HoMM were just having fun.


this explains a lot, actually. i guess when starting out, they didn't think that people would end up taking it as seriously as they did. they learned how serious people were with it when they saw the reactions to Forge. it probably took the wind out of their sails... having to forgo the awesome Forge for the stupid Conflux, just to please the knuckleheads. just think of it, we could have had Forge from the getgo...

to all the haters: catapult. aim yourself at the sun. do it. now.

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MagniBronzeb...
MagniBronzebeard


Adventuring Hero
posted January 16, 2014 11:00 PM

Horn of the abyss has following towns in plan, in order:

HotA 1.0: Cove town
HotA 2.0: Kronverk
HotA 3.0: Cathedral

so there is no room for forge or whatsoever. After 3.0 I doubt it will be continued, if we are lucky we get 2.0 next year, this cannot span into eternity.

Although I am not so fond about Cathedral, looks criss cross of Castle and Inferno (maybe Necropolis), does not seem that original than other towns.

Kronverk looks an adaptation of dwarf town from heroes 5.

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Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted January 16, 2014 11:02 PM

MagniBronzebeard said:
Horn of the abyss has following towns in plan, in order:

HotA 1.0: Cove town
HotA 2.0: Kronverk
HotA 3.0: Cathedral

so there is no room for forge or whatsoever. After 3.0 I doubt it will be continued, if we are lucky we get 2.0 next year, this cannot span into eternity.

Although I am not so fond about Cathedral, looks criss cross of Castle and Inferno (maybe Necropolis), does not seem that original than other towns.

Kronverk looks an adaptation of dwarf town from heroes 5.


That is the old plan - and it's clear they've changed their plans. If you look at the original thread, in the very old pics you'll see a ton of neutral units and artifacts, but they aren't in our current HotA
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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
posted January 16, 2014 11:04 PM
Edited by verriker at 23:04, 16 Jan 2014.

MagniBronzebeard said:
Horn of the abyss has following towns in plan, in order:
HotA 1.0: Cove town
HotA 2.0: Kronverk
HotA 3.0: Cathedral
so there is no room for forge or whatsoever


uh, no, lol, you're using information dating back to like 2008, there.
Forge is up next, in the distant future

edit - beaten into the ground

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blob2
blob2


Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
posted January 17, 2014 12:09 AM
Edited by blob2 at 00:33, 17 Jan 2014.

Hobbit said:
Elements of this style are still present in HoMM3. Just look at Beholders, Imps' big noses, Armageddon's icon (nuclear bomb ftw) or many artifacts. It's not serious fantasy, like HoMM5-6, LotR, Elder Scrolls etc. - people who were creating HoMM were just having fun.


If you say so, I can deny it might be the truth. You seem to be more "into" the lore then me, and probably you are a lot more knowledgeable then me in the matters of the universe (and all the info that came straight from the devs). I've never actually read NWC people interviews, nor did I play Might and Magic games. I'm a fan of Heroes III itself. You say that the game can't be taken seriously, but for me it has a perfect fantasy climate. It was unfortunate for me to call Heroes III "hard fantasy", but the game has really set some of my standards for how a fantasy RTS game should look like (it is probably connected to the fact that I was only just starting to get into fantasy at the time of it's release). Even if it would make people at NWC laugh, some people really treat this game in a special way...

Fred79 said:
this explains a lot, actually. i guess when starting out, they didn't think that people would end up taking it as seriously as they did. they learned how serious people were with it when they saw the reactions to Forge. it probably took the wind out of their sails... having to forgo the awesome Forge for the stupid Conflux, just to please the knuckleheads. just think of it, we could have had Forge from the getgo...

to all the haters: catapult. aim yourself at the sun. do it. now.


I could say the same to you Fred, but what's the use. Everyone of us has his tastes. I, for instance, liked Conflux for Ice Elementals, Psychic Elementals or Firebirds. And I liked the idea for this faction (though it wasn't executed perfectly: Fire or Earth Elementals were plain s*it), because not many RTS games give you a chance to play an actual Elemantal-based faction. Usually Elementals have a form of summoning spells or neutral creeps. So Conflux is actually one of a kind.

If HotA team will release Forge I will definitely take a look, see how it plays, if only from the sheer respect for the fantastic work they do. It just saddens me that they started to prioritize it, I've liked their 2008 plan more

PS: Oh and Hobbit about the Beholder, I was thinking more about this

=?

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Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted January 17, 2014 12:24 AM

Jumping on the Forge discussion, people (and that includes you, Hobbit) shouldn't forget that many players only played HoM&M games - and many of them only Heroes 3. And Heroes has been traditionally presented as a generic, fantasy theme - no sci-fi there.

So, while the addition of Forge can be justified by M&M universe lore, the reaction from Heroes fans is also reasonable - and justified, since it goes against what they've been presented (and what they love).

Just that
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blob2
blob2


Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
posted January 17, 2014 12:28 AM
Edited by blob2 at 00:35, 17 Jan 2014.

Nicely put Storm-Giant, I'm one of those fans (you don't say Captain Obvious )...

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Hobbit
Hobbit


Supreme Hero
posted January 17, 2014 01:28 AM
Edited by Hobbit at 01:39, 17 Jan 2014.

blob2 said:
Even if it would made people at NWC laugh, some people really treat this game in a special way...

Okay, the word "seriously" was a little bit unfortunate. What I meant is that it shouldn't be taken in the same way e.g. A Song of Ice and Fire is. It's still the great game that did set some standards of gameplay, but many people seem to not realize that the game visuals themselves aren't that serious. It's more of "Hey, let's make a game with strange fantastic creatures" way, very similar to, as I said earlier, first RPGs. With this logic you can actually put anything you want in a fantasy game, and sci-fi works there just perfectly.

Although I have to admit it wasn't really something that made MM universe unique - it was the deal with many other fantasy universes, including those most popular (I already talked a lot about Spelljammer, but Final Fantasy is another perfect example). The story of MM was unique, but thinking about fantasy as something without actual rules wasn't something that uncommon these times. It was until Jackson's Lord of the Rings which hit the mainstream - that's when all this epic games started to be made and that's probably where your definition of "standard fantasy" came from, more or less consciously.

With that said, it's still your own opinion and I can't do much about it.

blob2 said:
Oh and Hobbit about the Beholder, I was thinking more about this

I know Beholder isn't something made by NWC. But the design of Beholder in HoMM3 is something quite unique, and it isn't something as serious as one from 3rd edition of D&D. Besides, D&D's beholder was also more funny in the beginning.

Storm-Giant said:
Jumping on the Forge discussion, people (and that includes you, Hobbit) shouldn't forget that many players only played HoM&M games - and many of them only Heroes 3. And Heroes has been traditionally presented as a generic, fantasy theme - no sci-fi there.

That's the main problem - they were presented as a generic fantasy  while they weren't like that.

And I'm not trying to defend Forge just because of the lore - that's not the case, I know that most of you don't give a crap about lore. I'm trying to defend Forge because I believe Heroes 3 is not a game where there's no room for anything but traditional mainstream fantasy creatures.

Besides, Docent Picolan was right about one thing: the same controversy with HotA already had place when many people were angry about Pirates' pistols and Cannons. But after releasing the add-on - everyone just forgot about that.
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MagniBronzeb...
MagniBronzebeard


Adventuring Hero
posted January 17, 2014 07:30 AM

Storm-Giant said:
MagniBronzebeard said:
Horn of the abyss has following towns in plan, in order:

HotA 1.0: Cove town
HotA 2.0: Kronverk
HotA 3.0: Cathedral

so there is no room for forge or whatsoever. After 3.0 I doubt it will be continued, if we are lucky we get 2.0 next year, this cannot span into eternity.

Although I am not so fond about Cathedral, looks criss cross of Castle and Inferno (maybe Necropolis), does not seem that original than other towns.

Kronverk looks an adaptation of dwarf town from heroes 5.


That is the old plan - and it's clear they've changed their plans. If you look at the original thread, in the very old pics you'll see a ton of neutral units and artifacts, but they aren't in our current HotA


This is not good. Changing plans was never productive. No wonder why they take so long. But I still wonder where is the place of Kronverk in heroes 3 lore, Cove are pirates of Regna. And there are no pics of the Kronverk town. Anyway, the best idea is sticking to the plan, even though it may not be the thing you always wanted. The reason I support Kronverk is that it is quite original town compared to other, without any loopholes (except maybe lack of flying/teleporting units) and a snow town would be nice. Maybe someone could open such a poll.

About Forge, when I first heard of it, I thought it was some more technologically advanced in town, but still in the range of the current world, like clock- or steampunk. Cyberpunk not only looks out of place, but it is more boring than other ones, with straight lines, hidden machinery under "black boxes" (in steampunk you usually see gears or something) and shining surfaces and lights. However elemental town is nothing more interesting, it is obvious they recycled half of the work, probably because in a hurry. Elementals as being summonable are suited for neutral towns, not belonging to anyone.

But I wonder how the company changed their mind by emails sent by angry fans. in 1999, internet was not that widespread, news were spreading much more slowly, today almost everybody has internet, yet no company changes mind by getting emails by angry fans. Maybe lack of internet practice scared 3DO on that point they changed the town. Other explanation can be that they barely started the concept and there was long way to go, so going for Conflux was not a longer path, maybe even shorter. In those days there was no need to make such 3D complex expensive scenes as today, so replacing was cheap.

Hobbit, to me, the use of pistols and cannons looks strange too, why would make those pirates more advanced in technology than human kingdoms (Castle). Also, pistols is short ranged weapon, you would hardly hit anything further of 10 meters, for that purpose you usually use muskets.

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RustyEy3
RustyEy3


Hired Hero
posted January 17, 2014 07:35 AM

heroes_fanboy said:
I'm waiting for Forge too. When it comes to sci-fi elements in a fantasy game, if they're made well, they can fit perfectly. Etherlords is one of my favourite games, and I love the sci-fi fraction called Synthets which you can find there:



What is more, as you can see HotA Team Forge already looks pretty good (remember this is WORK IN PROGRESS):




This Forge looks good there are few buildings which looks like sci-fi metropolis but this looks much like HoMM orginaly wanted to create.
when this is ready I want to test this. Good work HoTA

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fred79
fred79


Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
posted January 17, 2014 07:37 AM
Edited by fred79 at 13:45, 18 Jan 2014.

MagniBronzebeard said:

About Forge, when I first heard of it, I thought it was some more technologically advanced in town, but still in the range of the current world, like clock- or steampunk. Cyberpunk not only looks out of place, but it is more boring than other ones, with straight lines, hidden machinery under "black boxes" (in steampunk you usually see gears or something) and shining surfaces and lights.




what would you classify this Dragon Utopia as? steampunk, cyberpunk, or a mix between the two?

my Forge Dragon Utopia

i think it fits what i think of, when i think Forge, anyway.

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Toffer
Toffer

Tavern Dweller
posted January 17, 2014 08:05 AM

nik312 said:
Maybe water lvl was not adv. and dmg was just halved, or some resist worked, or anything.

I didn't know forgetfulness spell worked like that. For now, let's call it a game mechanic, I will return if I find out otherwise.

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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
posted January 17, 2014 09:34 AM

MagniBronzebeard said:
But I still wonder where is the place of Kronverk in heroes 3 lore, Cove are pirates of Regna.


Vori

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Orzie
Orzie


Responsible
Supreme Hero
posted January 17, 2014 09:41 AM

Kronverk is boring anyway. Dwarves with axes, dwarves with hammers, dwarves with pickaxes, dwarves everywhere. Classic towns and even the Cove town provide much more diversity.
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MagniBronzeb...
MagniBronzebeard


Adventuring Hero
posted January 17, 2014 09:47 AM

Aren't Vori elves?

fred79 said:
MagniBronzebeard said:

About Forge, when I first heard of it, I thought it was some more technologically advanced in town, but still in the range of the current world, like clock- or steampunk. Cyberpunk not only looks out of place, but it is more boring than other ones, with straight lines, hidden machinery under "black boxes" (in steampunk you usually see gears or something) and shining surfaces and lights.




what would you classify this Dragon Utopia as? steampunk, cyberpunk, or a mix between the two?



i think it fits what i think of, when i think Forge, anyway.


The structure seems made of wood too, there are no large glass windows where a bright white light comes from, no polished concrete and no sign of heavily electrification, so I would not classify that as cyber punk.

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denien
denien

Tavern Dweller
posted January 17, 2014 09:55 AM

where is this pic from? I've never seen it

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