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Heroes Community > Heroes 3.5 - WoG and Beyond > Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Announcements, Questions, Features
Thread: [Official Thread] HoMM 3: Horn of the Abyss - Announcements, Questions, Features This Super Thread is 548 pages long: 1 ... 44 45 46 47 48 ... 70 140 210 280 350 420 490 548 · «PREV / NEXT»
hippox89
hippox89


Famous Hero
posted February 12, 2014 04:33 PM

Thanks for keeping us up to date, Nik.

I'm wondering if the crew have been just a little stressed with polishing the 1.3 release and ironing out all of the highest priority bugs and then dealing with all of the feedback? I hope you guys remember to enjoy yourself, too.

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BananaofD00M
BananaofD00M

Tavern Dweller
posted February 12, 2014 05:53 PM

Hi I have a question.
Are there any concepts of a Vori town? Since we already know snow elves, wouldn't it be fitting that there are towns in this large northern land? With 1-2 snow elve units and some other creatures like in rampart. If you already have another town in development or don't want to make new towns at all, sorry then, I was just curious because Vori is such a big land in Enroth but it doesn't influence homm3 at all except in the Sword of Frost.

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Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted February 12, 2014 07:16 PM

BananaofD00M said:
Hi I have a question.
Are there any concepts of a Vori town? Since we already know snow elves, wouldn't it be fitting that there are towns in this large northern land? With 1-2 snow elve units and some other creatures like in rampart. If you already have another town in development or don't want to make new towns at all, sorry then, I was just curious because Vori is such a big land in Enroth but it doesn't influence homm3 at all except in the Sword of Frost.

I don't think HotA team is working on any Vori town. At this point, Forge, if anything.
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nik312
nik312


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 15, 2014 12:45 PM
Edited by nik312 at 12:46, 15 Feb 2014.

hippox89 said:
Thanks for keeping us up to date, Nik.

I'm wondering if the crew have been just a little stressed with polishing the 1.3 release and ironing out all of the highest priority bugs and then dealing with all of the feedback? I hope you guys remember to enjoy yourself, too.


Well, yeah, it was a bit stressful, though we didn't forget to live our lives.
However, almost as frustrating is the feeling that our users have to wait sometimes too long for a new version. Not much we can do about it, but the feeling stays.

PS As for the towns - none are in active development. Forge if anything

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hippox89
hippox89


Famous Hero
posted February 15, 2014 02:14 PM
Edited by hippox89 at 14:32, 15 Feb 2014.

Honestly, with the 1.3 release a lot has happened in a short time, and we've already seen two patches since then. It's only a little over a mouth ago that the latest patch was released, and the expansion already offers a lot of content and good stability. Personally, I don't mind waiting for more updates even though I eagerly await them.

I think most people are happy with playing HotA right now as it is and just knowing that HotA is being worked on and thus exited for what's in store.

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Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted February 15, 2014 02:27 PM

If we could wait 4 years for the english release, we can wait weeks/months for bugfixes patches, nik. Don't feel bad of that
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iyoossaev
iyoossaev

Tavern Dweller
posted February 15, 2014 08:16 PM
Edited by iyoossaev at 21:40, 15 Feb 2014.

Hi all! First of all, let me say that this expansion is a job well done – I am really impressed and hyped to be finally be able to play it!

However, there is a number of issues that, in my opinion, need resolving.

Linguistic issues:
In the campaign, there are certain expressions and word order that seems unnatural in English and is probably inteferential from Russian. I fully understand that inversion is meant to stylize for pirate jargon. Still, it doesn't account for all, mentioning all of these here would be laborious. And remember that each time you use the word "however" at the beginning or the end of a sentence, it obligatorilyneeds a comma. If you need any help fixing these from a professional, let me know.

Stability:
refer to the logs attached: http://debil.eu/~whizzkid/HotA_logs.rar

Map Editor:
Every time I am editing a random map I generated in the game, it tells me that only 144 objects of type "Creature Generator 1" can be placed. When I delete any given Creature Generator, though, I am still unable to place any. Even after reloading the map in the editor. (I tried editing only for Gigantic maps, though). Why?

Map Loading:
When I tried to start a random map (previously generated and edited, in the random_maps folder), the player who was the Cove showed it was Conflux. When I tried to choose a hero, only Conflux heroes were available. When the game started, the town was Cove with a Conflux hero. Weird. The next time I tried to start that map I could choose the town itself, but it didn't affect the game in any way. Everything else worked, though.

Functions I would like to see:
I understand some of the below are implemented in WoG and/or HD mod, I would really like to see them natively implemented in HotA:
- renaming towns
- changing the order of towns and heroes
- upgrading creature dwellings on the adventure map. It is gruesomely painstaking to get another hero collect the troops, go to a town to upgrade it and give it to another hero who has full slots in mid-game
and, in the distant future, it would be cool if there was a bar to regulate the numbe of certain objects appearing on the map, like the number of towns etc.

That being said, this new expansion set is awesome =]

Edit: is it me, or the monsters on Strong Monsters level are kinda weak in comparison to SoD? Almost everything is lvl 1-2, sometimes 3; I expected more levels 5/6/7 etc.
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heroes_fanboy
heroes_fanboy


Known Hero
posted February 15, 2014 10:43 PM

iyoossaev said:

...

Linguistic issues:
In the campaign, there are certain expressions and word order that seems unnatural in English and is probably inteferential from Russian. I fully understand that inversion is meant to stylize for pirate jargon. Still, it doesn't account for all, mentioning all of these here would be laborious. And remember that each time you use the word "however" at the beginning or the end of a sentence, it obligatorilyneeds a comma. If you need any help fixing these from a professional, let me know.

...



The HotA Crew is aware of problems with translation (there is even a topic connected with this issue), and they would address them with native speaker proofreading.

However, I don't know if the team of native proofreaders is complete or not. nik312 should be able to tell you more about it, and contact you if necessary.
____________
My suggestions are JUST suggestions. 1) I didn't mean to make fun of anybody. 2) I can always be WRONG--if that's the case I'm sorry.

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rubanani
rubanani


Hired Hero
posted February 16, 2014 04:47 PM

Hi there,

Is it possible to install a template like frozen dragon for HoTA? I am working on two maps for HoTA (it will take some weeks I think.. never made a map before and I want to deliver something special). I want to test some things with the random frozen dragons template, but I can't get it to work (I know that it should only work with XL maps). I want to generate a random map with it in the map editor.

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hippox89
hippox89


Famous Hero
posted February 17, 2014 08:19 PM
Edited by hippox89 at 20:37, 17 Feb 2014.

Nik, has the crew considered creating a Horn of the Abyss page on 'moddb.com'?



moddb HMM3

Moddb is a modding/community central for downloading and showcasing mods and likewise.

About (their words):

'Mod DB is the largest website dedicated to supporting independent development of games (user generated game content), including mods, addons and DLC.'

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heroes_fanboy
heroes_fanboy


Known Hero
posted February 17, 2014 08:43 PM

hippox89 said:
Nik, has the crew considered creating a Horn of the Abyss page on 'moddb.com'?

...



I think someone from the HotA Crew mentioned that they would.

It seems like The Succession Wars Mod has made a good use of Mod DB.
____________
My suggestions are JUST suggestions. 1) I didn't mean to make fun of anybody. 2) I can always be WRONG--if that's the case I'm sorry.

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Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted February 17, 2014 08:50 PM

Yup, creating a page for moddb would be really useful for reaching more people
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iyoossaev
iyoossaev

Tavern Dweller
posted February 18, 2014 12:56 PM
Edited by iyoossaev at 15:03, 18 Feb 2014.

OK, after playing several games I have determined beyond any reasonable doubt, that HotA is just too easy. I was never a very good strategy game player, but I am winning every single random map on 200% without any tempering with it, and without breaking any sweat. Perhaps I am just used to WoG and perhaps it generated much stronger creatures, but I recall all the games to be considerably more difficult – in terms of getting resources, defeating monsters and battling enemies with superior numbers.

Also it is weird that in one game, I found 7 indentical mana charms.

The mod is cool in many ways, but I think it needs some difficulty tweaks

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valgaav
valgaav


Adventuring Hero
posted February 18, 2014 01:22 PM
Edited by valgaav at 14:30, 18 Feb 2014.

First I would like to congratulate HoTA team on the release. Great job at making an actual high quality addon for the game. Some may say it took you too long to release, but I know how many small things in such projects may take more time then you expected. Good job

Anyway this project really is like an addon to the original game and the changes are minimal and along to heroes 3 spirit (Not like in WoG which is more a modding platform then an actual addon). Furthermore I see that at one point you plan to have WoG compatibility. IMHO this shouldn't be priority and furthermore it may do more harm as right now you guys with all the hype may take control and become a standard in terms of balance for h3 that people will not question. This may be hard if HoTA will be as moddable as WoG(wog te and wog wt never became a widely accepted standard ). HoTA has such chance and I hope this addon will become an accepted by community evolution of hommIII (but evolution not revolution).

So now after this intro I would like to point out some issues I have with the latest version to help you make it better.

BUGS

-When playing non HotA version of maps (fe. SoD) new added combination artifacts from HoTA may appear as Random relicts on the map. Considering the power of combination arts those should not appear on the map at all unless placed on the map intentionally by mapmaker.
Actually this bug is also present in SoD. If you play an RoE map arts like Angelic Alliance may and are appearing on map (random art,relicts, utopias etc. )

BALANCING - MAJOR/ CRITICAL
When talking about balance I'll try to look on it from MP pro level and Casual SP/MP (often with big maps and lots of players AI). I have made two balancing mods in the past (one for WoG, and one based on WoG te for the polish mp league) so I have some experience in this field.

-Necromancy Changes made by HoTA are very nice. I don't know if halving necromany is enough or should the % be even lower but there are two things that I am sure are still wrong :

- Cloak of the Undead King - Only 3 pieces to find and it is an obvious overkill with ressurecting liches. With this, this art is fairly easy to assemble and when you do so you won the game. There is no option for you to loose once you found it. IMHO the art should be fixed and it should only give extra % bonus to raised skeletons (fe 20% extra to what already 3 arts give). Grail building for necro does the same so it is not a bad bonus at all.

- Skeleton transformer It depends on map but with big ones and extra town Necro gets a lot of additional skeletons. Changing other 1 and even 2 level creatures is an obvious tactic here. IMHO transformer should be limited for example it should transform only half of the creatures. So from 100 pixies necro player would get only 50 skeletons. Also transformer + necro hero with diplomacy is a very nice combo another reason to nerf transformer a bit.

Diplomacy This skill is sure overkill right now and a must have/pick for all players. On MP and MODS like WOG WT you cannot accept joiners but IMHO diplo just needs some adjustment to be back in game. Some of the changes that might do the trick is lowering the chances of joiners (fe Expert diplo should do what advanced does now) and Diplomacy should not work at all on troops of Player alignment (player not hero this is important!) So if a player A starts with Castle Castle units on map will never be influenced by diplomacy. I guess it would also be nice if 7 level units would not join at all.  

DD / FLy Those spells were even switched off on almost all SoD maps by 3do so even the original autors understood that imbalance. It's just that they didn't fix it properly. Both DD and Fly allows you to pass zones/guards. It simply breaks maps and since mobility is very important in homm it's hard to win against other human players that have those spells when you do not. IMHO DD should be limited to one cast per day tile ratio should be smaller then current one. Expertise in air magic should increase the ratio and on Expert ratio should be like the current one in game. Alternatively if ratio changes are not technically possible DD could work twice on expert but use up a lot more hero movement then it currently does.
Most important change for both Fly and DD. Those spells should transfer the hero only to places where he can also get on foot. So no guards/zone passing with the spell. This restriction obviously should also be applied to Angel Wings artifact.
Take in consideration also that DD/Fly and even waterwalk are even worse game breakers on water based maps. One of the reasons why water maps were never popular is due to those spells. This should also get fixed if people are to play this kind of maps more often.

Hit and Run WoG TE and WoG WT disallows human players from running or surrendering in the round they taken action (casted a spell). This should be in HoTA too as it even makes sense that if creatures have one move per turn so should heroes.  Taking an action (casting a spell in this case ) should block options to surrender or retreat. These options should be back in next round.
This is nice for pro MP but for single or casual MP is not enough IMHO. Tactics with Armaggedon + Dragons or Firebird are quite lame and accessible only to 4 castles. On bigger XL maps a player can combine armies from different castles and have a full force of fire/magic immune creatures ( Conflux players have an easier job here). IMHO Armageddon should be what it was meant to be: a last resort spell that one uses when he knows he is going to loose anyway to do extra damage to your foe. It should not be a hit and run spell or a full force of resistant creatures tactic. Proposed change no creatures should have complete immunity to armageddon.

Red rush Problem for pro MP not that big issue for casual SP/MP gamers. Red player gets his first day before blue and in H vs H this means he can attack other player with new week army while the other player does not have new troops. No good solution for that as it is basic game mechanic, but perhaps it would be less of an issue if order of players was randomized each week day 1. So 1st week red would be first blue second, 2nd week it would get randomized and blue would be first red  second etc.
This solution would at least stop players from planning a rush attack as they would never be sure who would get first turn in upcoming week.

Those are major imbalances in the game that need fix ASAP. There are other things in skills, spells etc. but those are not major game breakers...

Posted in hope this gets passed to HoTA team. I also hope some of this ideas will be useful.  I've tried to take both pro MP and casual SP/MP in this and I'm sure game can be more balanced for all players this way. I am also willing to help further with balance and share my experience if the team wants my help.



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Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted February 18, 2014 03:01 PM

valgaav said:
Anyway this project really is like an addon to the original game and the changes are minimal and along to heroes 3 spirit (Not like in WoG which is more a modding platform then an actual addon). Furthermore I see that at one point you plan to have WoG compatibility. IMHO this shouldn't be priority

Where did you read that? Surely it isn't on the OP
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valgaav
valgaav


Adventuring Hero
posted February 18, 2014 03:11 PM
Edited by valgaav at 15:15, 18 Feb 2014.

Storm-Giant said:

Where did you read that? Surely it isn't on the OP

http://www.hota.acidcave.net/interview_with_picolan.html
Quote:

It is said, that HotA compatibility with WoG/ERA is planned. Is there any progress with this matter?

Yes, there is, but [...] don't expect it in the near future.

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Storm-Giant
Storm-Giant


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
posted February 18, 2014 03:17 PM
Edited by Storm-Giant at 15:18, 18 Feb 2014.

I see. There's no date, so maybe it's a 2-3 year old interview and could be outdated information. Can any from HotA team comment on that?
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Docent_Picolan
Docent_Picolan


Promising
Adventuring Hero
posted February 18, 2014 03:36 PM
Edited by Docent_Picolan at 15:38, 18 Feb 2014.

yes, it's outdated. for now we have no such plans

thanks for feedback anyway

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iyoossaev
iyoossaev

Tavern Dweller
posted February 18, 2014 03:39 PM

Docent_Picolan said:
yes, it's outdated. for now we have no such plans

thanks for feedback anyway


Afair VCMI Heroes is supposed to work with both.

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nik312
nik312


Promising
Famous Hero
posted February 19, 2014 09:00 PM

valgaav said:
First I would like to congratulate HoTA team on the release. Great job at making an actual high quality addon for the game. Some may say it took you too long to release, but I know how many small things in such projects may take more time then you expected. Good job

Anyway this project really is like an addon to the original game and the changes are minimal and along to heroes 3 spirit (Not like in WoG which is more a modding platform then an actual addon). Furthermore I see that at one point you plan to have WoG compatibility. IMHO this shouldn't be priority and furthermore it may do more harm as right now you guys with all the hype may take control and become a standard in terms of balance for h3 that people will not question. This may be hard if HoTA will be as moddable as WoG(wog te and wog wt never became a widely accepted standard ). HoTA has such chance and I hope this addon will become an accepted by community evolution of hommIII (but evolution not revolution).

So now after this intro I would like to point out some issues I have with the latest version to help you make it better.

BUGS

-When playing non HotA version of maps (fe. SoD) new added combination artifacts from HoTA may appear as Random relicts on the map. Considering the power of combination arts those should not appear on the map at all unless placed on the map intentionally by mapmaker.
Actually this bug is also present in SoD. If you play an RoE map arts like Angelic Alliance may and are appearing on map (random art,relicts, utopias etc. )




Thx for the feedback and report

On balance part almost everything is right, though it is not ASAP really, because good players know the rules and noobs don't care
It will be done, however, sooner or later.

PS Though the DD/Fly will not be fixed much. Almost all players already know how to play with it. Full-control mind games are fun.

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