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Heroes Community > Tavern of the Rising Sun > Thread: If you were madly in love...
Thread: If you were madly in love... This thread is 7 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 · «PREV / NEXT»
Baklava
Baklava


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Mostly harmless
posted May 18, 2014 03:54 PM

Quote:
We are not animals, we are unique.

Storks are monogamous. And swans and gibbons and French angelfish and wolves and some termites and also the schistosoma mansoni worms.
____________
"Let me tell you what the blues
is. When you ain't got no
money,
you got the blues."
Howlin Wolf

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OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted May 18, 2014 03:56 PM

Aww. Poor mom, no one wanna do her man.
____________
Living time backwards

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artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted May 18, 2014 03:56 PM

Well, that's a clear "no way" from me Bak, I wouldn't be able to get it up, anyway.

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OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted May 18, 2014 03:58 PM

I guess you could always take some viagra...

Anyway, however hard it's to answer that question with a straight face, when it comes to save someone lives in which case you do not coerce someone else, the answer is yes.

@Bak
When Meroe writes we're not animals, you should keep in mind she's very catholic, from which it follows she's a time traveler from the middle ages. Don't judge her! Give her ice cream in stead.
____________
Living time backwards

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 04:31 PM

Well, Meroe, in fact we are animals. What else? Plants?
And no, monogamy has not "developed naturally within us". There are cultures that do not embrace monogamy. It is a social construct. A human design.

Family is not at all something that nescessarily comes from monogamy. Not anymore. You do not need to be a biological mother and a father to raise a child. There's adoption, insemination and surrogacy. A child can have more than two parents. The idea of the family being between just a single man and woman is another social construct, which doesn't really makes sense to solely stick to in the 21st century.

Where did I try to force my lifestyle on others lol?
This is about liberation, it is the ideal I hold sacred. It is about questioning the social norms, constructs and structures that our society consist of, so that we can make more rational and happy choices.
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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Neraus
Neraus


Promising
Legendary Hero
Pain relief cream seller
posted May 18, 2014 06:12 PM

Well my friend let me tell you something, polygamy is not an happy choice. It's true that monogamy is not a primordial instinct or natural in us but Envy and jealousy are.

In the animal world you see them fighting to breed and usually the victor is the one that passes its genes to the next generation while the ones who lose aren't as likely as it.
How many times have two men fought for the same woman or how many times a husband killed the wife's lover?

You are free to believe in what you want but remember that not everyone has the same mindset, there are some who wouldn't mind polygamy but if I was offered a polygamous relationship chances are that I'd punch the one that made me that offer.


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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 06:33 PM

And this is why it is important to keep talking about heteronormativity (which monogamy is a strong part of). So that people can talk about these issues with an open-mind and hopefully, learn something from the dicussion which could lead them to a more free and thus, happier life.
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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Fauch
Fauch


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 07:59 PM

you are politically engaged, and I suppose you've been part of one or several parties?
what you say reminds me of the most fanatic ultra liberals. makes me wonder how much your thoughts are conditionned by a party?

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 08:20 PM
Edited by xerox at 20:23, 18 May 2014.

I'm a member of the Liberal People's Party (Folkpartiet liberalerna), which is a social liberal party and hardly particularly libertarian. There's a significant amount of libertarians in the youth association though, where I am also very active. But it's not like I pursue anarcho-capitalist policies when working in the local government. Some degree of libertarianism works though. Like we want to expand on school choice, sell local government-owned corporations and cut down on the amount of politicans.
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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Fauch
Fauch


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 09:31 PM

you got involved in politics quite young, and you are also probably very young for being a member of a party.

the problem is that parties, at least once they reach a certain size and importance, seem to become mostly about taking power, with ambitious and manipulative people making their way to the top, so they can use the party to achieve their own egoist goals.

well, I've never been part of a party myself, but there are many people who say they are like sects. and it's said that the younger they take you, the better it is for them.

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 09:39 PM
Edited by xerox at 21:42, 18 May 2014.

yeah I think most are far more driven by personal ambition than ideology

like I'm largely ideologically driven but I can't deny that Frank Underwood is like the most inspirational politican I know of, I'm learning so much from watching House of Cards lol
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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meroe
meroe


Supreme Hero
Basically Smurfette
posted May 18, 2014 09:46 PM

xerox said:
This is about liberation, it is the ideal I hold sacred. It is about questioning the social norms, constructs and structures that our society consist of, so that we can make more rational and happy choices.


Whose liberation Xerox???  What on earth makes you think your choices to tear down centuries of tried and tested social mores is in any way rational or will lead to happy choices.  And what apart from your own ego makes you think your views are correct?  If you hold your ideals sacred, what makes you think I don't hold mine sacred.  Ergo, who do you think you are telling me I have to change?! Or that I am wrong.

You think surrogacy is the way to go??  Yes I guess you would, let women rent out their wombs for money yes?  Or even better, lets make sure every woman has to be a surrogate at least once in her life to ensure that those who cannot have children get the chance to have a newborn baby rather than adopt, yes?

I am perfectly happy with a monogamous lifestyle and will never be interested in 'free love/polyamorous' lifestyles.  That offends me.  However, I have no issue with others who wish to live that way.  You live your life the way you wish and I will continue to live mine the way I like.  Tolerance of peoples lifestyles and choices (within reason obviously i.e. paedophilia, bestiality etc not included) is the answer.  Not uber liberalists trying to tear everything down, so we are all the same, just to soothe their egos.

Like I said before, people living polyamorous lifestyles have been doing so for centuries.  So you have nothing to demand.  It is useless to jump up on the soapbox when you have nothing new or rational to scream about.  And when you start demanding changes to peoples lives, where no change is needed, you will make enemies.

If you want to do something purposeful, stop trying to dictate a certain set lifestyle on all of us and start encouraging tolerance and understanding.
____________
Meroe is definetely out, sweet
as she sounds sometimes, she'd
definetely castrate you with a
rusted razror and forcefeed
your genitals to you in a
blink of an eye - Kipshasz

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 09:54 PM
Edited by xerox at 22:17, 18 May 2014.

I can't be tolerant against people who are reproducing intolerant norms.

You're also arguing against a strawman. I am not trying to dictate anyone's life.  On the contrary, I'm suggesting to people to have an open and analytical mind about things.  
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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OhforfSake
OhforfSake


Promising
Legendary Hero
Initiate
posted May 18, 2014 10:06 PM

Come on guys (and girl)! I want to hear your comments on bak's contribution.
____________
Living time backwards

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 10:10 PM

Yes, I would snow my dad to save my mum. I would snow my mum to save my dad. That's not even a hard dilemma, but it's such a bad and non-intellectually stimulating dilemma since it's so far off from any real scenario.
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted May 18, 2014 10:20 PM

xerox said:

2. Which means you don't have to put up with as many demands.
3. You're likely to feel less bad if the relation ends.

I'm going to go back to this.

First of all, wouldn't having more partners mean more demands?

Second, why would you feel any less bad if you just lost a person you loved? I don't get how that is related to quanity. The effects of it will be diminished because you have people to comfort you, yes but the pain of loss itself is still the same.
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DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 10:24 PM

It's about not being as committed as in a monogamous relationship.
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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meroe
meroe


Supreme Hero
Basically Smurfette
posted May 18, 2014 10:25 PM

xerox said:
I'm suggesting to people to have an open and analytical mind about things.  


What makes you think your mindset is so perfect or analytical???  There is your ego again.  Only you have this pure understanding and the rest of us dinosaurs need to educated a la Xerox.

You know nothing.  You are barely out of short pants.  What makes you think everyone else here hasn't already thought about all you are talking about and then made their own decision, huh?  I live in the Western world Xerox.  Luckily for me I don't have Sharia Law bearing down on me.  Or tribal chiefs marrying me off at 8.

I have been able to make all my own choices.  Some good, some bad.  And despite what you seem to think of everyone else, I haven't just gone along with everyone else or followed the usual paths either.  

You see that is the problem, liberalists never stop to consider that others may have already asked themselves 'that particular question' and then come to their own conclusion.  Because if that conclusion turns out to the the 'age old' solution - then surely its got to be wrong.
____________
Meroe is definetely out, sweet
as she sounds sometimes, she'd
definetely castrate you with a
rusted razror and forcefeed
your genitals to you in a
blink of an eye - Kipshasz

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xerox
xerox


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
posted May 18, 2014 10:31 PM

So... did you try being in an open or polyamorous relationship?
____________
Over himself, over his own
body and
mind, the individual is
sovereign.
- John Stuart Mill

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JoonasTo
JoonasTo


Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
What if Elvin was female?
posted May 18, 2014 10:34 PM

xerox said:
It's about not being as committed as in a monogamous relationship.

Why not? I'm pretty sure you can have just as committed relationship with multiple people as you can with one.

Also, do you see the commitment as an inherently bad thing?

From my perspective, achieving something is always more rewarding if you've committed more to it.
____________
DON'T BE A NOOB, JOIN A.D.V.E.N.T.U.R.E.

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