Heroes of Might and Magic Community
visiting hero! Register | Today's Posts | Games | Search! | FAQ/Rules | AvatarList | MemberList | Profile


Age of Heroes Headlines:  
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
6 Aug 2016: Troubled Heroes VII Expansion Release - read more
26 Apr 2016: Heroes VII XPack - Trial by Fire - Coming out in June! - read more
17 Apr 2016: Global Alternative Creatures MOD for H7 after 1.8 Patch! - read more
7 Mar 2016: Romero launches a Piano Sonata Album Kickstarter! - read more
19 Feb 2016: Heroes 5.5 RC6, Heroes VII patch 1.7 are out! - read more
13 Jan 2016: Horn of the Abyss 1.4 Available for Download! - read more
17 Dec 2015: Heroes 5.5 update, 1.6 out for H7 - read more
23 Nov 2015: H7 1.4 & 1.5 patches Released - read more
31 Oct 2015: First H7 patches are out, End of DoC development - read more
5 Oct 2016: Heroes VII development comes to an end.. - read more
[X] Remove Ads
LOGIN:     Username:     Password:         [ Register ]
HOMM1: info forum | HOMM2: info forum | HOMM3: info mods forum | HOMM4: info CTG forum | HOMM5: info mods forum | MMH6: wiki forum | MMH7: wiki forum
Heroes Community > Other Side of the Monitor > Thread: Politics in the U.S.
Thread: Politics in the U.S. This Popular Thread is 153 pages long: 1 20 40 60 80 ... 97 98 99 100 101 ... 120 140 153 · «PREV / NEXT»
blob2
blob2


Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
posted March 16, 2019 08:05 PM

JollyJoker said:
People didn't wash, shat and pissed everywhere and bigger towns were cesspits. You think they had all those plagues from happenstance?


Hygene wasn't sophisticated but it's not there wasn't any. They bathed, cleaned teeth etc. It wasn't about "snowting everywhere", but waste disposal. They simply threw it off into ditches, rivers. Apparently around 14th century they started to notice correlation between plagues and waste. I've even read some articles about the hygene in middle ages being a bit better then in some later ages like 17th...

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted March 16, 2019 11:00 PM

Well, they didn't - they emptied the pot out of the window. There's a reason for Black Death being in the middle of the 14th century (and plagues continuing).

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
blizzardboy
blizzardboy


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
posted March 17, 2019 12:05 AM
Edited by blizzardboy at 00:06, 17 Mar 2019.

Yeah. The Black Death happened in the Middle Ages because people threw poop out of the window.

I'm starting to enjoy this. Please continue.
____________
"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Salamandre
Salamandre


Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
posted March 17, 2019 12:09 AM

I threw it all the time, all I got was a flu for opening the window.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted March 17, 2019 09:06 AM

Emptying feces on the street is a symptom. Not only were they running along the gutter - think about the quality of the drinking water they needed to get from somewhere. Washing?
Compare that situatiuon alone with the time of the high cultures. Then there was the oppressive church that forbid everything it didn't like. There was basically NO medical knowledge. No research. No education, except in practical things like teaching the kids what the parents were doing.
The breakdown of the Roman Empire has been a dystopic event, and it took nearly a millennium to halfway recover.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
markkur
markkur


Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
posted March 17, 2019 03:31 PM

Brothers and Sisters, the following discussion is important for each of you to research and understand - iow, making your best decision when it comes to your own health or the health of family and friends.

Fyi, if you are generally cantankerous of what I deem important, then set that attitude aside...start the video and skip past the comments about Politics & Justice here in the States but do go to the meat of the discussion that centers on human-health issues, which just happens to be a global-concern.

This share is not about me or my beliefs but it is about the chemical-factories called bodies. "The more you know"...requires individual-research for individual-factories.

link

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
AlHazin
AlHazin


Promising
Supreme Hero
النور
posted March 17, 2019 05:50 PM

JollyJoker said:
Europe was STINKING in the middle ages. People [...] cesspits. You think they had all those plagues from happenstance?


Leave him in his denial. Actually, you don't even need to go back to the middle ages for some interesting poo story. London of the late 19th century was lacking a sewage system, and they used to threw their poo in the streets as well and rivers.

To give a comparison with a real civilisation, the Indus Valley civilisation (today's Pakistan) millennia ago had an excellent sewage system.

But you can keep calling the West a civilisation if you want.
____________
Nothing of value disappears from this world, it will reappear in some shape or form ^^ - Elvin

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Neraus
Neraus


Promising
Legendary Hero
Pain relief cream seller
posted March 17, 2019 06:36 PM

And here we are gentlemen, let's witness the failure of teaching history and the victory of slander against truth.

Honestly, would you just stop flinging poo at each other, it's getting embarassing.
____________
Noli offendere Patriam Agathae quia ultrix iniuriarum est.

ANTUDO

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted March 17, 2019 07:03 PM

Don't you know nothing? Flinging poo is a sign of intelligence!

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted March 17, 2019 07:16 PM

People, almost anywhere was stinking up, up until recently and if we put aside a few “polis” there were no sewer systems around. In terms of an epidemic, a city’s sewer system cant stop that anyway because cities were not the norm. Any epidemic spreading around would have reached you sooner or later.

Blizz is right about one thing, the plague had not much to do with poo. It spread through parasites from rats, and if you had horses and goats, etc., you were relatively lucky because chances were, the parasites prefered to suck on them.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
blob2
blob2


Undefeatable Hero
Blob-Ohmos the Second
posted March 17, 2019 07:31 PM

A I hear Asians make fun of Westerners cus we use toilet paper. They are like: why would you even smear the poo with paper instead of cleaning it with water? They mostly use bidets...

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted March 17, 2019 07:36 PM

That's a very superficial analysis, because rats haven't been a new species. So the real question is, why there were no plagues earlier, but instead in the time they were.

Secondly, no, stinking wasn't everywhere. As mentioned, in the first century AD Rome had a million inhabitants. A MILLION. You had to feed them, you had to deliver the water for them and you had to get rid of the waste. Rome managed all that, without any plagues. Still, with so many inhabitants, the danger of it should have been quite high.

A lot of towns in Europe have been around for a long time. From the 12. century onwards towns were on the rise, but of course population levels were below 10.000 mostly. Which is whyt I'm saying. No matter what you hold responsible for the population decline in the 14th century, not enough food production, hygiene, or a couple of others, fact is, they couldn't handle the pop level they had.


 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
artu
artu


Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
posted March 17, 2019 08:00 PM

JJ, just like rats, the microscobic things on them are also species, they, too, party around when their time comes. Anyway, friendly sarcasm aside, I really read about this, will give you links later, but it’s rats if my info is not outdated. Your question of “why at that moment” doesnt make sense: Because the germs didnt exist to use rats as a mule before.

Spring is mad around here, I’ll post later.
____________
Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted March 17, 2019 08:42 PM

No, the whole thing is unclear. There are a couple of theories, but no conclusive proof for anything definite. Sorry to burst that bubble.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Neraus
Neraus


Promising
Legendary Hero
Pain relief cream seller
posted March 17, 2019 09:13 PM

@JJ
Actually, Rome had plagues too, the worst of them being the Antonine plague, which reduced the empire's population to a third of its size.

Even Constantinople, the second Rome and biggest city of the middle Ages had to face a devastating plague before the turn of the millennium, and that's when they were still Latin and not yet Greeks.

In their cases the spread of disease was helped by the sanitary measures of the Romans, since the tradition of the public baths was a perfect vehicle for infection.

In the case of Medieval Europe the first half of the period coincided with a cold period that didn't allow mass agriculture in the north, once the Medieval warm period began regions like Flanders, and many parts of Northern Germany flourished as food yields improved.

Btw, Palermo and Messina reached over 40.000 and the biggest Sicilian cities too reached high levels of population.
____________
Noli offendere Patriam Agathae quia ultrix iniuriarum est.

ANTUDO

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
Blizzardboy
Blizzardboy


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
posted March 17, 2019 09:37 PM
Edited by Blizzardboy at 21:49, 17 Mar 2019.

blob2 said:
A I hear Asians make fun of Westerners cus we use toilet paper. They are like: why would you even smear the poo with paper instead of cleaning it with water? They mostly use bidets...


I keep a bottle of witchhazel next to the toilet and after the initial dry wipe, I follow it up with a wet wipe. It is highly effective and leaves the area fresh and sanitized. It's not as fun as throwing my poop out the window but on the plus side I don't have police knocking on my door.

Bidets are fun but I generally don't need them unless my poop is unusually sticky. On a plant-based diet without meat or dairy, I crap twice a day and the crap comes out clean and smooth.
____________
"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted March 17, 2019 09:40 PM

Neraus said:
@JJ
Actually, Rome had plagues too, the worst of them being the Antonine plague, which reduced the empire's population to a third of its size.

Even Constantinople, the second Rome and biggest city of the middle Ages had to face a devastating plague before the turn of the millennium, and that's when they were still Latin and not yet Greeks.

In their cases the spread of disease was helped by the sanitary measures of the Romans, since the tradition of the public baths was a perfect vehicle for infection.

In the case of Medieval Europe the first half of the period coincided with a cold period that didn't allow mass agriculture in the north, once the Medieval warm period began regions like Flanders, and many parts of Northern Germany flourished as food yields improved.

Btw, Palermo and Messina reached over 40.000 and the biggest Sicilian cities too reached high levels of population.
Antonine plague were very probably the pox, they got from a war in mesopotamia.

For the rest of your post I don't see your point.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Neraus
Neraus


Promising
Legendary Hero
Pain relief cream seller
posted March 17, 2019 09:45 PM

Don't see either why you don't see it, our cities broke that 10.000 barrier you gave, and I gave you a pretty significant reason why Europe had a demographic problem in the period before the 13th century.

Plus you said that Rome didn't have plagues, despite having had episodes of mass infection.
And if you want to play the semantics game be my guest.
Btw, some research does suggest that the Antonine plague was from a bacteria related to Yersinia pestis.

____________
Noli offendere Patriam Agathae quia ultrix iniuriarum est.

ANTUDO

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
JollyJoker
JollyJoker


Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
posted March 17, 2019 10:27 PM

You'd have to give evidence for the last one because everything I read said it was the pox.

Now - I didn't say towns were limited to 10.000 people. Artu said, there were no towns in the middle ages or some such nonsense, and I said, yes, there were, starting in 12th century, although MOST of them wouldn't reach 10.000.

The question here isn't a demographic problem, it's whether the middle ages were a dark age or not, and the middle ages WERE a pitch black age, compared with the standards BEFORE. In each and every regard.

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | Quote Reply | Link
Neraus
Neraus


Promising
Legendary Hero
Pain relief cream seller
posted March 17, 2019 11:20 PM

You know, comparing the standards of any age with the Roman Empire is cheating, to be honest sometimes I think we still haven't reached the full extent of the Roman standard of living.

But anyway, which Middle Ages are we talking about? It's a freaking millennium of history, you both have the rise of the Romano-Barbaric kingdoms and the first financial crisis of the Florentine banking system, you both have the fall of Roman influence in the Middle East and the rise of the caliphate and then you also have Sicily taking the leadership of Europe and its golden age of culture and philosophy. You have the Danes plundering and trading across the North as well as the union of Poland and Lithuania against the Teutonic order.

It's an incredibly broad definition that encompasses an incredibly diverse continent, in a huge span of time. It's not like today there aren't some places that are living in a pitch black period right now.

Btw, I had heard that thing about Y.Pestis being related to the Antonine plague once in a documentary, while it's not confirmed some have found some correlations.
Here's a study I found after a second of googling, so not really checked thoroughly.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0092867415013227
____________
Noli offendere Patriam Agathae quia ultrix iniuriarum est.

ANTUDO

 Send Instant Message | Send E-Mail | View Profile | PP | Quote Reply | Link
Jump To: « Prev Thread . . . Next Thread » This Popular Thread is 153 pages long: 1 20 40 60 80 ... 97 98 99 100 101 ... 120 140 153 · «PREV / NEXT»
Post New Poll    Post New Topic    Post New Reply

Page compiled in 0.0775 seconds