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ShardofTruth
Hired Hero
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posted September 17, 2014 10:35 PM |
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verriker said:
ShardofTruth said:
If Ubisoft kept the old universe the outcry here would be even bigger, because then they even the old games would somehow become stained and ruined forever™.
that's great that you've apparently been to an alternate universe where they genuinely tried their best to honor 25 years and three generations worth of lore
I played all Might & Magic and Heroes games (even the bad ones like Crusaders, Warriors and this horrible King's Bounty PS2 port) and I don't know what there really is to honor about those "25 years and three generations worth of lore" in particular, maybe you can enlighten me. Even NWC didn't think the world of Enroth/Erathia/Jadame/etc. was worth keeping and Axeoth wasn't really we liked either because it's tied to the (commonly referred) worst games of the series.
That being said, Ubisoft already did what you described (even in this universe) by releasing those DLCs for Heroes 6 with the legacy maps.
Did you like them or are the some sort of abomination to you?
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted September 17, 2014 11:00 PM |
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the world aside, I'm sure that not recklessly throwing the ancients and kreegans backdrop into the garbage can would probably have been sufficient tribute for most
you may not think Heroes has ever been Shakespeare, but that's a poor excuse to give Ubisoft a free pass when it descends further down than ever to Stephanie Meyer levels as in H5 and 6 lol
also if you can source me the idea that the reckoning was conceived because Enroth was deemed to be not worth keeping that would be great
as for the DLC I have no idea, refused to pay $10 for these "adventure packs" with three or four maps on principle, they reminded me of the whorish Crusaders and Warriors from 3DO's dying days which you mentioned lol
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Storm-Giant
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
On the Other Side!
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posted September 17, 2014 11:11 PM |
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verriker said:
as for the DLC I have no idea, refused to pay $10 for these "adventure packs" with three or four maps on principle, they reminded me of the whorish Crusaders and Warriors from 3DO's dying days which you mentioned lol
I believe they had only 2 maps each (the campaign, then an extra scenario which I'm not sure if it was avaiable for non-DLC users anyway)
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted January 24, 2015 08:51 PM |
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Ashan cannot be considered bad for the fact alone that it is Ashan. Not even because it imposed itself over Enroth or Axeoth. My theory is that Ashan can be considered bad because it was created, not out of passion, but for business -hence its cheap resemblance with wow trend and heavily criticized lore. I am not denying nor criticizing the fact that Ubisoft wants to gain profit from the franchise as I realize it is money that allows them to pay competent people in order to develop a terrific game. I am not saying what NWC did was perfect either, but to me the only reason that would have made me accept to entirely scrap the previous setting like Ubisoft did would have been that they not only had to know very well about the franchise, but also and moreover create something possibly outstanding. Which they didn’t. So much arrogance to scrap everything to start on a new basis without even trying to propose something at the least a minimum substantial. This reflects visually, in my opinion the whole world of Jon Van Caneghem reaches you directly from Tracy Iwata’s sketches for HV.
The first time I saw actual HV, my reaction was : is this Blizzard doing some spinoff ?
Is a mistake not to care about the lore, I mean, no need to be specialist, but no need to be a genius to understand lore shapes the world, and that if the lore is poorly inspired, so will be the universe.
Whether you like Ashan and its stupid rules or not, a minimum of coherency is asked, and Forge as an attempt to link MM with HMM was a risky challenge, and I am sure if it weren’t for 3DO that panicked the faction would have been through, and that would have been something really new, just to cut with the people shouting old-schools fans don’t want new, this is not true, why do you think they tweak HOMM-III to the death ? I want something new, but I don’t want a downgrade. When I read comments like saying Ubisoft saved the franchise, I cannot avoid to consider it heresy. In my opinion, Ubisoft bought a franchise that died because of :
- 3DO going bankrupt because of stupid decisions like the major investment they put in their console that was a commercial failure.
- The franchise had a huge fanbase and had all the potential in the world to sell good, hence how HV sold well, even after HIV.
Ubisoft didn’t respect in any way the previous world, and this is precisely why some will say it’s rape, offensive or not, is the term that fits, look at what happened to Fairie Town, or to Dungeon… At least HV had good gameplay, but the lore influence the graphics and the universe, and denying it only shows one’s lack of interest on the matter.
Now look what is happening to Necropolis, they clearly are mocking us :
MMH7 official said:
1) Here at Might & Magic HQ, we’re very fond of the H6 Necropolis, and we feel they are one of the best factions of that game in terms of art direction. So we didn’t want to recreate it from scratch.
2) Necropolis is the timeless, undying faction. If one faction should remain very similar, art-wise, from one game to the next, it’s the Undead.
3) The H6 models were already very detailed, so there was no point in doing new models for essentially the same designs.
Ubisoft,
I get that you are fond and proud of your color-coded Spiderpolis, but please at least have the courtesy not to spread misguiding information to the newcomers of the series :
If one faction should remain very similar, art-wise, from one game to the next, it’s the Undead.
Which Undead ? The city has close to nothing to do with the Undead as for now. Necromancers are not supposed to be moderate guys who worship some brainless spider cult, I can’t believe some can find sense into this.
Ubisoft, you may have forgotten that you are doing a continuity of the franchise.
Ubisoft, it is not because you bought the “rights” that you should dismiss and deny all that was done before, and Necropolis artistic designs prior to yours are quite beating you at it to be honest. Even the new fanbase acquired from HV tends to wish for the undead to actually be Undead.
At least save us the hypocrisy that you are actually caring about the fanbase because you clearly aren’t. There was already rage with HV, there was even more with MMH6, and you are using MMH6 atrocities as the new standard for the most cult and loved faction since 20 years ? What is your problem, I mean, do you think it is bad for business to please the fans ? Do you think it is good to make long time fans go insane ? What is the purpose of this ? You are so desperately trying to gather a new fanbase, from uneducated teenagers, in order to satisfy your game producer sick fantasies and uttermost fallacies, when it would be so simple to do it right. Yes, if Necropolis should remain very similar art-wise as you state, why would you take the ONLY version that actually differs COMPLETELY from all the other ? I don’t get it.
Necropolis is THE most popular faction since forever, why would you need to alter it to that point. Necropolis is supposed to be pure evil, not some moderated “between life and death” woolly interpretation. Ashan has been doing close to nothing good towards the franchise, is been too long, and is not going better with time, please listen to fans, “VIP” ones as you call them, they certainly represent in a much more faithful way original universe and how the continuity should be done than newcomers, is like that dude at your blog telling me Dungeon was ruled by Dark Elves in H3 lol, he even thought he corrected me lmao.
When I first saw Haven and Academy reveals, I started to hope, I thought Ashan could get better, but now when I see current state of Necropolis, all I want is for Erwan le Breton to get fired. Is been close to a decade that he’s messing with the game so many love, and recently with the fans and last survivors themselves. I don’t believe anymore Ashan can make things right, I am highly in favor to scrap it, and most importantly to get rid of this usurper who think he's some kind of god.
I am sorry for the negativity, but this is going too far.
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Wellplay
Famous Hero
Poland Stronk
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posted January 24, 2015 08:59 PM |
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You people want to scrap Ashan because of how necro unupgraded elite turned out. 
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted January 24, 2015 09:00 PM |
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Wellplay said:
You people want to scrap Ashan because of how necro unupgraded elite turned out.
Among countless other things 
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted January 24, 2015 09:04 PM |
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If we want Ashan scrapped in a realistic way, I think we should start some kind of a reboot campaign demanding they give Marzhin creative control of the series with "Erwin must go", or at least "Erwin must go creative direct something else", as the slogan lol
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Sandro400
Promising
Supreme Hero
Shadow of Death
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posted January 24, 2015 10:16 PM |
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I'm pretty surprised how you jumped from Necro reveal to whining about Ashan. That takes some talent. Pointless, but pretty well-written.
But let be honest - that post wouldn't exist if Elite tier would have new models. So maybe, just maybe, the true reason of your rage lies not in lore, but in something else... Aaaand you just used an excuse to start another "scrap Ashan".
But as I said, well-written. Pretty good job.
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Let's play poker game, lich-style!
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted January 24, 2015 10:21 PM |
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Edited by Galaad at 22:27, 24 Jan 2015.
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Sandro400 said:
I'm pretty surprised how you jumped from Necro reveal to whining about Ashan. That takes some talent.
Is it that surprising? I mean, if Necro reveal happens to be what it is is precisely because of Ashan.
Quote:
that post wouldn't exist if Elite tier would have new models
Half of that post already existed in another place, and when I started to gain more hope about direction MMH7 was taking I deleted it. The link is pretty clear nevertheless.
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Sandro400
Promising
Supreme Hero
Shadow of Death
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posted January 24, 2015 10:25 PM |
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Galaad said:
Is it that surprising? I mean, if Necro reveal happens to be what it is is precisely because of Ashan.
Erm, if we had Lamasu, Lich and Vampire (tbh, Lich and Vampire are in 100%) with different models, there would have been almost very little rage.
Galaad said:
Half of that post already existed in another place, and when I started to gain more hope about direction MMH7 was taking I deleted it. The link is pretty clear nevertheless.
You misunderstood me. Your recent post here woudn't exist if they had created new models for Elite. And Ashan certainly can't ba blamed for that 
I know about your and some others' position towards Ashan. And you just used an excuse to restart Ashan hate thread which was "dead" for a while. I'm not "blaming" you though, you got that excuse on a silver plate actually.
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Let's play poker game, lich-style!
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted January 24, 2015 10:30 PM |
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Galaad said:
Is it that surprising? I mean, if Necro reveal happens to be what it is is precisely because of Ashan.
Nope. I have my problems with Ashan, but in this case, that's just a convenient excuse.
It's all about $$$. This is saving money, pure and simple.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted January 24, 2015 10:31 PM |
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Yes Ubisoft is so poor.
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supertommy
Known Hero
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posted January 24, 2015 10:32 PM |
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War-overlord said:
Nope. I have my problems with Ashan, but in this case, that's just a convenient excuse.
It's all about $$$. This is saving money, pure and simple.
Yes, it is. But in their pathetic statement, it's the lore and world of Ashan. Therefore the argument is that it's Ashans fault here (even if all of us know it's money/laziness).
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted January 24, 2015 10:34 PM |
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That's a fallacy WO and you know it. The ONLY reason we're getting this snow downed our throat again is because of the Ashan lore. We're not getting skeletal liches because Erwan doesn't want that. Simple as that. The fact that even the models are the same is because it's highly convenient, not because it nets more money to them. Arguably not if you're to consider the rage.
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Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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Wellplay
Famous Hero
Poland Stronk
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posted January 24, 2015 10:36 PM |
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Stevie said:
That's a fallacy WO and you know it. The ONLY reason we're getting this snow downed our throat again is because of the Ashan lore. We're not getting skeletal liches because Erwan doesn't want that. Simple as that. The fact that even the models are the same is because it's highly convenient, not because it nets more money to them. Arguably not if you're to consider the rage.
I agree with that statement, even Marzhin said the similar thing concerning skeletal liches.
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted January 24, 2015 10:38 PM |
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War-overlord said:
Nope. I have my problems with Ashan, but in this case, that's just a convenient excuse.
It's all about $$$. This is saving money, pure and simple.
Come on now, are you seriously suggesting sure Ubi-Nox and crew would willfully lie to all of us,
after all, just because he works for the same corporation which refused to add female models to Assassin's Creed multiplayer because it was "too much work", I'm sure he wouldn't try to BS us poor naive Might and Magic fans hue hue hue
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War-overlord
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
Presidente of Isla del Tropico
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posted January 24, 2015 10:38 PM |
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Galaad said:
Yes Ubisoft is so poor.
Yes and you stay that way by throwing money away. Besides, Erwan's private jet and champagne ain't gonna pay for itself.[/sarcasm]
supertommy said:
Yes, it is. But in their pathetic statement, it's the lore and world of Ashan. Therefore the argument is that it's Ashans fault here (even if all of us know it's money/laziness).
If you know it's money, then blame the money. Blaming Ashan just makes it look like you accept the scapegoat.
[tinfoilhat]I think this is all an ellaborate ruse to make us hate Ashan even more. So next game they can pull a Heroes4 and take credit for it.[/tinfoilhat]
verriker said:
Come on now, are you seriously suggesting sure Ubi-Nox and crew would willfully lie to all of us,
No, like I said. Saying that the game isn't underbudget doesn't have any inpact on things like this if you plan to do it from the start.
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Vote El Presidente! Or Else!
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supertommy
Known Hero
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posted January 24, 2015 10:40 PM |
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War-overlord said:
If you know it's money, then blame the money. Blaming Ashan just makes it look like you accept the scapegoat.
I blame the money, I just pointed out why people are arguing here. I happened to quote you for truth ( ), and to add the point of Ashan lore statement to Sandro400 vs Galaad discussion.
I called that statement bullsnow the first second I saw it.
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Sandro400
Promising
Supreme Hero
Shadow of Death
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posted January 24, 2015 10:47 PM |
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OMG the chain reaction started How can you know what Erwan wants or not? I said this many times, we might get skeletal liches in a game set after H5. Hell, we haven't seen Archlich yet!
The reason of reusing models is $. Plain and simple. We even get rid of all-over green.
And yeah, do you really think that majority of fans support you there? Or even the M&M team itself? If Erwan and his Ashan project would've been so unpopular as you make it, he would have been fired already. Even Marzhin in the interview said that he thinks that his teamwork with Erwan is going pretty well and acknoledges that Ashan is becoming better
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Let's play poker game, lich-style!
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verriker
Honorable
Legendary Hero
We don't need another 'eroes
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posted January 24, 2015 10:49 PM |
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Edited by verriker at 22:49, 24 Jan 2015.
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War-overlord said:
No, like I said. Saying that the game isn't underbudget doesn't have any inpact on things like this if you plan to do it from the start.
I guess that depends on how we want to define what the "start" was lol,
I'm sure they didn't see themselves reusing Black Hole's models for the next eight years back when they started on Heroes 6,
but then again I'm sure they didn't see themselves swallowing those devs up into a black hole of their own either hue hue hue
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This thread is pages long: 
