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Heroes Community > Heroes 7 - Falcon's Last Flight > Thread: Dungeon ~ Inferno
Thread: Dungeon ~ Inferno This thread is 11 pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 · «PREV / NEXT»
Lokheit
Lokheit


Known Hero
posted September 27, 2014 10:11 PM

Given how Ashan dark elves copy a lot of stuff from Warhammer's dark elves (I'd say even more than from the original D&D drows despite the society being closer to drows), maybe they could go with the concept of the last edition of the dark elves army book, where there are medusas that are sorceress under a curse (kind of like forgotten realms dryders but on medusa form) and there you got it, medusas again in dungeon. They could even have a weaver like mechanic to change forms from matriarch to medusa or something.

I'd like to see minotaurs, medusas and hydras all comming back, split between core and elite. Black dragons and faceless as the dual option for champion creature (faceless are direct rivals of angels, so I'd prefer them over hydras as champions, specially given how bad hydras did the last time they had to compete with black dragons for a spot).

After that, fill the blanks with some dark elves, scouts, lizard riders, matriarchs (if medusas are core, maidens if medusas are elite)...

Even take one of them and put the shadow lurker/beholder there.

Something like this could be cool:

Core:

- Scouts
- Maidens
- Beholder

Elite:

- Medusa
- Minotaur
- Hydra

Champion:

- Black Dragon
- Faceless

Not elf overpopulation, just enough to represent the race with 2 and a half representatives.

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RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted September 27, 2014 10:12 PM

ChrisD1 said:
RMZ1989 said:
As some other guys, I also liked H6 Dungeon lineup a lot. Of course, it was way too purple, but design was good.

If we are having Dungeon in H7, I wouldn't mind having the same lineup with addition of Hydras as champions, minus the purple.

the faceless should be the champion! PERIOD!

No, it really shouldn't. It was a elite in H6 and they almost got extinct. The last thing they need is to put them as champion units. If we have Faceless at all, it should stay as elite strike and return unit with casting abilities that is also a bit more fragile than other elite units.

And yes, I realize that we are arguing over opinions and that this conversation is pointless.
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verriker
verriker


Honorable
Legendary Hero
The Catch Erwin Erwin The Rye
posted September 27, 2014 10:12 PM

Raelag84 said:
First off, I am going to go on a limb and say that dark elves were a troupe before warhammer.  

Secondly. Heroes 5 dungeon was a blast to play. I enjoyed playing with h5 dark elves for years and still do. The h6 dark elves I don't even want to touch, though to be fair, gameplay in h6 in general was just not as fun as it was in h5. Factions were just less immerse.

Thirdly and most importantly, h6 dungeon didn't make the old guard happy. In fact H6 brought back many things from H3, and to be honest, die hard H3 fans are still unhappy. So what's the point?

For all it's faults Ashan should be Ashan.


like Avirosb says, in H5 they got the exact same purple, gold and black color scheme, the exact same dress style and armor motifs, the assassins are the same, the war hydras are the same, the raptor riders are the same, the matriarchs with whips are the same, and Raelag and Sinitar are clearly based on Malekith

it was a carbon copy. there might have been a bit of Dungeons and Dragons influence, but one thing's for sure, it wasn't original at all lol

the most creative idea was to enslave the minotaurs, but even that sucked IMO because we lost out on having badass minotaur heroes

and to be fair, it takes more than getting one faction mostly right to please "die hard H3 fans", I mean having a game with good AI, no bugs, a working map editor and other very basic fundamentals would be a decent start lol

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ChrisD1
ChrisD1


Supreme Hero
posted September 27, 2014 10:16 PM

RMZ1989 said:

No, it really shouldn't. It was a elite in H6 and they almost got extinct. The last thing they need is to put them as champion units. If we have Faceless at all, it should stay as elite strike and return unit with casting abilities that is also a bit more fragile than other elite units.

And yes, I realize that we are arguing over opinions and that this conversation is pointless.


I was going to say the same thing. I haven't played the H6 dungeon thing. and it's just my preference that makes think that faceless is most suitable as a champion. their lore makes me think that. they are like angels but of darkness.
it's like seeing seraph as an elite unit.
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Galaad
Galaad

Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
posted September 27, 2014 10:16 PM
Edited by Galaad at 22:17, 27 Sep 2014.

Verriker said:
and to be fair, it takes more than getting one faction mostly right to please "die hard H3 fans", I mean having a game with good AI, no bugs, a working map editor and other very basic fundamentals would be a decent start lol

This kind of posts with Erwan smiling as avatar. Pure gold

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Avirosb
Avirosb


Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
posted September 27, 2014 10:23 PM

I genuinely like Erwan in spite of him being the lead visionary of Ashan.

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EPICUSDOOMICUS
EPICUSDOOMICUS


Known Hero
posted September 27, 2014 10:24 PM
Edited by EPICUSDOOMICUS at 22:27, 27 Sep 2014.

Protolisk said:
Alex_Yakub said:
Raelag84 said:

All do respect, No.

Seriously, the dark elves are not going to be H3 dungeon ever, so please just leave it alone.

This


Um...

H6 Dungeon was the closest I've seen to H3 Dungeon. Minotaur, Dragon, Mantiocre, lower level Eyeball shooter (beholder/lurker) Strike and Return unit (faceless/harpy) along with another shooter (Stalker/Medusa) and a low level melee unit (assassin/troglodyte.) Sure, our assassin wasn't a blind frog lizard thing and our other shooter wasn't a snake lady, but it was close, and many of the roles were similar. It felt very much like H3 Dungeon, to me, except that Sanctuary had dibs on snake people, Stronghold on bird ladies, and Troglodytes are pretty dumb over all. (Lizards with a stick instead of eyes, yay!)

Though I'd prefer Dungeon have a bit more Minotaur influence (So many Minotaur Heroes in H3, while Minotaurs seemed to be slaves in Ashan, though H6 seemed to be changing this), H6 was a pretty good update for Dungeon, all things considered.

Yes, H6 was a pretty good update for Dungeon, all things considered, and YES, Troglodytes are pretty dumb over all! Bust'em at all costs!!
Dungeon is one of my personally favorite factions since H3 and troglodytes has been the only thing that spoils-at a certain amount- the joy. Completely useless...
Edit: Oh and drop the lizard riders idea, too. If you have a blank unit position you want to fill, bring lizards back but without the riders
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Avirosb
Avirosb


Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
posted September 27, 2014 10:57 PM

EPICUSDOOMICUS said:
Dungeon is one of my personally favorite factions since H3 and troglodytes has been the only thing that spoils-at a certain amount- the joy. Completely useless...
Edit: Oh and drop the lizard riders idea, too. If you have a blank unit position you want to fill, bring lizards back but without the riders
And make them bipedal, blind and give them a stick

Rest assured that if the Troglodytes had made a return,
they would've gotten a makeover and super-special awesome super-powers like the rest of 'em.

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Raelag84
Raelag84


Famous Hero
posted September 28, 2014 01:12 AM

Avirosb said:
Raelag84 said:
First off, I am going to go on a limb and say that dark elves were a troupe before warhammer.
Yep, purple attire, riding on raptors and taming hydras, you name it.


Don't be sarcastic with me. The other factions aren't exactly original ether. The whole point of Might and magic is to be a compendium of fantasy tropes after all.  

@everyone else (pretty much).

Well I am shocked that you guys are happy with something that Ubisoft has done. This is certainly news to me. Still fair is fair.

I am going to miss my "warhammer" dark elves, but if you guys are finally happy with something I guess I can't say boo. However...

Ubisoft clearly listens to you guys. Don't ever try to say otherwise.

P.S. I think you guys are talking about a different warhammer than I am thinking of.  I thought it was a video game that took place in outer space. I remember orcs, eldar, and space marines. don't remember elves.

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Stormcaller
Stormcaller


Famous Hero
posted September 28, 2014 01:49 AM
Edited by Stormcaller at 01:57, 28 Sep 2014.

There is Warhammer fantasy and there is Warhammer 40k- science fiction. 40k has Eldar that you mentioned, which are essentially space elves. While warhammer fantasy has dark elves, wood elves and high elves.
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Raelag84
Raelag84


Famous Hero
posted September 28, 2014 02:30 AM

Stormcaller said:
There is Warhammer fantasy and there is Warhammer 40k- science fiction. 40k has Eldar that you mentioned, which are essentially space elves. While warhammer fantasy has dark elves, wood elves and high elves.


Ohhh. Well reading about these warhammer dark elves I am a little disillusioned. They are not exactly the same, but they are pretty close. Dam. I surprised Ubisoft wasn't sued.

Still, having Medusa and manticore wouldn't solve the problem. According to this wiki page (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dark_Elves_(Warhammer)) the warhammer elves have those to.

To think, I wrote a whole fan-fic Novella about the dark elves.

Anyways, sorry to interrupt. Please continue ripping ubisoft to shreds.

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TDL
TDL


Honorable
Supreme Hero
The weak suffer. I endure.
posted September 28, 2014 03:18 AM

Elemental chains anyone?
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cleglaw
cleglaw


Famous Hero
posted September 28, 2014 04:50 AM

i hope devs will present concept arts at the start of voting.

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Danny
Danny


Famous Hero
posted September 28, 2014 08:30 AM

Dungeon by far. I just hope they don't pull the Black Dragon + Hydra champion combo again, that was so lame in H4!

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Avirosb
Avirosb


Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
posted September 28, 2014 02:40 PM
Edited by Avirosb at 14:40, 28 Sep 2014.

Raelag84 said:
Don't be sarcastic with me. The other factions aren't exactly original ether. The whole point of Might and magic is to be a compendium of fantasy tropes after all.
There's a difference between borrowing elements from multiple sources and carbon-copy elements from just one or two.
And I'll be sarcastic with precisely whom I want to, thankyouverymuch.

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Stormcaller
Stormcaller


Famous Hero
posted September 28, 2014 10:34 PM

Quote:
I just hope they don't pull the Black Dragon + Hydra champion combo again,


Ofc they will. Look at Sylvan. Treant, Phoenix and Emerald Dragon. They can either go with hydra and black dragon , or manticore and faceless.

And i really doubt faceless will happen.

Perhaps they surprise us with troglodytes?
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Kimarous
Kimarous


Supreme Hero
posted September 29, 2014 04:32 AM
Edited by Kimarous at 05:03, 29 Sep 2014.

I think one advantage to NOT including Inferno is the fact that - and let's be honest here - Inferno, both as the faction and the environment, sticks out like a sore thumb compared to everything else. Sure, Dungeon is supposed to live underground, but if the overworld representation is designed right, the town doesn't look too out of place when smack dab in the middle of a different faction's environment.

Okay, let's take into account the known environments of H7: urban/fortification, grassy fields, forested fields, snowy fields, and desert. Let's also assume there's barren rock for Necropolis as well. Now let's assume that the Dungeon town looks like its H6 depiction. It doesn't look too out of place in that snowy landscape, does it? It could work in the desert, in grassy fields, in barren rock... and its troops could fight any of the other factions in any of those landscapes without feeling awkward.

Inferno, though? A floating volcanic mass most certainly looks out of place anywhere but its natural volcanic environment. And that faction-necessitated environment? Tell me, how awkward is it to see the Sylvan troops of the forest duking it out with Academy's constructs in the middle of Mount friggin' Doom? Or a Haven town surrounded by Mordor?

Yeah, I thought so. Point goes to Dungeon.

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Stormcaller
Stormcaller


Famous Hero
posted September 29, 2014 11:33 AM

And you even have an avatar of pit lord. Shame on you.
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What makes a King? Some say it is a birthright, while others call it a destiny.

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RMZ1989
RMZ1989


Supreme Hero
posted September 29, 2014 11:36 AM
Edited by RMZ1989 at 11:38, 29 Sep 2014.

You could say the same for Fortress, or Sylvan, or Stronghold, or...

I understand what you are saying, but I don't think that giant crater from H5 Fortress belongs in desert, especially because their whole race looks like a snowy mountain race. Desert Orcs(I am pretty sure that their town will look really close to H3 Stronghold) won't belong to the forest environment, and I can't imagine Sylvan's beautiful and warm jungle with huge tree in the middle being in the desert or mountain environment.

Heroes will always have that, you just have to get used to it. So yeah, Inferno does stand-out from some of those environments, but the difference between them and some other towns isn't that big at all.


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VOKIALBG
VOKIALBG


Honorable
Legendary Hero
First in line
posted September 29, 2014 11:52 AM

IS this officialy the next voting?
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