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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 20, 2015 08:47 AM |
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the word "war", especially world war, is far too extreme a word to use for some random and sporadic terrorist attacks. infiltration and occupation are the words you're looking for, when talking about syrian muslims spreading into different countries.
a "war on terror" isn't a world war, at least not in the sense that you and elodin mean. you're using the lighter phrase, that is usually accompanied with the "war on drugs", or the "war on hunger".
the last two world wars we had, were on a much larger scale, and military force was used in gargantuan amounts, on groups of countries. you're only talking about muslim extremists, which aren't snow compared to the military force of the world. even if every country let down their defenses with these guys, there's only so much damage they could do. they'd have to have access to those countrys' massive weapons, to be any real threat at all. as it is, they are just a group of people who are allowing the noose to be tightened on "civilized" countries public masses, by their governments. they can only spread terror, and they win, if whoever they attack allow themselves to BE terrorized.
that won't lead to destruction of any country: it will only lead to a "1984"-ish state of existence; which is the destruction of freedom, and not lives. freedom that is illusory anyway.
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 20, 2015 09:05 AM |
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I am not talking about terrorist attack, for me those "terrorists" only retaliate to what we triggered in their homeland. Sure the population is afraid about this, because most of people are brainwashed and didn't realize we were already at war, from the moment we dropped the first bomb in Irak or Syria. They think those are good bombs, and nobody gets killed by except bad guys, like in video games.
I am talking about the migratory invasion those wars will create (it is already active). They will have the same effect as a military war, a foreign culture replaces the one existing, by slow erosion and dilution.
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markkur
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
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posted November 20, 2015 09:30 AM |
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Elodin said:
The only nation ever known as Palestine is Israel. You could move all of the Jews out of the middle east and terror would not stop.
By that thinking American Indians have the right to America and about a quarter of me can stay and the other 3/4ths has to leave. No use going back in time for present day problems.
After what happened to the Jews during WWII giving them a state was not a bad idea. What was a bad idea was to not do the same for the Arabs that were displaced. Wrong never makes right.
What you are not wanting to see is that the radicals BEGAN this mess using this excuse. Remove the cause and maybe the "base" will soften instead of strengthen...as it has for 80 years now.
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fred79
Disgraceful
Undefeatable Hero
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posted November 20, 2015 10:00 AM |
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@ sal: i don't think any of us will still be alive to ever see the end result of this cultural degradation that you think of.
that said, "civlized' societies nowadays are mostly weak, because they have lived a lie, this illusion(and all that encompass it) called modern society(where everyone can be safe; justice is always fair; everyone is equal; and the media, corporations, and government care for you). it may not take as long to lock down today's delusioned citizens, given that control over an ever-growing population across the globe is tantamount to keeping and maintaining that control as humans, worldwide. i'm sure our leaders wouldn't want things to fall into TOO much disarray. that could be counterproductive for them. or maybe they don't even care about that; who knows, really.
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Elodin
Promising
Legendary Hero
Free Thinker
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posted November 20, 2015 11:19 PM |
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markkur said:
After what happened to the Jews during WWII giving them a state was not a bad idea. What was a bad idea was to not do the same for the Arabs that were displaced. Wrong never makes right.
There is nothing that I am not wanting to see but perhaps there are facts that you so not know.
The Jews did not steal the land back nor were they given the land back. They bought it back.
Stolen land?
Quote:
The Baghdad Caliphate gave way to the Ottoman Empire. By 1886, the Ottoman Turks still ruled the land, but had let it decline to desert and swamp. In that year, the first Jews started to buy the land back. The Ottomans at first sold it willingly, because they did not think that anyone could make the land fertile again. The Jews proved otherwise. That’s when the trouble began.
Jews bought the rest of the land that would become Israel in the same way. The Jewish National Fund bought its first parcels in 1903. Baron Benjamin de Rothschild bought his first land earlier, when settlers from the First Aaliyah, at Rishon-le-Zion, asked him to. (In 1900, he gave his lands away to the Jewish Colonization Association.)
As they did in the Golan Heights, the Jews planted trees and developed new irrigation methods to reclaim the land. They bought the land from absentee Ottoman landlords, and in many cases hired the Arab tenants to work for them.
The Golan Heights
The Jewish Virtual Library also shows that Jewish organizations had bought land in the Golan Heights and farmed it as recently as 1947. In that year, French Mandatory Syria became independent Syria. Syrian armies immediately chased the Jews off the land. The only reason that Syria “owned” it was that the British traded it away to the French in 1923.
Israel would finally take the land back in the 1967 War. Your editor has seen it since. Before, it was mostly desert, except for the eucalyptus trees that the Syrians planted around their bunkers. Now it is as fertile as it ever was.
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Revelation
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Hadji020
Adventuring Hero
The Underestimated
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posted November 21, 2015 12:50 AM |
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Do some research on Sabbatai Zevi, which explains why the land was sold by the Turks.
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.::True Rebels Walk Alone::.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 21, 2015 12:26 PM |
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What has that got to do with anything? The sultan selling some land to some rich guy... That was way before Israel (1948) and even before WW1, in which the empire and it's rule over that territory was gone anyway. Nobody claims they didn't buy any land, the settlements that create the problem have nothing to do with this at all and Israel is found guilty by international law in the matter, the international law which does recognize it as a state. A state occupying land and some individual buying it long before that state even existed are irrelevant matters and you cant determine the law on some land just because you buy it, I can buy land from Germany, doesn't mean I can break the law and throw away the Polizei when they come knocking.
My advice would be not to get your facts from some place as openly biased as "Conservative News and Views" in the first place.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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antipaladin
Promising
Legendary Hero
of Ooohs and Aaahs
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posted November 21, 2015 03:58 PM |
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 21, 2015 04:11 PM |
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antipaladin said:
some facts
Quote:
Fact: Israel is the only country in the world that entered the 21st century with a net gain in its number of trees.
Ah okay, then I have no longer any objection on the subjects discussed previously. Nature prevails.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted November 21, 2015 04:40 PM |
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antipaladin said:
some facts
Nobody's claiming Israel is a worse place to live compared to Arab countries or it's less enlightened than them, so I think some of that list is irrelevant. Number 10 is relevant though, "a nation state" is a relatively new concept and historically, there had not been a Jewish state in the modern sense either, both Arabs and Jews lived in those lands and who should live in exactly which part is the issue today. Most of what embodies today's conflict started out with your expansion in the 1967 war as far as I know. And when that issue is carried out to UN, the results are not in your favor.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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antipaladin
Promising
Legendary Hero
of Ooohs and Aaahs
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posted November 21, 2015 05:45 PM |
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@sal i stoped taking your antisemitic nonsense seriously years ago.
@artu Well, we didn't start the 67 war, on which winning grounds was taking bigger part of Jerusalem back to jewish lands.
As for the un. Nobody cares about a group of dual standard incompetend fools.
UN resolution 242 (1967) assumed Israel would administer the territories until Arab countries were willing to negotiate new, more secure borders, as Egypt did in 1979 and Jordan did in 1994. Unfortunately, Arab leaders have rejected every Israeli offer of peace and territorial compromise and have delayed continuing negotiations to determine borders. In the meantime, terrorists in the area continue to threaten Israeli civilians, forcing Israel to maintain its security activity throughout the area as agreed upon in the Oslo accords.
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types in obscure english
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted November 21, 2015 06:07 PM |
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How convenient, individuals not agreeing with Israel politics = antisemitic. International organizations not agreeing on Israel politics = incompetent fools.
And in the mean time you keep copy/pasting entire paragraphs from zionist propaganda, trying to mislead us. No thanks, have enough of that.
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markkur
Honorable
Legendary Hero
Once upon a time
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posted November 21, 2015 06:20 PM |
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I give up. The most basic of logic is dismissed.
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antipaladin
Promising
Legendary Hero
of Ooohs and Aaahs
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posted November 21, 2015 07:18 PM |
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The same logic is upon you sal. You call it zionist propaganda.
i call you antisemitic because you bash the sole existence of israel rather it politics alone. I have heard meny sterotypes regarding romania. I do not judge by them. That is the diffrence between us.
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types in obscure english
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Hadji020
Adventuring Hero
The Underestimated
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posted November 21, 2015 07:40 PM |
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markkur said:
I give up. The most basic of logic is dismissed.
Aye. World War 3 will settle things one way or the other.
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.::True Rebels Walk Alone::.
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Corribus
Hero of Order
The Abyss Staring Back at You
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posted November 22, 2015 03:48 AM |
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Thread (somewhat) cleaned.... although I feel I should delete more.
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I'm sick of following my dreams. I'm just going to ask them where they're goin', and hook up with them later. -Mitch Hedberg
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Drakon-Deus 
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted November 23, 2015 12:30 AM |
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This place has become a mine field, but I'll just say this:
Like many others, I was repeated the lie about how "evil" all Jews are and that Christians can never ever get along with them, or with Muslims and so on.
When I finally stopped taking others' opinions completely as fact, I realised that antisemitism is just another form of specific hate, like hating all Muslims, or all Christians, or Catholic Christians, or ethnic Germans, or all Russians or all ex-Soviet state peoples, or Italians, Romanians, or Polish, or British, or Irish, or Gypsies, or all Americans, or Democrats, or Republicans, or all from the American South, or Mexicans, or South Americans, or all Asians, or all Africans, Australians, West Europeans, homosexuals, wiccans, goths, et cetera. And I don't want any of that in my mindset anymore, thank you.
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted November 23, 2015 02:20 AM |
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Does this mean Mussolini is no longer one of your role models?
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"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."
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Drakon-Deus
Undefeatable Hero
Qapla'
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posted November 23, 2015 04:08 PM |
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Blizz - He spoke too much and did too little, not to mention that his idea of patriotism does not sit well with me now. and there was that little thing about absolute power which corrupts absolutely. And supporting absolute power made me act like a jerk, I think you agree. 
To be honest, I think all politicians are corrupt, only some more than others. But overall I am more for people who didn't fall completely into the "left and right" and were more moderate.
If you want a few names that I approve of, in general: T. Jefferson, Rousseau, Mazzini, Coposu, Ratiu (Romanian), the two Roosevelt presidents, Truman (still better than LB Johnson), both Eisenhower and Nixon ( beyond watergate), RFK, Reagan, Clinton (beyond monica), Rand Paul, Ben Carson hopefully for 2016.
And not altogether political thinkers, Mark Twain and Rene' Descartes.
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Zenofex
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Kreegan-atheist
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posted November 24, 2015 10:18 AM |
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Edited by Zenofex at 10:18, 24 Nov 2015.
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This thread is pages long: 
