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| Thread: Black Knight or Dullahan ? |  This thread is pages long: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 · «PREV / NEXT» |
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Rakshasa92
Supreme Hero
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posted November 29, 2014 04:43 PM |
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Black Knight = Copy of the Death Knight. IN EVERY WAY POSSIBLE.
Just like the Naga from HOMM3, was a cheap D&D Marilith ripp-off. (not that it was a bad thing, Marilith is one of the few things from D&D that is actually cool)
And get over the name Dullahan please, they even used it in Pokemon once.
All those D&D loving creatures would do good to check out PATHFINDER instead, so much better.
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted November 29, 2014 04:50 PM |
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problem with the (Dull)ahan is that is not scary. without a head it's completely non-thretening as without a head there is nothing to really look for. can't put it down in words, but it lacks anything making it even remotely creepy or scary.
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Rakshasa92
Supreme Hero
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posted November 29, 2014 04:59 PM |
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kiryu133 said:
problem with the (Dull)ahan is that is not scary. without a head it's completely non-thretening as without a head there is nothing to really look for. can't put it down in words, but it lacks anything making it even remotely creepy or scary.
Lol, you are strange.
No, a simple skeleton is scary?
A headless horseman was the source of all fear (together with black dogs) back then.
That you don't scare yourself by seeing them, is your problem.
In many games the dullahan has this flying head, that follows it around, like its a living creature that serves its headless body. The horse also looks pretty horrible and scary.
Everything about the Dullahan is more scary than a simple skeleton knight on a black horse.
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted November 29, 2014 05:30 PM |
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Rakshasa92 said:
No, a simple skeleton is scary?
A headless horseman was the source of all fear (together with black dogs) back then.
That you don't scare yourself by seeing them, is your problem.
In many games the dullahan has this flying head, that follows it around, like its a living creature that serves its headless body. The horse also looks pretty horrible and scary.
Everything about the Dullahan is more scary than a simple skeleton knight on a black horse.
realised what it is: it looks really goofy. can't take it seriously 
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LizardWarrior
Honorable
Legendary Hero
the reckoning is at hand
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posted November 29, 2014 05:45 PM |
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Rakshasa92 said:
No, a simple skeleton is scary?
3spooky5me
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Rakshasa92
Supreme Hero
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posted November 29, 2014 05:47 PM |
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kiryu133 said:
Rakshasa92 said:
No, a simple skeleton is scary?
A headless horseman was the source of all fear (together with black dogs) back then.
That you don't scare yourself by seeing them, is your problem.
In many games the dullahan has this flying head, that follows it around, like its a living creature that serves its headless body. The horse also looks pretty horrible and scary.
Everything about the Dullahan is more scary than a simple skeleton knight on a black horse.
realised what it is: it looks really goofy. can't take it seriously
You are goofy.
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Maurice
Hero of Order
Part of the furniture
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posted November 29, 2014 06:12 PM |
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Rakshasa92 said:
People that vote Black Knight are boring.
That's an insult to everyone who voted for Black Knight, you realise that? No one insulted you and yet you insult others? You only state a personal opinion, not a fact.
Quote:
Look with people like you the world will never change, we keep being locked with the same boring snow as always, mainly boring medusa, minotaur, harpy, zombie, vampire, werewolf, D&d snow, gobin, giant insects and other such boring uninspired crap that is easy to understand for people with lacking braincells.
For me it's not a matter of understanding it, it's a matter of accepting it. I am all for change - as long as it happens gradually, so yes, I am perfectly happy with a world that's for a large part static and conservative.
To completely redesign a faction from the ground up every game, with no rehash of creatures from previous games makes the game world unbelievable to me - for me, it breaks immersion. Also, a change has to be logical: why is a new unit introduced to the faction, how is it embedded in the general lore of the world as a whole? What's its function? Having a counterpart in reallife mythology makes it easier to accept it, depending on how popular it is (the more exotic a mythological creature, the less people are familiar with it).
Also, keep in mind that Heroes 7 is between Heroes 6 and Heroes 5 on the timeline. As such, a faction lineup doesn't only need to have a logical migration from Heroes 6 forward, but also allow for a logical progression into the lineup of Heroes 5. Once again, this has everything to do with immersion in the game as a whole and its lore. If you break that, you break the world in which the game takes place. Retconning should only be done when there's no other choice.
If you don't like gradual changes and would rather have more radical and experimental changes, I don't think this is a game for you.
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Rakshasa92
Supreme Hero
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posted November 29, 2014 06:29 PM |
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Maurice said:
Rakshasa92 said:
People that vote Black Knight are boring.
That's an insult to everyone who voted for Black Knight, you realise that? No one insulted you and yet you insult others? You only state a personal opinion, not a fact.
Quote:
Look with people like you the world will never change, we keep being locked with the same boring snow as always, mainly boring medusa, minotaur, harpy, zombie, vampire, werewolf, D&d snow, gobin, giant insects and other such boring uninspired crap that is easy to understand for people with lacking braincells.
For me it's not a matter of understanding it, it's a matter of accepting it. I am all for change - as long as it happens gradually, so yes, I am perfectly happy with a world that's for a large part static and conservative.
To completely redesign a faction from the ground up every game, with no rehash of creatures from previous games makes the game world unbelievable to me - for me, it breaks immersion. Also, a change has to be logical: why is a new unit introduced to the faction, how is it embedded in the general lore of the world as a whole? What's its function? Having a counterpart in reallife mythology makes it easier to accept it, depending on how popular it is (the more exotic a mythological creature, the less people are familiar with it).
Also, keep in mind that Heroes 7 is between Heroes 6 and Heroes 5 on the timeline. As such, a faction lineup doesn't only need to have a logical migration from Heroes 6 forward, but also allow for a logical progression into the lineup of Heroes 5. Once again, this has everything to do with immersion in the game as a whole and its lore. If you break that, you break the world in which the game takes place. Retconning should only be done when there's no other choice.
If you don't like gradual changes and would rather have more radical and experimental changes, I don't think this is a game for you.
I gave up on HOMM7 already, because I hate the world of Ashan.
My proposals, ideas and comments are mostly for a (hopefully all-new, changed non-ashan) homm 8.
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blizzardboy
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
Nerf Herder
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posted November 29, 2014 06:31 PM |
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Rakshasa92 said:
Black Knight = Copy of the Death Knight. IN EVERY WAY POSSIBLE.
Just like the Naga from HOMM3, was a cheap D&D Marilith ripp-off. (not that it was a bad thing, Marilith is one of the few things from D&D that is actually cool)
And get over the name Dullahan please, they even used it in Pokemon once.
All those D&D loving creatures would do good to check out PATHFINDER instead, so much better.
Yes. Because a warrior from beyond the grave was totally foreign up until Dungeons and Dragon came along 
4000B.C. just called. They said to stop plagiarizing them.
____________
"Folks, I don't trust children. They're here to replace us."
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Rakshasa92
Supreme Hero
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posted November 29, 2014 06:34 PM |
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blizzardboy said:
Rakshasa92 said:
Black Knight = Copy of the Death Knight. IN EVERY WAY POSSIBLE.
Just like the Naga from HOMM3, was a cheap D&D Marilith ripp-off. (not that it was a bad thing, Marilith is one of the few things from D&D that is actually cool)
And get over the name Dullahan please, they even used it in Pokemon once.
All those D&D loving creatures would do good to check out PATHFINDER instead, so much better.
Yes. Because a warrior from beyond the grave was totally foreign up until Dungeons and Dragon came along
4000B.C. just called. They said to stop plagiarizing them.
First there was Dullahan and the Headless Horseman, then they thieving devils from D&D came along in the 1970ties, they created the Death Knight from the Dullahan model, but like everything in D&D, it came out worse.
Then years later other games started to use the concept of a undead horseman, and because they couldn't use the name Death Knight (because D&D is such a greedy snow) they used similar boring names such as black knights, undead knights and anti-paladins.
Yes they all copied D&D, which copied the only creature from myth that resembles a undead knight, the Dullahan.
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LizardWarrior
Honorable
Legendary Hero
the reckoning is at hand
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posted November 29, 2014 06:53 PM |
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Didn't the black knight come from the Arthurian legends? Not necessarily undead, but definitely black
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Rakshasa92
Supreme Hero
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posted November 29, 2014 06:58 PM |
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LizardWarrior said:
Didn't the black knight come from the Arthurian legends? Not necessarily undead, but definitely black
No, it came from chess. :-p
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Zombi_Wizzard
Famous Hero
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posted December 03, 2014 12:58 AM |
bonus applied by alcibiades on 04 Dec 2014. |
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Rakshasa92 said:
No, it came from chess. :-p
No. Black knight was mentioned quite a lot in medieval literature, including in (yes, Lizzard_Warrior is right) King Arthur and Ivanhoe. In most medieval legends and literature, Black knight was considered knight, that fall from grace, fallen warrior, and was asociated with death. Basicaly it was evil knight, and his counter was lot of times White knight (yes it exists also). In medieval times all thigs were viewed from religios (cristian) standpoint, and one common theme was good vs. evil, god vs. satan, etc. And white colour was always associated with purity and goodness, while black was associated with death, mourning and sadness. This is so even to this day.
There are several theories as from where these legends originate, and possibly have more than one origins. One of these is that Europeans saw Moorish warriors (who had darker skin), and made them black knights in stories. Stories of how white (cristian) knight defeats black (moorish/arab/turkic) knight, are known, so this is probable.
Other theory suggests, that there were knights, who painted their banners or coats of arms with black colour, to symbolize, that they do not serve particular lord anymore. They roamed about, and served as mercenary soldiers.
Which theory, if any, holds any truth, i can not say, because im no such expert, nor do i claim to be. However, one thing is true, and that is that there were actual historical people who were known as "black knights".
- Edward of Woodstock, Prince of Wales - known as "The Black Prince", as well as the black knight http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward,_the_Black_Prince
- James Stewart, the Black Knight of Lorn - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Stewart,_the_Black_Knight_of_Lorn
- Zawisza Czarny - Polish knight who was famously known as "the black knight" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zawisza_Czarny
So again ... NO. Black knights dosen't come only from chess, as you sarcasticaly said, nor is your theory that it's derived from Dullahan or D&D somehow true. In fact Dullahan and black knight are completley seperate things, as black knight is not even (in most cases) dead ... or rather "undead".
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Stormcaller
Famous Hero
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posted December 03, 2014 01:32 AM |
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Oh god, no headless horseman please. That's boring and cliche as hell. Seriously, a knight without a head? Necropolis is supposed to be scary, not childish.
____________
What makes a King? Some say it is a birthright, while others call it a destiny.
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MattII
Legendary Hero
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posted December 03, 2014 02:09 AM |
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Tell that to the people that think that barely-animate bunches of bones can be effective soldiers.
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted December 03, 2014 08:22 AM |
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Edited by Avirosb at 08:27, 03 Dec 2014.
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Barely-animate bunches of bones with no morale and near limitless supply 
Quote:
Problem with the (Dull)ahan is that is not scary. without a head it's completely non-thretening as without a head there is nothing to really look for. can't put it down in words, but it lacks anything making it even remotely creepy or scary.
Glad that's not my problem.
Zombies, Vampires and Liches tend to be more goofy than scary and I still like 'em.
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kiryu133
Responsible
Legendary Hero
Highly illogical
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posted December 03, 2014 11:07 AM |
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Avirosb said:
Barely-animate bunches of bones with no morale and near limitless supply
Quote:
Problem with the (Dull)ahan is that is not scary. without a head it's completely non-thretening as without a head there is nothing to really look for. can't put it down in words, but it lacks anything making it even remotely creepy or scary.
Glad that's not my problem.
Zombies, Vampires and Liches tend to be more goofy than scary and I still like 'em.
eh, can't agree with that (except those sword-pires. they were goofy) due to presentation. as you said, limitless, walking dead who doesn't stop going for you is pretty creepy. and liches? skeletal, dark death-mages? creepy man.
headless guy on a horse? maybe it's just that MLP episode with the headless horse, but i really can't take them seriously. just no. not scary.
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Zombi_Wizzard
Famous Hero
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posted December 03, 2014 11:33 AM |
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Idk but to me goofyness is part of heroes games - I never considered any creatures particulary scary. In fact, in newer games i find their design as "too serious" for my taste. When i play H3 and listen to the sounds skeletons make when they walk it always puts smile on my face. In H5 they were even goofyer.
The only "scary looking" creature i remember was ghost in H1. Mostly because i was a child then. But still even then i foud them funny - how they fly backwards - hilarious!
In fact when H3 came along, and i taught:"oh, look at the realistic graphics!", at first they were too serious looking and didn't like'em much, but after i saw their fight and walk animations, all my doubts were gone, and i like how they look to this day.
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Rakshasa92
Supreme Hero
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posted December 03, 2014 12:46 PM |
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kiryu133 said:
Avirosb said:
Barely-animate bunches of bones with no morale and near limitless supply
Quote:
Problem with the (Dull)ahan is that is not scary. without a head it's completely non-thretening as without a head there is nothing to really look for. can't put it down in words, but it lacks anything making it even remotely creepy or scary.
Glad that's not my problem.
Zombies, Vampires and Liches tend to be more goofy than scary and I still like 'em.
eh, can't agree with that (except those sword-pires. they were goofy) due to presentation. as you said, limitless, walking dead who doesn't stop going for you is pretty creepy. and liches? skeletal, dark death-mages? creepy man.
headless guy on a horse? maybe it's just that MLP episode with the headless horse, but i really can't take them seriously. just no. not scary.
Yeah.
So a stupid walking corpse that even a small child can outrun is more scary than a freaking executed fae-man that is after the head of other creatures, which can break any barrier and open any lock, rides the most freaky of horses and which will bring doom with its words?
I'm glad i'm not like you.
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Avirosb
Promising
Legendary Hero
No longer on vacation
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posted December 03, 2014 12:54 PM |
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Edited by Avirosb at 12:59, 03 Dec 2014.
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kiryu133 said:
eh, can't agree with that (except those sword-pires. they were goofy) due to presentation. as you said, limitless, walking dead who doesn't stop going for you is pretty creepy. and liches? skeletal, dark death-mages? creepy man.
Not when you've played H2. Bleah! Blah!
Vampires are goofy, whether they're misplaced victorian artistocracy or bald, buckteethed batmen.
Rakshasa92 said:
So a stupid walking corpse that even a small child can outrun is more scary than a freaking executed fae-man that is after the head of other creatures, which can break any barrier and open any lock, rides the most freaky of horses and which will bring doom with its words?
Uttering words with no head, now that's silly
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