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Galaad
Hero of Order
Li mort as morz, li vif as vis
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posted December 14, 2014 06:09 PM |
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Actually only 5% of the fans were estimated of being anti-forge.
source
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adriancat
Famous Hero
Protector Of The Peace
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posted December 14, 2014 06:45 PM |
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Galaad said:
Actually only 5% of the fans were estimated of being anti-forge.
source
To me, Forge in Heroes 3 would have been the worst idea ever. Forge is like out of space, it has nothing to do with other Heroes 3 towns (think about Forge and Rampart, it's like you want to put together Heroes with Starcraft). So I'm glad that Forge didn't make it into the game (I don't like Conflux either, I for one would have kept the 8 towns and made a third upgrade for the creatures) 
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Fal-Parsi
Hired Hero
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posted December 14, 2014 06:46 PM |
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Galaad said:
Actually only 5% of the fans were estimated of being anti-forge.
[url=http://www.heroesofmightandmagic.com/forgetown/index.php?cat=interview]source[/url]
AI Guardians>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>dragon gods
So... what's the origin of Arch Angels?
BTW, I was talking about this[url=http://static13.cdn.ubi.com/respondez/EN/17192.JPG]Conflux[/url] in my previous post, though the confusion was intended. Then again, no chance for Duel mode in RoE HD, I guess.
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looom
Adventuring Hero
Flying High
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posted December 14, 2014 07:15 PM |
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As I said, this news maade me happy for about 1/54th of a second and then it made me sad xD It's not about being ungrateful - this release will just be unexplicably more inferior to where we stand in Heroes 3 right now: Era II and all that  + we all know what RoE is 
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Avonu
Responsible
Supreme Hero
Embracing light and darkness
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posted December 14, 2014 07:25 PM |
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adriancat said:
Forge is like out of space
adriancat said:
it has nothing to do with other Heroes 3 towns (think about Forge and Rampart, it's like you want to put together Heroes with Starcraft)
Yeah, it has especially nothing with Inferno. 
And if you didn't know Heroes of Might and Magic are (were) set in sci-fi universe. You didn't see that until Forge announcement, but all these "Starcraft" elements were on this world.
____________
"When someone desires information, they come to me."
"Details are everything."
Pipiru piru piru pipiru pi!
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sirironfist
Known Hero
King of the ogres
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posted December 14, 2014 08:14 PM |
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Avonu said:
And if you didn't know Heroes of Might and Magic are (were) set in sci-fi universe. You didn't see that until Forge announcement, but all these "Starcraft" elements were on this world.
Personaly I am glad they didn't release forge. Although I'm a fan of the Might and Magic series, I wouldn't like my Homm to have SiFi elements. And I know other people who think that way.
It's possible to spend thousands of hours playing Heroes 3 without finishing the campaigns once. Lore in Homm3 isn't that important for me - only the atmosphere. And the atmosphere is definitely not SiFi for me.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 14, 2014 08:31 PM |
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Absolutely beside the point.
The point is that NWC did a fantastic job developing HoMM 1, 2 and 3 - and suddenly SOME fans knew that same NWC guys would ruin the game with something they had no idea how it would have turned out.
That's MISSING TRUST. It's basically what the political version of Judas did. He was following - and then he knew better.
And THAT destroyed things - death threats, a rushed AB expansion, 3do asking full price for a standalone makeup expansion that SoD was...
Is it any wonder, that the design crew "destroyed" the old world after that? Tabula rasa - it's all new, period.
I mean, I was there. The NWC forums were such an exuberant place of happy gamers - until FANS changed everything, and after that nothing was the same anymore.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 14, 2014 09:14 PM |
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Edited by Stevie at 21:22, 14 Dec 2014.
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Pretty rich coming from an insider.
Avonu said:
adriancat said:
Forge is like out of space
adriancat said:
it has nothing to do with other Heroes 3 towns (think about Forge and Rampart, it's like you want to put together Heroes with Starcraft)
Yeah, it has especially nothing with Inferno.
And if you didn't know Heroes of Might and Magic are (were) set in sci-fi universe. You didn't see that until Forge announcement, but all these "Starcraft" elements were on this world.
I didn't knew that the Heroes games were set in a sci-fi universe until I've read it somewhere, from an outside source. My point is that the game in itself is not indicative of that, so the layman wouldn't know that according to the lore a Forge town would be ok, because they base their judgement on how the game "feels", and the atmosphere is fantasy and not sci-fi whatsoever.
____________
Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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blueskirt
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 14, 2014 09:22 PM |
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To each their own. Personally, Heroes of Might and Magic II was the last game that had a pure, heraldic, somewhat fairy tale, somewhat classic fantasy atmosphere I wouldn't want butchered by the Forge. The third game was, in term of graphics, art design and writing, so close to Might and Magic VI and VII that I can't help but consider it an extension to those game, and when they removed the Forge from Armageddon's Blade, Heroes of Might and Magic III somewhat lost its bite in my opinion.
Regarding the HD remake, it's a good news but at the same time, it's not for me, not until we know what will happen with the expansions, Chronicles, HOTA and modding capabilities (not just adding content to the game but also the possibility to pull off stuff like Infoaddict and other functionalities mods like in Civilization or Paradox's grand strategy games.)
I wish them good luck tho, because unlike other games in this recent HD remake trend, these guys have to compete with the original game, and it won't be easy topping what the original game offered.
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 14, 2014 10:22 PM |
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Stevie said:
Pretty rich coming from an insider.
Why's that, pray tell?
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 14, 2014 10:32 PM |
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Edited by Stevie at 22:34, 14 Dec 2014.
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Because you blame community involvement only to find yourself more involved than anyone else around here. That's how it looks from here.
I mean, I'm not dismissing what you said about ye old Heroes 3 times and the drama back then, I wasn't around. But applied to our times where the community does the same, voting for stuff, and you being an insider, so as involved as it gets... a bit odd maybe?
____________
Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 14, 2014 10:52 PM |
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Not at all.
I COULDN'T be involved. For what my "insider involvement" is worth, I never make comments from the position of an insider. You yourself asked why, if I knew that something wouldn't happen I discussed on the condition it might.
The fact that I'm an insider is meaningless with a view on HoMM 3, obviously.
And I'm no fan either.
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Stevie
Responsible
Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 14, 2014 11:24 PM |
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Edited by Stevie at 23:26, 14 Dec 2014.
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It's irrelevant yes, but it's not irrelevant now. Heroes VII is being made, Heroes III HD now too, and your opinion holds more power over Ubisoft given your status. Maybe you're not making insider comments here, but you're definitely doing so there. So, if community was to blame back then for meddling in NWC's business, who is it to blame now if not the same community? Even more so when there's more involvement now than ever in the development of Heroes. In which case, considering you still think that the community is to blame even now, it seems to me like shooting yourself in the foot.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
____________
Guide to a Great Heroes Game
The Young Traveler
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orzie
Responsible
Supreme Hero
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posted December 15, 2014 04:21 AM |
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blueskirt said:
To each their own. Personally, Heroes of Might and Magic II was the last game that had a pure, heraldic, somewhat fairy tale, somewhat classic fantasy atmosphere I wouldn't want butchered by the Forge. The third game was, in term of graphics, art design and writing, so close to Might and Magic VI and VII that I can't help but consider it an extension to those game, and when they removed the Forge from Armageddon's Blade, Heroes of Might and Magic III somewhat lost its bite in my opinion .
What if I say that h2 forge is in works?
No really, the sci-fi stuff appeared in MM1-5 as well, which are parental to HoMM1-2. The concept can be varied, but it's pretty much possible to invent. Sheltem FTW, he has an awesome concept combining fantasy style with the sci-fi background.
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artu
Promising
Undefeatable Hero
My BS sensor is tingling again
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posted December 15, 2014 05:18 AM |
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I dislike the idea of Forge, no matter how it can be rationalized. I think it would take some beyond belief genius to implant it without making it feel weird, especially after so many years when we all have this purely fantasy based H3 universe we are so used to. Back in 1999 or 2000, maybe I could adjust or accept it, had it been in the original game. But now, it seems extraordinary unlikely that it will feel H3-like.
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Are you pretty? This is my occasion. - Ghost
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JollyJoker
Honorable
Undefeatable Hero
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posted December 15, 2014 08:31 AM |
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Stevie said:
It's irrelevant yes, but it's not irrelevant now. Heroes VII is being made, Heroes III HD now too, and your opinion holds more power over Ubisoft given your status. Maybe you're not making insider comments here, but you're definitely doing so there. So, if community was to blame back then for meddling in NWC's business, who is it to blame now if not the same community? Even more so when there's more involvement now than ever in the development of Heroes. In which case, considering you still think that the community is to blame even now, it seems to me like shooting yourself in the foot.
Correct me if I'm wrong.
I correct you, since you are wrong. THEN "community" was basically something that was starting to evolve, since HoMM 2 had attracted enough attention to pull people to the NWC forum - and then HoMM 3 hit the shelves and things start to explode, since everyone knew right away that the game was something special (much in the same way as this is happening now in the AoW 3 forum). This lead to devs being discussing in the forums and, yes, even playing with the community. And it was in that spirit that they started to share things they had in store - more or less in the same way Ubisoft is doing it now, only less professional and marketing oriented, but, like, "hey, look at this, that's how we work." And then the sketches of the bare-breasted Naga Tanks hit the web, and everything went to hell, with a vengeance. I mean, those Naga Tanks would have never made the game BARE-BREASTAED, it were just sketches, but can you believe that only days later they got tons of mails from "concerned parent organizations"? That in itself wouldn't have been such a problem, but when they got death threats by people who didn't want them to "murder THEIR beautiful game", the devs simply closed the door, and that was it. The bosses decided to put the Forge on ice - it was more or less extortion, and so AB had to be completely redone in half of the time. SoD was supposed to round the game up - but 3do called a horrendous price for it, and it was clear that things were broken.
I'm sure, without that HoMM IV would have never become so radically different, but "It's all new, period" was more or less their reaction to leave it all behind.
THEN it was an uncalled for thing. YOu can't blame people to offer an opinion, but VERY obviously the devs who had done everything right up to that point would simply have deserved the trust that their vision would hold. But of course SOME knew better and didn't shy away from threats.
NOW Ubisoft themselves calls for community opinion. They need to rally the community and create positive feedback.
Believe me when I say, that my opinion doesn't count more than yours and this "insider" nonsense is WAY overrated. WAY. You should even know that - they aren't exactly yearning for "experts" to tell them what's wrong and what's right, obviously.
So there is no reason to envy people like me or Elvin, on the contrary.
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bloodsucker
Legendary Hero
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posted December 15, 2014 03:18 PM |
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JollyJoker said:
but VERY obviously the devs who had done everything right up to that point would simply have deserved the trust that their vision would hold. But of course SOME knew better and didn't shy away from threats.
Well, Community seems to really have evolved. I don't hear no life threats and "VERY obviously the devs" haven't "done everything right" or people would like H6.
About threats what I seem to hear is a whisper like "if you aren't nice to UBI they have the power to take something away from you". Well, they haven't. WoG is out for about a decade and since they are completly unable to get what replayability means they're new versions aren't something I'm craving for.
I don't want to buy a game to leave it in the shelf before I learn by heart the name of my favorite characters.
I've played Homm III for many thousands of hours and I'm now learning how to mod it, I think this says something.
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hcl
Adventuring Hero
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posted December 16, 2014 09:41 AM |
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Edited by hcl at 09:54, 16 Dec 2014.
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orzie said:
Voting is no more than a trick to keep the community active and to get rid of the responsibility of the taken decision. Also helps to clear the reputation.
If you think that the majority of fans know better than a professional game designer, well...
This is a quite ignorant and arrogant statement in my eyes. Most sucessful titles out there been designed with community on board. Designers listened to community wishes. id strongly recommend coming out of the cave and welcome the 2014 reality
Ofc theres always an against-example, but the majority of cases tells that involving community = success. It ofc depends on the size of a community. The bigger the size the better the results. Thats a derivation from the "wisdom of the crowds" rule. (ofc with it drawbacks too) You see, science is against you here
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Salamandre
Admirable
Omnipresent Hero
Wog refugee
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posted December 16, 2014 10:19 AM |
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Civilization series is a good example of what you say there-I don 't know much about others-. But what you forget to mention is that developers didn't make free polls everywhere, they went straight in the modding forum, looked and played the existing/done project then eventually hired very successful modders (see Kal-el) for next sequels. What is important here is not the yada-yada of lurkers, but the opinion of those inside the kitchen, because often they are the ears of the community. They catalyze the constructive opinions and are the strainer of the cranky ones.
This is to say that, over years, HoMM3 got some successful projects: HD mod, much improved editor, an almost complete professional interface now, possibility to tweak most of the repetitive actions and automate them, or this is widely ignored by Ubi. Personally I would have nothing against improved graphics if they are a bonus to what we have today. But a game-play huge step back for better graphical creatures, is a clear no for me.
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Steyn
Supreme Hero
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posted December 16, 2014 10:20 AM |
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Of the M&M titles I only played VII and only after playing HoMM for many years, but there I really disliked the SciFi elements. First you are walking around in a fantasy world and then suddenly you have to start playing around with laser guns. That totally broke the immersion for me, which is pert of the reason I never finished the game. Therefore I am glad Forge was scrapped. Imo it is better to have a next title set in a more steampunk age, than to suddenly introduce cyborgs into a fantasy setting.
PS
Yes, I know the Kreegans came from space, but at least they still looked like fantasy space invaders. Give them laser guns, rocket launchers and jet packs and you totally ruin the inferno faction.
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Can you make a faction including these units?
Join the Finding Harmony competition 2.0!
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